((This is a long post, I apologize, just really needing some support right now and thoughts on OCD medication.)) -
But, instead I decided to get up, get some paperwork together and call back places I need either more physical health appointments, mental health appointments, and school loan information.
And it all just turned out....not so great. I woke up with a migraine (I have chronic migraines and Occipital Neuralgia). Having 20+ migraine days a month is... something I’ve learned to accept. But sometimes it’s hard looking on the bright side of things.
After my colonoscopy on 4/23, they were supposed to schedule me for an ultrasound of the stomach, but I never heard from them. So I called them back. I have 2 papers that have an order for this by my gastrointestinal. But, they said I have no record of needing one, and will call back when they find out more info. -which, blah.
I also get ketamine treatment. The place I go to is under new management, and raised the price per booster $150 more than the regular price. I am currently unemployed, and cannot pay that much. But ketamine treatment has worked for me tremendously. It definitely helps with my OCD and panic disorder. I used to have around 5 panic attacks a day. Sometimes more. I could not function. Because having so many panic attacks, takes a big toll on the body, and also caused me a lot of depersonalization. -which would last for hours. And if you’ve ever experienced depersonalization, you know it’s not a place you want to be mentally.
So anyway, the new manager over my ketamine clinic, said he would keep working with me on MY price I’ve always paid for. All he needs from me are notes from my therapist and notes from my psychiatrist stating the things I’m doing, and the help I’m getting outside of the ketamine therapy, to insure him I am working on myself mentally, and not just going in to get high. Stuff of that nature. They both have emailed their letters about a month ago to my ketamine clinic, with the new manager not calling me about the cost of my treatment like he said he would. I’ve called multiple times, on different days. First, they said they don’t have any records that I ever talked to him or that he said these things, or that they’ve gotten any emails about my treatment from anyone. I called again today to try and directly talk to him, but of course “he’s not in at the moment”. I asked when he’ll be in, and the reply was, “I don’t know”. I am getting so fed up with this new management. The ketamine therapy from my last treatment is wearing off, quickly, as it usually does after a month and 1 week. and it’s taking a big toll on my obsessions/compulsions as well as panic attacks. I find it very unfair for him to be able to play with peoples mental health like this. And is VERY unprofessional.
I called a different ketamine clinic today that is closer to me, to ask about their pricing, how they work things, and what their plan would be for taking me in, as I’m in the “booster” stage of my therapy. He was a very nice man who answered all my questions without leaving me with more questions. Which is always nice to talk to someone like this, especially when it comes to mental/physical health. He said they try to beat competitors pricing. I told home my story, without naming the clinic I currently do treatment at, and he knew exactly where I was going, because he told me that this has not been his first call about this exact problem from this new management at my current ketamine clinic, as of this week alone. And it’s only Tuesday. As my current ketamine clinic raised the price up $150 more, the best they are allowed to do is $25 off the total amount, of the new price at my current clinic. -which again, I cannot pay for. I can’t afford this.
I’ve been crying for hours. Because, no, of course I don’t want to start having panic attacks daily, multiple times a day, again. That life is too much for me. The one I have right now, it seems I can barely handle. Also this means my OCD symptoms will increase dramatically. And I’ll probably have to start on an OCD medication. Which my therapist told me are very sedating and cause other problems. So, I’m thinking if they’re so sedating, May cause me more depression. As I talked to my psychiatrist yesterday, and asked for a depression medication “add on” he said it’s not the best option for me since I am back in a household that’s causing the extra depression. Which is true. So he said an add on, is not the best choice as long as I’m in this environment.
I just feel doomed. Ketamine therapy was one of the best things I’ve found for my mental health. And now, it’s like it’s getting ripped away from me.
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Hey, hope you’re alright. This sounds really awful and I’m sorry that you have to go through this bs, I can certainly relate to having to navigate the medical phone call maze, but obviously not like this. I’m sorry I don’t have much advice, other than to keep trying and get other people to help if possible.
