so I have pneumonia for the second time this year.
I’m on mtx, etanercept and pred. My first bout was in march, shortly after starting the etanercept, I thought I’d pulled a muscle for about a month and then it turned out it was pneumonia. Currently I’m a week in to the second bout (different lung) I got antibiotics from the gp but still ended up In a+e after a few days when first antibiotics didn’t work. I got home,because they had no beds.
I’m blaming myself for this , I think I’m working too hard and doing too much but I just don’t know how to get out of the cycle.
I feel guilty if Im not doing things and find it impossible to say no when I’m asked to help.
Im probably just feeling sorry for myself now. Words of wisdom appreciated.
I don’t know who else to ask.
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wilbertjellyfish
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The hardest time to say no is the first time, thereafter it becomes easier. Remember too, that if you are unwell you may become a burden to others, so you are not really helping in the long term.
Taking care of yourself is number one. Perhaps if others were made aware that you are just not able, they would stop asking?
I'm sorry if this sounds a bit challenging it isn't meant to be, I'm just being honest.
thanks for replying. I think one of my biggest struggles is why people who know you aren’t well as such and yet still expect so much..they tell you to take it easy then ask you to do stuff. Saying no once isn’t the problem but I’d be saying it repeatedly to the same people.
Many people just don't understand the systemic or ongoing impact of RA. Saying no to the same people might be what it takes ? If you keep doing things to help out, they are likely to keep asking ?
I echo this wholeheartedly and agree it’s hard to say no at first but it gets easier thereafter. You can’t pour from an empty cup as the old saying goes. Take care WJF and feel better soon. 💗
I really think you need to keep saying NO! to the people who keep asking, especially as they know you’re not well. I know it’s hard. Is it people at work or family? Is it stuff they want you to do within the working day or out of hours? If you’ve got a family are they pulling their weight or are you working a day job then doing everything at home after work? I worked with someone who had a rota where her teenagers and husband were each responsible for planning, shopping and cooking a family meal - she had the Friday and bought fish and chips on her way home from work. If it’s work could you make a list and when someone asks you to do something tell them to write it on the list because you are working through the list in order and there are other people in front of them ? Then take your time.
The thing is if you don’t make a stand then your health is really going to deteriorate and they are going to have to find someone else to do the things they are expecting you to do for them anyway - especially if you end up in hospital.
Great reply and idea re the shared meals/planning. If I get pushed by a manipulative person or they try to (but doesn’t happen so much these days as I’m still shielding) I say to the person .. no is a complete answer! 😝
I think one has to be very tough to the people who won’t listen and who disrespect you. I’ve had ... Well if you feel you have to look after your health ... re being invited to go to someone’s house where a family member had flu, 3 years sgo. 😑🤨 I said .. that’s exactly what I will be doing.
I was fortunate that I worked as a nurse, so my colleagues were much more knowledgeable. If there was a task they knew I’d find challenging, they would do that task and offer me an easier task like doing blood pressures. Is it possible you could say No I’m able to do that but I could do x for you, so you can do y.
If it’s particular tasks that you struggle with, occupational health are good at recommending adjustments, even if that’s taking more frequent breaks to allow you to continue.
I'm writing all this down to get it out of my head where it goes round and round. Please don't feel you need to read it.
Work is hard to reduce
1 it's my business
2 I've tried to get another vet to work with me, the one I've got needs her hand held and it's frustrating knowing your paying someone more than yourself to do less. On a plus point the nurses and other staff have on the whole responded well to more responsibility.
I'm a crap boss because I'm rubbish at asserting my authority and I worked before for demanding people. My work place is a happy one, we all like working there.
3 work is very busy and back in the summer I stopped taking on new patients which helped with the work load but made me feel awful turning away people who needed help. Part of that issue is we are the cheapest practice and I've a good reputation. The other vets have all sold out to corporates and their prices are criminal. Where I live a lot of people can't afford it and we don't have PDSA.
