Why you should NOT supplement high-dose D3

[rescuema]

youtu.be/GsomcvdT7Po(Not working as expected?)

This random video I came across deserves more views.

If you're baffled about how to get enough vitamin D when not exposed to regular sunlight, try supplementing raw cold-pressed cod liver oil instead along with vitamin K.

westonaprice.org/health-top...

[JayPwP]

What about the Coimbra protocol?

[rescuema in reply to JayPwP]

Only for the short term or if you're seriously deficient in D under professional supervision.

[park_bear]

Nice to see you rescuema. I want to acknowledge you've been the source of much good information in the past. Regarding the matter at hand, however, I cannot agree with this video.

He makes a lot of claims without any backing by medical references, for example, that vitamin D supplementation depletes vitamin A and potassium and magnesium. Even recognized experts provide references to support their claims.

[rescuema in reply to park_bear]

Hi PB,

I understand your reluctance as the medical community is also rather lost on the subject of high-dose D3 supplementation with much conflicting information. There is some scientific evidence that showed high D3 supplementation leads to potassium loss.

I also agree with the video based on my personal experience with D3 supplementation while continually monitoring mineral balance through tests.

Also see the below-mentioned articles on vitamin D for additional references.

[park_bear in reply to rescuema]

Thanks for stepping up and providing references. from your first reference:

“Results:... No significant changes in PSA levels were observed. However, 24 of 44 subjects (55%) showed a decrease in the number of positive cores or decrease in Gleason score; five subjects (11%) showed no change; 15 subjects (34%) showed an increase in the number of positive cores or Gleason score.

Conclusion: Patients with low-risk prostate cancer under active surveillance may benefit from vitamin D(3) supplementation at 4000 IU/d.”

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The second reference:

“Conclusions and relevance: Among healthy adults, treatment with vitamin D for 3 years at a dose of 4000 IU per day or 10 000 IU per day, compared with 400 IU per day, resulted in statistically significant lower radial BMD [bone phonemineral density]”

The problem with this study was they also needed to supplement with vitamin K - supplementing vitamins D and K together gets a good result:

hindawi.com/journals/ije/20...

The Synergistic Interplay between Vitamins D and K for Bone and Cardiovascular Health: A Narrative Review

“A randomized trial with 4 arms (diet, menaquinone-4, cholecalciferol, and menaquinone-4 + cholecalciferol) showed that only the vitamin K plus vitamin D arm increased BMD [45]. Similar results were found in another trial with postmenopausal women with osteoporosis ≥ 5 years after menopause [46]. After 2 years of follow-up, the longitudinal changes in BMD were significant compared with those in the calcium lactate-, vitamin D-, and vitamin K-only groups. A modest synergistic effect of vitamins D and K was found after 2 years in healthy older women from nutritionally relevant intakes of vitamin K1 together with supplements of calcium plus vitamin D3 on bone mineral concentration compared to either vitamin D or K alone or placebo [47]. The complementary effect of vitamin K1 (1 mg/day) and a mineral + vitamin D supplement (8 μg/day) was most effective in reducing bone loss at the femoral neck after 3 years among postmenopausal women versus vitamin D alone or placebo [48]. The addition of vitamin K to vitamin D and calcium supplements compared to vitamin D and calcium alone in postmenopausal Korean women increased BMD and reduced uncarboxylated osteocalcin concentrations after 6 months compared to vitamin D and calcium alone [49]”

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Third reference:

“Conclusion: The ESCEO recommends that 50 nmol/L (i.e. 20 ng/mL) should be the minimal serum 25-(OH)D concentration at the population level and in patients with osteoporosis to ensure optimal bone health. Below this threshold, supplementation is recommended at 800 to 1000 IU/day. Vitamin D supplementation is safe up to 10,000 IU/day (upper limit of safety) resulting in an upper limit of adequacy of 125 nmol/L 25-(OH)D.”

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Fourth reference:

“ Vitamin D supplementation attenuates the deposition of AGEs in the vascular system of diabetic animals and improves some metabolic aspects of vitamin D-deficient women with PCOS

Conclusion:

In women with PCOS, vit D3 might exert a protective effect against the inflammatory action of AGEs by increasing circulating sRAGE. The normalization in serum AMH induced by vit D3 replacement suggests an improvement in folliculogenesis.”

