First time IVF - looking unsuccessful

[Trudifer]

hi,

New to all this and all these acronyms. Looking for advice or people in similar or have had similar situations.

To summarise:

- tried for two years and nothing, not even a positive test.

- short cycle IVF

- it was going to be a fresh cycle, however due to the medication, OHSS was looking likely so we are on a freeze all.

- collected 14 eggs, all ICSI, 12 fertilised, 10 developed further into embryos.

Currently on day 5 post egg collection and had a call to say that we’ve only got two embryos that are still slowly developing. On day 3, we had 1 that was good quality and developing and 9 that were slow. I’m not looking forward to the call tomorrow to say that it will be unsuccessful.

My numbers have been fine, 33 years old, AHMM normal etc. My husband sample had good numbers, but low motility than average. Subsequently, he has been taken supplements and I’ve been taking folic acid and Vitamin D over a year now.

I’ve been quite down today, understandable. I guess next steps will be talked through afterwards, but just wondering what happens? Do they diagnose the reasons for poor embryo development? I’ve seen people who’ve had a lot less eggs but still managed to have a successful blastocyst. Luck of the draw? Any lifestyle recommendations?

p.s. how long is normal to have your first bleed post egg collection? Egg collection was Friday and I started my withdrawal bleed yesterday… (5 days)

thanks.

[soccerkt6]

Hi lovely,

This sounds like a sperm issue. My first IVF cycle was similar to this. Great number of eggs collected and good fertilisation, decent number of embryos by day 3, but then by day 5 we'd had a huge drop-off and were only left with two low/mid-grade embryos, which didn't stick when transferred.

The sperm DNA comes into play after day 3, so when there's a big drop off between day 3 and day 5 it's normally indicative of a problem with the sperm. After that first cycle, our clinic recommended a sperm DNA fragmentation test for my husband and it came back really high. We then went to see a private urologist (Dr Jonathan Ramsay) who figured out the reason for the high DNA frag and we were able to get it fixed and then, eventually, conceived naturally.

But first things first, I would have your partner do the DNA fragmentation test so you can see what you're dealing with. Meanwhile, I'll keep my fingers crossed that your little embryos keep developing and you have something to transfer! xx

[Trudifer in reply to soccerkt6]

Thanks for your reply.

So much emphasis on infertility and the physical burden is on the female. When we know 50% of the DNA is from the sperm but all they do is produce a sample in a cup a couple of times and that’s it! It just seems really unfair. Wish we had as many tests for the male partner as the female has to go through!

[soccerkt6 in reply to Trudifer]

I know. It's scandalous imo that more thorough tests (like dna frag) aren't done as a matter of course for men. Women are expected to undergo all manner of invasive tests "just to check", but so many clinics and doctors will argue that men don't need to undergo further testing unless it's suspected that something is abnormal. It's a weird and very offensive double standard!

[Novbby]

Hey, I had 11 eggs collected with ICSI and they told me I only had 1 good egg to transfer. They also told me that 6 of them were showing slow signs of fertilisation. However, when I went on day 3 for my transfer they told me that actually all of the 6 eggs had made it to blastocyst stage and were even hatching but because they didn’t put them in the incubator and do not do PGT testing they had to discard them. I only had 1 now and none to freeze.

My hospital didn’t diagnose the reason nor did they really explain anything just that because they can’t tell if the eggs are good they had to discard them.

Wishing you the best of luck with your last egg. Fingers crossed for today 💙🩵

[Brillanni25 in reply to Novbby]

I am confused. Your embryos could not have reached blastocysts on day 3 when you went in for transfer of an embryo (not an egg). It takes 5-7 days for them to get there.

I am also unsure how they could keep growing outside an incubator, this is also impossible. Not doing PGT would also not strop them from being frozen whatsoever.

I am sorry you clearly have been through a difficult experience and things were not explained properly to you . However I must say that your response, even though means to be helpful and supportive, is providing incorrect information which is confusing and not l helpful to the person who posted her question and everybody else reading.

[Novbby in reply to Brillanni25]

I was told 11 follicles collected, 8 immature (couldn’t use), 2 (showed signs of maturity on day 2 so they injected that day).

1 (successfully fertilised and showed normal signs of cell division) so that was booked for a transfer on day 3 .

The 2 injected on day 2 didn’t survive but on the day of transfer the embryologist told me that 6 of the 8 they said were immature are now showing signs of fertilisation (called it late fertilisation). They called two days later and said all 6 made it to blastocysts (with 2 even hatching, which is uncommon and a surprise to them). Unfortunately my clinic didn’t do PGT testing and they missed fertilisation due to not using a time-lapse incubator, so I couldn’t use or freeze any of these embryos.

Trudifer apologies if you found my comment confusing or unhelpful, I should have been more clear. I may have misread your post as I was referencing this part of your post “On day 3, we had 1 that was good quality and developing and 9 that were slow”. I also had only 1 on day 3 and 6 that were slow, but by day 6 the embryologist said the 6 actually made it to blastocyst.

[Anonimatoz]

Like said above, looking like male infertility. But still doesn't seem like a severe issue.As an example, we have severe male infertility and out of 14 eggs, only 4 fertilised and I got 1 embryo on my first ICSI cycle, second cycle was slightly better.

I know you may have made lifestyle changes, but a couple of things your husband may not be making is cutting alcohol completely for 75 days and reducing caffeine to 4 cups of tea or 2 cups of coffee a day.

We haven't had a baby yet, but my husband's test results seem to have improved in the past 3 months by following this.

He is also taking supplements and medication, but his case is much more severe than yours.

Exercising is also really good, better to to do weight training, no bike, and avoiding cross fit and other intense cardio.

[Trudifer]

update: we have 1 embryo graded AC suitable for freezing. A bit of light at the end of a long tunnel. We shall wait and see…

[Novbby in reply to Trudifer]

Wishing you all the best.