4 I have 5 children and only have child care 2 afternoons now. The oldest 2 kids one has a wee job and the other helps his dad on the farm.
You could argue I need the help more but listening to my husband moaning about how much he has to too/kids not helping/ being tired etc is a drag. Don't get me wrong he works hard but he has a traditional Idea of home life . He helps a bit in the house but the responsibility is all mine. Example asked him to put on vegetables the other night "what vegetables?" Despite me repeatedly telling him I don't care what we eat (he really cares) I'll always be expected to sort what we are having. He can go to the shop to buy milk ...but won't think to check do we need milk.
The younger three do have their tasks and on the whole do them. I try to get them to help more but I don't want to project my illness onto them.
I tried to get a cleaner but couldn't.
At the end of the day I'm the problem. I think I should be able to do all this stuff and I work from the viewpoint that people know I'm not well so if they are asking me to do things it must be reasonable and I should be able to do it
When I was a child my dad detested lasiness and I have a fear of being perceived as lazy. I didn't try that hard to get a cleaner because a part me thinks it's lazy to not clean your own house.
My mum died when I was three and I've always been strong and independent and I want to be a good mum and bring my children up to be good people and I don't actually know how.
You are an amazing and caring lady but definitely need more help at work and home and some relax time to help you. 💗
I see you from your bio you are self employed and have 5 children. Sounds like you’re the key stone. You must take care and learn to prioritise your health and well being or who else will run the business and household. I know to you this sounds counter intuitive but if you were unable to carry on ....... I don’t mean to be harsh but only you can allow yourself an easier life.
Try again to get help in the home. I found this made a lot of difference when I had (only) two children and a more than full time job with on call responsibilities. You are not superwoman but a frail human being.
I found not expecting my husband to help in any way stopped me feeling resentful which had added to the pressure. Are the children old enough able to follow a rota of jobs that they are expected to do each day (or there is a withdrawl of something they value)?
Look at the jobs you do - doing things like having a box at the bottom of the stairs to take things up in one go, don't iron anything that isn't special, never put something down, put it away.
There must be at least ten minutes a day where you do nothing but something you enjoy - lie in a scented bath, yoga relaxation, listen to a book/music, etc.
It will get easier.
You could message me privately in two years time if you are still looking for a hard working vet! I've a very hard working highly motivated (and rather over confident) vet student grandaughter who has just got her first class honours in vetinary science.
Dearwilbertjellyfish - hope you’ve got the stamina to read this
Wow, you have got a lot on haven’t you! Before I say anything else you are definitely not the problem! You are really hard working, I bet your clients and staff all love you. You’re just feeling absolutely rubbish at the moment and everyday life with five kids, a (dare I say it probably typical husband) and a busy job and life and your second bout of pneumonia are grinding you down.
I can see where you are coming from if you are a vet and more so if your prices are more reasonable that corporates. I was speaking to someone at Pilates who was saying she was trying to get an appointment with a very good independent vet (our vet when we kept cats) we both know and she said that it wasn’t possible and that the vet had an enormous waiting list of people wanting to join her practice. So a good vet is hard to find and a good reasonably priced vet is like finding hen’s teeth. It sounds tough but when people decide to keep a pet they really need to think about being able to afford a lifetime of care for it. Your practice sounds amazing and it’s good that it is a happy place - for them but it’s not that happy for you right now.
There must be something that can be done to stop it gradually killing you off. So if you have a happy workplace then you are definitely NOT a crap boss. I can imagine how you feel too about paying someone more than you pay yourself and then having to ‘hold their hand’. Not sure what you can do about that one - it’s one thing bouncing ideas off a colleague but another needing to hold your colleague’s (in this case your boss’s) hand. It sounds like you could take a leaf out of former vets book. She owns her independent practice - she sold out years ago but has now reopened - she is in her 70s and when we were using her she always seemed to have a steady stream of young vets from abroad. Actually it was exactly the same with another vet across the road from us - we had to move because the cat we eventually had just couldn’t travel in the car - it wasn’t far but he pood, peed and howled all the way there. The one across the road - first time I carried him round I put the basket on the floor and he puked out through the bars! I bought a cheap buggy and pushed him round after that.