Nah, this stuff really messes with me cause I go through the same thing trying to get a doctor who does erp for ocd, and I have basically waited months to start and like you said, I don’t want to regress. So yeah, it’s messed up.
I hope you can figure something out, no one deserves even a day of ocd or depersonalization. I’ve only had a little of the latter, so I respect that you’ve made it through that.
Thank you for your reply. I so appreciate this. Because I feel so lost, and when you feel lost, you tend to feel like you are the only one going through it. So I appreciate your reply. I will keep trying for sure. But, it almost feels hopeless now. Ya know?
That sucks you’ve been waiting so long for a therapist that does erp. Because we want to get better! We’re doing everything we can on our own, but for some people, doing things we can do on our own, is just not enough.
I totally agree with you on no one deserves OCD or depersonalization. No one deserves any mental health problems or physical problems at all!
So, do you take medication for your OCD? Or is therapy what you’d like to start with?
Yeah I get the hopeless thing, that’s usually the feeling that keeps me from trying and just wastes time,
Yeah it’s super strange feeling, I’m sure you’ve had too, of yeah just like being so ready to do stuff, but just capitalism and bureaucracy and whatever get in the way.
Thanks for asking btw, I usually forget to talk about this stuff and then it eats me up. I can’t regularly afford meds, also dealing with other health stuff that requires money. Plus parents won’t pay for anything cause they think I’m crazy and ocd is hogwash. And I was saving up for erp sessions (circa $140 per) before Ms. corona came to New York.
Oh yes, I know that feeling of wanting to jump at any opportunity that comes your way that could help, then either bs people come along, or the government just destroys the idea.
I’m sorry this eats you up!! You can message me any time if you’d like!! It can be a silly conversation or if you need to just talk and vent, I’m here for ya (: and eeek... I’m sorry your dealing with health stuff also. I am as well, but luckily I have insurance that has a $0 co pay, and it’s so nice. Because I’m unemployed at the moment. I wouldn’t want to work in this pandemic. And ouch!! That’s really gotta suck being in that environment with parents who don’t believe in mental health struggles. Although there are compulsions, I wish our skin turned blue or something to show physical effects so people who don’t believe, will believe. And jesus, $140 per session?! So do you not have insurance??? Have you looked into getting Medicaid?? That’s what I have. I got it because I can’t work due to mental issues and 0 income. You should look some things up online for it!! You shouldn’t have to do this all by yourself. 😐😐
New York huh? Wow. Thats a tough spot to be right now!!
Yeah thanks man, I'll definitely take you up on that, I usually forget how much it impacts me and it always makes it easier when you get other people's perspective on it.
Yeah, family is weird and it's fun because everyone in my household has some form of ocd, cause like genes and stuff, but yeah. I hope you don't have a situation where you get stonewalled in that way.
That massive figure is for the folks who are out of network, which in these parts are the only people who do erp for real. My family actually has pretty dope insurance, but my parents disbelieve about half of the conditions that I have, so I have to pick and choose which ones I get treated for. Your situation sounds interesting, if that's the right way to put it, I've heard from a few people who have that level of impact to their work functioning, but it had never crossed my mind. If you vouch for it though, I'll keep it on the backburner.
Yeah lol, people are dropping like flies in this county. The 9/11 comparisons are getting very tiring. But I'm graduated from undergrad anyways, so I was already sitting my ass at home applying for schools and stress eating, so not much has changed. Hopefully it's not so death-y where you're at.
Yes, I get some things from my family as well. But. Sometimes I do get stonewalled with certain treatments... like how you said with your parents, you have to pick and choose which treatments you get. That sucks that they don’t believe what’s going on with your mental health. That’s a tough feeling for sure.
So how old are you? Are you over 26? Cuz once your off your parents insurance, you should be able to qualify. If you have some sort of note stating it’s too hard for you to work at the moment, or something of that sort. It’s been some time since I applied, and have applied for many things so I might have that confused with a different application, but I do think you need to be off your parents insurance.
