In despair

[darkbuthappyplace]

I’m 38, almost 39 and about to start my 5th ivf cycle. My husband and I had a huge row tonight about how we’ve waited too long to start our 6th round. July was our last egg collection (with transfers in between) and the next will be end of feb. He’s worried that my eggs will have deteriorated drastically in the time and tbh I’m a little terrified too now but we agreed a break would do me good.

However now we’re looking at the timeline and we don’t have an FET until around April due to genetic testing it feels so far off.

We’re in such a dark place at the moment.

Have we left it too long? I’m so worried we’ve ruined our chances having this break now, I’m questioning everything. Should we even do genetic testing now and save time, is it worth it? My husband is reluctant as it’s red on the HFEA but I’m still for trying it but terrified we’ll end up with nothing to transfer.

I wanted to be positive going into this cycle but I think we’re both massively on edge. I’ve never been so low.

I guess I’m looking for some reassurance that that we haven’t messed our chances up

[Nightingale92]

Hey. I’m so sorry to hear about the stress and arguments. I don’t really have any advice on the testing etc, but just wanted to send some solidarity in terms of the anxiety and stress that IVF and fertility brings. I’ve just put myself to bed after a massive row with my partner about IVF, too. It makes me want to throw it all in…which is so stupid, because the whole reason we are arguing is because we want it so much. It’s a horrible place to be in, especially when it causes fights. Sending hugs your way and wishing you the best with your next cycle, whichever way you decide to go! xx

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Nightingale92]

Thanks so much for the reply. I feel exactly the same, it’s so hard to keep going when it puts this much stress on you but you make a great point, that’s the irony, we’re fighting because we want it so much. I just hope we can get to a more positive place when we get closer. I think it was the shock of finding out the timelines and total panic.

Sorry to you too, this journey is so hard. It’s a comfort to know we’re not alone at least.

Thanks for the good wishes, I need everything I can get. And lots of love to you xxx

[MollyRobs]

I’m sorry you’ve had a row and are feeling anxious. My only advice would be that right now you can’t dwell on any decisions of the past. In IVF the decisions we take have to be “no regrets” decisions because we never get the chance to have the time back, the same decision in the same moment ever again. This is why my wife and I always make every decision together. It sounds like you have done this but are now both worried you made the wrong decision. The truth is there’s no right or wrong because no one knows whether a different path would have led to a baby any sooner. Beating yourselves up is only going to make you feel crap, and IVF drugs and outcomes along the way can be crap enough as it is!

If you’re worried about time and reducing the risk in the future of egg quality degrading then you may want to consider embryo banking ie. Doing three egg collections back to back (you can start northisterone the day after egg collection) so it’s about four months to do three ECs. This costs more but it means more embryos of younger age than doing an EC and ETs on repeat. You can decide to PGT-A all collected embryos at the end and then prioritise the best for transfers.

PGT-A is red on HEFA because it doesn’t improve pregnancy rates. It does improve speed to pregnancy and reduces miscarriages because people prioritise the euploids and best graded embryos. This is why it used to be amber on HFEA. It was downgraded last year because strictly speaking it doesn’t improve success as if you were to transfer all embryos collected you’d have gotten pregnant it just may have taken longer to get to the right embryo as you would have only gone off the Lab grading not euploidity.

There’s not going to be a change in success rates if you’re 40/41 carrying an embryo created when you’re 39 - it’s all about the age of the embryo not the age you have it transferred this is why banking can be a good option for those in their late 30s.

Your quality will deteriorate with time, everyone’s does, but it doesn’t drop off a cliff when you enter a new age, it’s gradual and my consultant has said in the past to me three months won’t make a difference in outcome.

I hope you can hug it out in the morning be brave and make the first move, he’ll be feeling helpless because he’s not in control of much.

All the best x

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to MollyRobs]

Thanks so much for this Molly, i didn't know that about the PGT-A and you've given me some food for thought re embryo banking.

We had a little hug this morning, he knows his reaction was extreme and not helpful but i think lots of built up anxiety and fear just came out. xxx

[Twiglet2]

if you want to do the testing then it won’t make a difference in terms of ‘time’ the key thing is the age of the embryos which will remain the exact same age, frozen in time, as you wait for the results. I get your anxiety though I’m looking at starting another round in April after a chemical in December and I will be just turning 41 then. However I know from experience that a break can be really helpful- I was 38 about to be 39 when covid delayed us by 6 months …. BUT that’s the one that worked and brought us our little boy so sometimes a break is exactly what our bodies need!

Either way neither of you can change things timing wise now in terms of the break you’ve had and a few months wont have made a difference so there’s not much point arguing and also your husband absolutely doesn’t get to moan about you giving your body a break!!if I were you I wouldn’t entertain the ‘we waited to long’ conversation as it’s pointless unless he has a Time Machine!🙄 So I would tell him to go have a word with himself and come back and talk to you when he can be supportive and positive about next steps instead of trying to make you feel guilty for something that’s a really sensible thing to do, especially when it’s your body and you are putting it through so much already! He’s probably just feeling understandably anxious about the whole thing and worried it won’t work but as you gear yourself up for this round physically and mentally it’s the last thing you need really so his feelings are valid but arguing with you about them isn’t the way to deal with them. I’ve lost count of the number of arguments this blooming IVF sparks and we have both been as bad as each other at times so sometimes we do need to ‘reality check’ ourselves to move forward together and then we can properly get to discuss the feelings that’s actually making us argue. You guys have probably already moved into that stage by now but just wanted to say you haven’t done anything wrong by waiting and that I can defo relate to the argument though so you are not alone 🤗💜 you got this next round 💪🏼 xx

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Twiglet2]

Thanks so much for this reply. I feel seen! You points re husbands meltdown are totally right and i know he'll not mean the things he said, they come from a place of fear but i did make the point to him i need the positivity. When we're mid cycle he's always the positive one cheering me on tbh. I think things just got on top and he went to the worst case scenario.