Anyway, you need to be like our former vet and have a waiting list. Word will get out and hopefully you won’t have to feel bad turning people away.
Your farmer husband! Well farming is hard work and it must be a nightmare with costs of things like feed and fertiliser. We often talk to a nearby farmer - the cost of his fertiliser has rocketed up and there is an ever increasing herd of deer that roams over his land eating his crops!
I know what you mean about your husband too. Mine can do things but he needs explicit instructions and stands looking helpless which I find incredibly irritating. Plus the things he makes me think it’s my fault for hiding the things can’t find He also makes a mess - you know sticky hand marks all over the kitchen, he spills things or drops bits and doesn’t notice them. I’ve actually decided to tell my son that if I die before my husband then he needs to get my husband into a flat or a smaller house where housekeeping etc will be minimal otherwise who knows - he might become a hoarder.
Since lockdown we’ve been using ‘click and collect’ but could you get a supermarket delivery once a week? I joined a health group last year and one of the things we do is plan meals for a week. So on a Sunday night we sit and plan what we’re going to eat - I say we but I really mean I sit and plan. Then we make the click and collect order. That works well because if we make a double quantity we can freeze half and pull it out of the freezer when we can’t be bothered cooking or are tired.
Great that the younger ones have jobs and do them. Could your husband pay the older ones a bit to help him? I know it’s probably against his principles but that might work.
It would also be worth asking around to see if you could find a ‘treasure’ to work for you in the house. A cleaner is good although when I had a lady who came in I used to clean the house before she got there. It was a good way to get the kids to tidy their rooms once a week.
You need someone sympathetic who will not only keep things under control at home but who will be your Mary Poppins.
So look in the mirror and say out loud - I am not the problem, I am a wonderful, popular, hard working vet, wife and mother of five who isn’t well right now and who needs a break. Then take a tip from my mother who waited ten years to have me then had my brother 13 months later - she used to say she used to lock herself in the bathroom with a bar of chocolate to get peace and quiet - so go lie in a nice bubble bath with a book, a big bar of chocolate and a cup of coffee or whatever you like to drink. Good luck 💐
Thank you . I do think you've kinda nailed it understanding the trial's and tribulations. I do Asda delivery have done for years, I'm not great on the meal planning but we kinda eat the same stuff every week...unless I find something reduced in the shop. I've a well stocked freezer and definitely batch cook a lot.
I walk my dogs every morning for an hour it has saved my mental health and the one non negotiable thing is that. My husband for all his faults is in charge of getting kids out for the bus..I find this helps their independence as they know he doesn't have a clue about what they need so they have to be organised.
Im feeling more positive having spent a lovely day with the kids in the local town having hot chocolate and getting rid of stuff to charity. I've also bought a steam mop to make cleaning the floors hopefully easier.
I hope you have a lovely weekend and really appreciate your thoughts.
Glad you had a lovely day out today. I love having a sort out and taking stuff to the charity shop.
Lol about the kids and your husband. I can just picture it all.
Look at you - you’re already doing nearly all of my ‘bright ideas’. Great that you walk your dogs every morning for an hour - that’s a decent walk - definitely better for you than locking yourself in the bathroom with a bar of chocolate. I love walking - it is almost like meditation.
When you think of all you do - you really are practically Superwoman and the fact you’ve got a happy workplace is qute something tbe proud of. The trouble is you’re really not very well at the moment, once you’re over both bouts of pneumonia you ought to feel better in yourself. Keep warm and look after yourself.
Have you sat your husband down and told him that your pneumonia is directly related to you doing too much, not taking care of yourself and that ill health is likely to continue unless he takes more responsibility for doing things?