And your right, some of the therapy we actually need isn’t covered. I had the most amazing therapist for about 2.5 years doing EMDR therapy for my PTSD. I’ve never opened up to a therapist like that before, as this was much more trauma based therapy so you get down to every little detail. I would trust her with my life. Ha silly to say but 🥴🥴 I had to pay out of pocket for her as well. But I did that because she was so wonderful and I made a great amount of progress. Then, finally I was well enough, got a job, and only did med management!!
So as the therapy for ERP May not be covered, at least your health things could be covered and medications. Ya know? So you’d save a lot but only pay for therapy.
And yeah, New York is the highest case state right?? I don’t keep up with it anymore. It started to give me extreme anxiety. And Hahaha 😂 well, it’s kind of nice when things haven’t changed too much. And no, I’m in one of the more chill states. But, we still have it in most counties, mine included, but I only go out for health appointments. I don’t go into stores or anything. Maybe the gas station to get a drink but always wear gloves and mask while out.
I'm gonna be 22 in the summer, but yeah I'm planning on have a legit and health insurance-ed job within the year, so I can start to consider it. Tbh I'm not sure that it's at the level of keeping me out of work, thank Oz, but I will keep that as an option. I feel like I read somewhere that ocd and some of my other things are degenerative, so I'll keep a watch on that. But thanks, these are good instructions haha.
That's good to hear about the EMDR, not only that it you figured the finances, but that it make a dent in how you lived. Doing the more intense therapies, like I've heard ERP is, always sound like a trip, but I'm sure I couldn't be making a better investment. I'll make notes on all this for when I'm insurance shopping.
Yeah, that's a good habit of not checking, I stopped checking the stats this week tbh. I only go out to volunteer at a soup kitchen, otherwise I outsource to my mother. I'm lucky that viruses aren't one of my obsessions, cause I know loads of people in my online support group thing that are taking a beating right now. Thus, I try to be on the internet helping out as many of my fellow crazies as possible.
Oh well that’s nice then that you plan on having a job with insurance!! That will be a big help (:
And I definitely agree with the more intense therapies. I think it’s well worth every penny!! I’m sure it will be great for you and so life changing!
Yeah- just gives me too much anxiety. In the beginning of the pandemic, I was very obsessed. That’s all I did all day, was research and watching tons of videos. But about a month ago I finally stopped and it’s been nice. That’s good you stopped checking. It’s probably helped with anxiety a little? But that is sooo cool you volunteer at the soup kitchen. I’m sure your service is very well touched by many. And that’s awesome you help out others during this hard time. I try to help others as well, the best I can. I mean, we don’t learn skills just to keep em to ourselves! At least I don’t think... I think if you know good skills, share them to help other struggling folks.
Yeah, maybe you've hit that point too at some point where you're more willing to take risks and endure weird and energy-intensive treatments for stuff. But yeah, hopefully life-changing lol. And it's weird, I don't get too worried about this kind of stuff, it's more like personal human tragedy that gets me, and like people's individual stuff, which I guess is why I hate hearing about what's going on with your situation, and other people's. And yeah, help is always in short supply and I can't even pretend like I have anything better to do right now lol.
Oh for sure! My EMDR therapist is the one who told me about ketamine treatment and gave me research papers on it. I instantly jumped. I did a lot of research myself, then made my appointment in that week. Also, EMDR is also a very intense treatment. But was so life changing.
I feel you with not liking to see that others are in pain. You’re probably an empath, like me, and can just feel the other persons hurt while understanding their situation. — Haha! I agree. I mean, I’m shut in, I listen/read books, color, meditate and yoga, but other than that, I rarely have much to do. So why not be of service to others! Honestly, one of the better ways to spend my time...
Both of those sound really interesting, and tbh I've only heard of ketamine in the context of like abuse or whatever, but what are these two actually like to experience? I've heard that more immersive therapies help people access things in their head quicker, but I imagine there's more to it.
I wouldn't be surprised if I was yeah, I'm always like cringing when people describe their maladies or whatever. And it's totally a full time job lol, which is interesting cause I think women usually get pigeon-holed as the empathic, heart-on-sleeve carers, but I've definitely become more that way in the past 18 months for whatever reason. Yeah, for sure better than many things in my calendar tbh.