It got me thinking it might not be a bad thing. We had to wait 6 months between our fourth and fifth cycles while we changed clinics and i had the best results yet in terms of no of eggs collected and blastocysts. So i'm hanging onto that. I also take hope from your story, thank you xxx

[Susie_1234]

I can relate so well to this feeling of panic mixed with desperation, underpinned by fatigue from ivf decisions running your life for so long. And the stress and tension it caused between myself and my husband. I was 39 (almost 40) when I did my last egg collection and only got 1 embryo. I couldn’t bare to transfer it straight away after 5 previous FET failures as I knew it would be our last. So we waited 6 months… during which time I ended up falling pregnant naturally at 40 (I always loathed those stories because I never believed it would be me) which was the first time I’ve ever gotten pregnant without ivf after YEARS of trying. I guess what I’m trying to say is that my younger eggs from previous rounds failed. But an older egg turned into my perfect little 8month old. The truth is, we have no clue what our eggs are doing in there. We all know the stats about decline which is why it’s so damn stressful, but at the end of the day it can and does happen so you have to have hope, as that sometimes is literally all we have to keep us chugging along. Sending you good vibes for a positive egg collection, I hope you get lots of lovely embryos xxx

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Susie_1234]

Thank you so much Susie, i know what you mean about those stories but those like yours do give me hope. I think we just went to the extreme and had sheer panic. xxx

[Jane8412]

I'm so sorry you are having such a hard time. I wanted to share this answer I found interesting on PGS testing of embryos by someone who was involved in pioneering PGS

genesisresearchtrust.com/as...

Sending you all the luck xx

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Jane8412]

Thanks so much Jane, I'll take a look xx

[Winc20]

I rushed a cycle to get one in just before I turned 39, and it was the worst one we ever did in terms of results… then I did another one well into my 39th year and got the best results of any cycle (8 embryos, 4 top quality) - even the ones I did when I was 33… it was nuts! It’s a strange process, and I think sometimes you have to just keep keep trying even when you are at the lowest… if possible. Sending lots of love xxx

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Winc20]

wow what a result, that’s amazing. My last round was my most successful too in terms of no of eggs and blasts so stranger things have happened. Just need to keep the faith I guess. Xxx

[Bookbroad]

I’m sorry to read your post. I hope things have improved for you. If it help, i’ve completed PGT testing and im so pleased we did. I had 6 failed FET’s last year and it took us nearly a year to transfer them all- what now feels like a total waste of time. We had 5 tested from our most recent round and 3 have come back normal. I’m also 38, 39 in June. I’m so glad we’ve saved time and money in the long run and not transferred embryos which would have failed, not to mention all the heartache that goes with it. It could save you time in the long run and also your precious embryos aren’t getting any older on ice. I really sympathise with agnosising over whether you’ve made the right decision at every point. If only there was a roadmap which took into account all the aspects, financial, emotional, relational, logistical etc. I hope the testing will provide some clarity for you and you are your partner are back on good terms. Go easy on yourself, this shit is hard. Xxx

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Bookbroad]

Thanks so much for taking the time to reply. It's reassuring to hear your story and i feel less alone. The uncertainty i think is the worst. I guess i'm scared on testing as we don't get many embryos and i'm worried about discarding any that might turn out to be ok? I seen this explanation in the pic attached and it has put me off but i'm so torn as i agree with you - so much time has potentially been wasted. xxx

Images are hidden by default on this community. Learn more

Show imageRemember my choice on this device

[Bookbroad in reply to darkbuthappyplace]

That's an interesting and worrying image. Is it something you could take to your next appointment for them to talk through with you? I've read a few things then gone to discuss them and had greater clarity. I should also add that its been easy for me in hindsight to say that it was the right thing to do, as we got 3 normal and there was no ambiguity, but there are lots of additional factors to also take into account, not least the financial and time implications of both doing or not doing testing e.g. if you get more or less than 5 to test than the costs goes up or if you don't have 5 to test you're not getting full value for money so a 'freeze-all' may be preferable, not to mention the added confusion if you're on a multicycle package and whether its cheaper to 'freeze-all' and invalidate your package and forgo the cost of any covered transfers but potentially transfer less. Anyway, I don't know if you need any info on this but would happily share any things we considers (or got ourselves tied up in knots over) in a DM if useful. Ultimately, we me I had a lot of doubts and confusion but that all disappeared once the results were through and it has created a lot of optimism where we were running out of hope. Whether that's misplaced or not, only time will tell!

[darkbuthappyplace in reply to Bookbroad]

Yep, i'm going to mention it at my next appointment. The most blasts I've ever got was 4, so I'm not sure if it'll be worth it, maybe we have to decide once we know how many we get. You're right though, it's weighing up time and hope vs risks and costs. Any info you have on it all would be greatly appreciated - thank you so much for offering. xx