A simple meal once a week is not a lot to ask for and would be a good starting point from him. Remove yourself from the kitchen / house if need be whilst he is cooking. He will cope, and he will get better at it if you leave him to get on with it.
The steam floor cleaner sounds like something that he could easily do too.
It sounds as if you need to step back and let the others in the house just get on with it. They might not do it exactly the way you would, but hey .... your health is the most important thing, if you crash the whole family will.
Just because some of the older children have part time jobs doesn't mean they don't need to contribute to the house hold tasks.
Who will pick up the pieces when you are not able too ?
Thanks everyone for the all the help. It really has been helpful.
At the end of the day I'm my own worst enemy and I realise I'm the one who expects too much of my self.
I never understand why everyone else, especially at home, can't see the things that need done and just do them, but it's because they never have to do them. I don't want to listen to myself telling others what to do but I'm going to have to start.
As Mmrr has said I'm no good if I end up in hospital and that's what could easily have happened.
Again thank you and I wish us all a restful Christmas.
Something to think about...I don't mean to be preachy, but if I remember correctly you posted a while back about carrying the domestic burden in a large busy household, whilst working outside the home and having RA ? It sounds as if not a lot has changed ?
Some ideas:
Give everyone a household chore that is their responsibility, so you don't keep having to nag or request that the task is completed. Small things add up. If the task isn't done, sit them down and explain why it is important that xxx is done. By not doing it they are affecting everyone, not just themselves....and mum isn't well. That's it, no ifs, no buts, go and do it. Ask your husband for his support in this matter.
From the age of being able to manage my 3 children had to strip their bed and bring the sheet, pillowcase and duvet cover downstairs. When washed and dried I left them on the bed for them to make. The older ones helped the wee one with the duvet cover. The beds were not exactly to hospital standard (I was a nurse 🙄) but hey they were clean.
Each individual put their dinner dishes in the dishwasher when the meal was finished and also put something from the table back into the appropriate kitchen cupboard. No more than a few seconds of 'work' each, but saved me doing the lot. I wiped the table, surfaces and put the dishwasher on. Kitchen cleaned in 60 secs. It also meant that everyone knew where to find things, rather than asking me which can be draining when you are unwell.
Your husband could do wipe up and put the dishwasher on...and set the breakfast table...for the next day, and give you a tea / coffee whilst you grab 10 / 15 mins rest time after dinner.
I don't know if you do his laundry ? But a task easily passed to him, I'm quite sure farm working clothes , don't need to be exactly pristine. He will manage....and learn that these smallish tasks add up and can be exhausting for you. If he doesn't know how to work a washing machine I'm sure he will grasp how too very quickly. Show him once and step back.
I don't iron. I do have an iron, but haven't used it in years. If my memory serves me right, the last time it was used, my non live in partner ironed the dress I wore to my daughter's wedding for me 8 years ago. I'm not untidy in my dress. I look very respectable 😂.
Men , all men , no matter what their job or position in life are expected to be capable domestically in today's world. If you have sons their partners will most likely expect them to be skilled around the house, these skills are learned in childhood. If you have daughters they need to know it isn't their responsibility to look after men domestically, the confidence not to look after men is learned in childhood.
My SIL a 6 ft 4 in, rugby player is the most impressive baker. He does all the birthday cakes, traybakes etc and baked all his and my daughters wedding favours.
I'm doing the starter, my daughter the main course and my SIL a range of desserts for the family gathering on Christmas day. My son is prepping all the veg on Christmas eve, and making two dips to accompany the starter, my other daughter with her partner, are setting the table and clearing up. My own partner is driving my 84 year old mum home on Boxing Day, a 200 mile round trip so he has no cooking duties (😂). My wee grandsons will help their dad with the making of desserts something they thoroughly enjoy. The older one (4) can recite simple recipes...for pancakes, scones etc and they both enjoy stirring things. The Christmas tasks have been agreed for a couple of weeks now, we know what is expected of us as an individual. No one is left doing a lot, whilst others expect to be waited on.