Yeah me too! I’ve only heard ketamine used as the notorious “Special-K” 😉 so I was shocked to hear this come out of my therapists mouth. She is very, very professional, and believes in the power of her work (EMDR). So it was just a shock to me that this was coming out of her mouth. And when I told my mother about this treatment, she was skeptical as well, because my mom is a drug and alcohol therapist!! Haha so weird dynamics were at play.
But EMDR, Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing, was... very strange to me at first. I went to someone in earlier years who claimed they did EMDR, but when I did this with this new therapist, no, that old therapist was certainly not doing EMDR... haha😆 Anyway- I was in the middle of doing CBT therapy when this therapist said, she thinks I need to try this EMDR treatment and switch over to this new therapist. And if I’m honest, I wasn’t too happy about it because I thought at the time that I already have done some EMDR, and it was just bogus. But, I made the switch. As she was explaining the EMDR process and showing me the tools we will use every session, (the light bar, the handheld vibrating devices, and headphones), I was laughing at her. I thought, NO FU**ING WAY is this therapy a real thing. As she was explaining her degree and how long she’s been in the field, I couldn’t help but feel sorry for her. Like, she spent soooo much time just to do this sh*t? As she was explaining her passion to me, this therapy, I just couldn’t help but laugh. But she took all my skeptical laughs very well. She seemed even more confident in herself the more I laughed. I laughed for almost a year while doing the treatment. It was just so odd to me, that by hearing beeps, and following a light bar that I’m going to get better?? From severe trauma??? Eeek. But after a year, I stopped laughing. I stopped laughing because I noticed how much my life has actually changed in such a positive way. My nightmares decreased, my flashbacks decreased, if flashbacks did come, I could better handle them without that old intense emotional response I used to have. I was also struggling with agoraphobia too. So with this, I was able to go out a little bit more! I actually had finally found some peace in my life, that I’ve never felt. I got jobs, I was able to drive on the freeway, (which I couldn’t for years), I was able to be in public, nightmare free (for the most part), and could handle my PTSD like my body manages to breathe on its own without me thinking about it. Literally- LIFE CHANGING. I did this treatment for about 2-2.5 years, then finally went on med management, where I’d only see her once every 3 months, and the psychiatrist would just keep prescribing my meds monthly as normal.
And I think it’s good for men to have this quality. Yeah, it’s so cliche to say women have it, but not all women actually do. And a lot of men have this quality. I’m very in touch with my spiritual side, and I believe we all (men and women) need to have the power of masculinity and the power of femininity. If that makes sense. We all need to be able to feel both. Okay- I know this is not a talk about spirituality, so I’ll stop there. But, empathy is a good quality to have! (:
Yeah yikes, that's gotta be odd hearing about it in that way, but also maybe to have a parent who's in related field and knows about this stuff? I feel like that could go either way, like either they find it easier to be supportive and understanding, or they just act like they know everything.
Lol I can see how you'd find it funny, I feel like a lot of medical stuff is just a collection of cartoon looking tools and monitors at some level. But it's cool that you found someone who legit did it, I don't know if you've had this experience, but it's super deflating to go around to different doctors or physical therapists who deadass don't really know how to do the thing.
That's cool about the nightmares and PTSD, I feel like I've only ever had minor bits of the former and none of the latter, so I can't say that I know either what the pain or relief of that would be like. If I can ask, what were those like for you, like on the day to day? I'm trying to get like movie and TV depictions out of my head when I talk about this stuff.
No the spiritual stuff definitely makes sense, and although I think/talk about gender a lot, I find it difficult to figure exactly which of mine and other's traits fall into either of those buckets. And it's hella frustrating because I don't know any women (or men tbh) who like talk about how they handle both of those sides, so it's cool that you incorporate that into what you do and stuff.
Yes, and my mom was very skeptical at first, because it ketamine has been around for so long and is a party drug/hallucination drug, But she supported me. And saw the great outcome and was impressed.