My SIL wasn't a 'cook' my daughter sorted that out and taught him how to do a few simple mid week meals before they married. He has a small repertoire, bit is responsible for the their meals twice a week (she works 4 days, he 5, so she does the extra evening cooking, whilst looking after the boys). He does a very good chilli beef, which he cooks in large batches after their two young children are in bed (a 2 and 4 year old).
I've given these examples to try and highlight that in todays world. Women don't expect to do everything, work, look after the children, cook, look after the house....while men just work. I find it rather peculiar that a mans work is seen as more 'difficult' than everything you are being asked to do, even if you were healthy.
Remember too, sometimes you just need to give people a chance and not do everything for them.
Perhaps you need to just sit back, let others see what chaos occurs when you don't do everything?
What's the worst that can happen?
No clean pants for hubby to work on the farm, because he hasn't done his washing ? 🚜👖🧥
Hubby having to make tea and toast for dinner one evening when there is no dinner for everyone, because he hasn't made it ?
If he cares what he eats, as you say, then he needs to sort what he eats, not you. It isn't your responsibility to tend to his dietary wants.
Or
You being seriously unwell, your business failing, the financial fall out from that?
And home life completely collapsed?
Be confident, let everyone know what is expected of them and if they don't do it reinforce that there are no clean pants, no dinner .... whatever....because xxxx didn't do it.
Then make yourself a cuppa and go and have a rest somewhere quiet and let them sort ot out. The world won't end.
If you keep sorting things out, then you will be expected to keep sorting things out.
I know you are right. In fairness I don't iron either, the kids to do somethings and my husband isn't incapable of cooking. He makes a good steak I even made him decide if kids were going to school this morning when the bus didn't come. I need to more assertive that's for sure, I'm very guilty of just doing things myself because it's easier....most of the time.
I am currently sitting with my feet up because the child minder is cleaning the house.
I have taught the older kids to use the washing machine and husband knows too...
You are a lovely person who is taking on way too much and unless you offload some of this stress you will continue to get ill.
I've had pneumonia its no fun and as a vet you know what you are dealing with.
I'm just repeating what others have said but I would have a look at what could be contracted out to someone else ie cleaning.
Also I would think about the vet you employ, how long are they going to have their hand held for ? Maybe needs a kick up the bum (not that you haven't thought if this before its sure). Xx
Thank you. The other vet is older than me and just out of practice and possibly not as confident. I wouldn't necessarily say I'm confident but I can be decisive . When I said earlier I'm a crap boss this is what I meant, I need to be more assertive in explaining what I want. One of the nurses has been there from the start and to a degree gets away with not really taking charge, she should be doing more but we are working on it.
Perhaps this episode is the kick up the bum I need to explain that I expect more. I know they all care about me so I need to explain how they can help
I hope you're feeling a little bit better today (even with the bitter cold that has gripped the UK). I would urge you to reach out to our helpline team who are happy to chat and offer some sources of support and information to help you cope better with the RA and it's impacts on your life.
You can also sign up to our online self-management programme which you can dip in and out of at your leisure but which is designed to help equip you with the tools to manage some of the day-to-day of RA. Check it out here: nras.org.uk/selfmanagement/
I hope you find this information useful and wish you all the best. Should you require any additional information or support please contact our helpline on 0800 298 7650 (Mon-Fri, 9.30am-4.30pm) or email us at helpline@nras.org.uk
I'm feeling much better today, only walked dogs for half an hour this morning and went to work. Did some paperwork and came home. My child minder is here today and there are no swimming lessons so I've gotten her to clean a bit.
I'm taking pain killers which is a big help.
Thanks again to everyone for all your consideration. It's lovely to know people are here to help when you need it.
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