Oh yeah things therapists or doctors have are just crazy looking things these days. But if they work... Also yes, it’s hard when someone who should have knowledge tells you that they don’t know what to do for you.
So, my PTSD symptoms resulted in me maybe like...smelling a certain smell. And I would be triggered and instantly go into a panic attack. And maybe at the time, not knowing what triggered it at all. Or I’d hear a certain voice, or listen to someone else’s story, or sometimes it was just as simple as doing a meditation, and got triggered into a panic attack. It really just all depends. Which leads to the agoraphobia. I felt unsafe every where I went. Especially out in public. Because I can’t control who I may see while I go out. And having PTSD and panic disorder, you are hyper-vigilant all the time. You are not mindful of what’s going on around you, even though you use all your senses while being hyper-vigilant and notice every little thing. But in this time you’re feeling threatened. So, you’re not at peace. So it makes a huge difference. If that makes sense. Anyway- back to the agoraphobia. I don’t know if you’ve seen Shameless, but it’s a funny tv series and one woman has agoraphobia in it. As some peoples agoraphobia May look like that, that’s not really exactly how it is... I mean she obviously also has severe OCD about germs, dirt, and cleanliness... With my agoraphobia, I could hang out on the back porch, and be outside that way. I just had a VERY hard time maybe going on a walk. Driving got scarier and scarier as well. So, I couldn’t drive on the freeway. I didn’t go to stores or anywhere public. It was hard to even go to therapy appointments and psychiatrist appointments. I’d have multiple panic attacks before and during. But, as some symptoms let up, I gradually could go around the block. Yeah, I’d be in a panic state, but I’d still push myself. I started driving on the backroads more and eventually did so with no panic attacks. Then, got to driving on the freeway. Then eventually got a job at a beauty supply store which is open to the public, and had to go to the stores, and other public places. And being able to manage sitting in a therapy appointment. And so on...
Yes I’m very into being balanced spiritually and having the balance between femininity and masculinity. If you ever wanna chat about it, you can always message me. We can bounce ideas off each other’s heads (: hahaha
Okay yeah let me message you then, don't want to clutter this thread.
I can imagine it must be hard when something has worked well for you and then you aren't able to take it any longer. Man, that's really difficult and must be scary. Are you able to speak with your therapist soon or ask your psychiatrist what the best alternatives could be?
Well, I could call my psychiatrist, but I had an appointment with him yesterday. And I pay out of pocket for him because they don’t take my insurance, but, he really understands my situation. So, I don’t have an extra $125 to spare on another appointment a few days after one... if that makes sense. I totally agree that I should talk to him about other options. But, money is tight right now. Ya know? And my therapist is the one who said OCD medications are sedating and cause more problems like more depression and other things... so she thinks I shouldn’t be on them. But with ketamine helping a lot for my OCD, I just might need to got on one. I just couldn’t handle being more depressed. :/
I'm so sorry you're having such a tough time! I have had that depersonalization feeling before when I've been under intense stress and it's very frightening. And the various phone calls you've been making in dealing with your health care needs sounds incredibly frustrating. I wouldn't rule out trying a different treatment for OCD if you can't manage Ketamine at this time, though. I respectfully disagree with your therapist that they are all sedating. I've been on Lexapro for a number of years (30 mg/day) and have not found it at all sedating. When I first started it I felt a little nauseated, but that went away within a couple of weeks. What I have found is that it's made me feel calmer and more positive. No other side-effects at all. This is an antidepressant, but at higher than normal doses it can be used very successfully for OCD. I would get a second opinion on whether meds other than Ketamine are sedating. Maybe discuss with your psychiatrist or with a pharmacist. I'm an RN and believe pharmacists know more about medications than anyone. Best of luck.
Thanks for your reply! Yes the feeling of depersonalization is no fun...
And good! I’m so glad to hear that you disagree with my therapist! Haha because I honestly felt soo doomed. This is so refreshing to hear!! I’m so glad that Lexapro is working well for you. I’ve tried it with no success, unfortunately. But, yes probably by next week I will have to call my psychiatrist and ask for something if this new manager at the ketamine clinic has not called me back. (My hopes are not high on this).
I am able to get my medications thru my medicare drug plan[very inexpensive] It just isn't right for you to be put thru this type of turmoil ..All i can do is wish you well! God bless
Hello - First of all let me tell you - I am sorry this is happening to you. I know EXACTLY how you feel. Hopeless. Misunderstood. Desperate. Confused. Alone. I am 44. I am a school counselor so I should know all about how to fix mental health everyone thinks. But when it comes to this OCD I'm dealing with -I am at the mercy of psychiatrists and therapists and books and preachers who all say they know the answer but they don't. I have wasted more money on their empty promises and I am tapped out. So I"m going to give you some advice. Some of it will be hard to hear. But I wish I would have had someone to tell me 20 years ago. OCD is more than just a mental illness. It is very much physical and has to do with your pre frontal cortex being highly over stimulated. Drs aren't sure why. But there is new research coming out that metabolic disorders, inflammation, and even benign tumors can play a role. Now I am just in the beginning of hearing about this but I ordered a book called Brain Energy by Dr. Palmer. Look him up on youtube. It makes sense. Have you ever looked at a brain scan of an ocd brain vs a normal healthy brain. It's insane. But when I trace it back to when my ocd first started it was in the 5th grade which was the same time I developed psoriasis (auto immune causing massive inflammation) and a stomach ulcer (bacterial). Could be a coincidence? I have no idea. So what Dr. Palmer (who wrote the book) seems to be helping people by putting them on a keto diet. And he does say to not just google keto and do it. But to have a dietician or therapist or dr guiding you. Because I think it can be dangerous and needs to be guided by a medical professional. I just bought the book.
On another note - as far as ketamine goes you are wasting your money. I tried it and it is so expensive and wears off so fast that you woud have to do it at least once every 3 or 4 weeks for the rest of your life and basically I think all it did for me was gave me legal hallucinations for 45 minutes at a time. It helped a little with the depression but did nothing for the anxiety or ocd. I think ketamine therapy is a giant scam and it makes me mad that they charge that much knowing how desperate people who have ocd are suffering and looking for help in any way they can get it.
On medications - I have tried almost every SSRI, SNRI, antipsychotic, and benzo and for some reason nothing will do anything to give me any relief. They are calling me treatment resisstent ocd now and have kind of thrown their hands up with my case. I was on the strongest does of valium and I might as well have taken a flinstone vitamin. But a lot of peole that I know or have met through support groups do really well on a high high dose of Zoloft and Luvox. But the doses have to be high. I think the dose effective for ocd for zoloft is 300mg daily. Which is high. But I have heard that it can help some ocd people I know. Luvox is the one I have heard the best reviews of and I just recently started it and I am hopeful that maybe it will help me. Also resperidone has good reviews and does show promising results for ocd but for me it did nothing. She just added seroquel to my luvox so whatever. I've tried them all and nothign helps. I am able to go to work and am a single mom so i get teh money part, but I do have health insurance. One thing that has actually been helping is inference based cbt. i-cbt. Im doing work with a therapist on this right now and it has shown the most improvement so far. The cool thing is that you can actually access the training and modules online for free if you can't afford a therapist.
here is the link - it works more with the fact that intrustive thoughts arent just random but always originate from somewhere. It helps you try to recognize your obsessional story (worry) and remain in the here and now using your 5 senses. I would highly recommend you check it out. I am sorry you are going through this. It is difficult, and alienating. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I hope you find relief from something soon. I do hope you quit relying and paying for ketamine. I think long term that they are going to find that it is hurting people more than helping. And it would be one thing if a few treatments worked but the fact that they wear off so soon and then you just need another one at $300 a pop or more, it's absolutely ridiculous to me. Good luck and let me know if I can answer any more questions. I probably was no help but sometimes its just nice to know someone gets it.
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