Whatever changes in mineral levels that were mentioned in the full text of these references were not significant enough to make it into the abstracts or the conclusions of these studies. Actual clinical results of improved bone mineral density, and other benefits, from vitamin D and K supplementation are what counts.

[rescuema in reply to park_bear]

If you were to read only conclusions of the studies, you'd miss the statistically significant evidence associated with high dose vitamin D supplementation. What you have pointed out was also stated in the video.

I have personally ended up in ER in the past with just 2000IU D3 dosage with kidney blockage, but now I have no problem with CLO combined with K2. If you have not experienced the delicate mineral balancing trouble and noticed the opposing antagonistic forces of intracellular mineral levels, you'd likely fail to see the connections that most holistic practitioners notice through various client experiences. It's up to you to take in the information for consideration as we're unlikely to overhaul the current trendy medical opinion of supplementing high dose vitamin D, especially for those who are chronically deficient where correction must be approached more carefully with frequent and constant monitoring outside of measuring only homeostatic serum tests. Again read the below articles for additional mentioned references.

[park_bear in reply to rescuema]

CLO?

[rescuema in reply to park_bear]

Cod Liver Oil. I use one of the brand recommended in the CLO article below. I have eaten many iCan icelandic cod livers, and tried other popular CLOs such as Carlson's and many others in the past, but most brands are ultraprocessed with synthetic vitamins added back that had no benefits whatsoever. Many people also have great result with Rositas raw CLO but it's very pricey but people swear by it.

Check out the reviews

amazon.com/Rosita-Extra-Vir...

[park_bear in reply to rescuema]

I use Arctic brand. I credit fish oil, mainly from salmon, for my recovery from sciatica.

[rescuema in reply to park_bear]

I tried Artic CLO by Nordic Natural and noticed no benefit. If you read the label, it has no D in it. You want a product with high natural A and D in good ratios.

[Little_apple]

not suggesting this but interesting that SAD lights do nothing for Vit D but lamps that emit UVB rays, do.

medicalnewstoday.com/articl...

[rescuema in reply to Little_apple]

Correct, you need primarily UVB to interact with 7-DHC protein in the skin to convert it into active vitamin D.

More related info below and also check out Masterjohn's article on Vitamin D in Cod Liver Oil.

wshcare.org/sunshine-and-vi...

westonaprice.org/health-top...

[rescuema]

A supplemental article on vitamin D

westonaprice.org/health-top...

[Despe]

Good to "see" you again, Rescuema! You have been missed.

[rescuema in reply to Despe]

Hi Tina, I hope you've been well.

[Despe in reply to rescuema]

A lot has happened. . . I hope you've been well, too. Your absence was really felt!

[38yroldmale]

I disagree with this video. I’ve been on the Coimbra Protocol since May 2019. I believe I’ve stopped my PD progression. I have taken 150,000 iu of vitamin d3 for years. Of coarse, I limit my calcium. I believe my PD is autoimmune because of my family history. Part of the protocol I have my blood checked every 2-3 months. Never been deficient in potassium. I take a 1200 mg of magnesium, because vitamin d uses magnesium to work.

[rescuema in reply to 38yroldmale]

People with certain genetic deficiencies for processing vitamin D do need to supplement while being carefully monitored to correct the extreme deficiencies. Just be careful of potential slow and and steady change in your intracellular homeostatic balance and test for HTMA to monitor the long-term trend. Serum tests will almost never reveal subclinical potassium deficiency.

[38yroldmale in reply to rescuema]

thanks man! I’ll definitely look into it.

[rescuema in reply to 38yroldmale]

Try raw cold pressed CLO. It may improve your vitamin D status better than megadosing on D3 for the longhaul while under constant supervision. Dr. Stephanie Seneff at MIT also did thorough studies on vitamin D and you should checkout her podcasts, videos, and studies on D3 vs natural sulfated D.

[rescuema]

Unfortunately high dosing on magnesium tend to stress the adrenals and can impact other mineral status while the body excrete Mg quickly and fails to hold on to the mineral. Definitely supplement Mg adequately since improving the intracellular status will directly impact the D status, but try transdermal topical application as well.

[MarionP]

Good to see you!

[rescuema in reply to MarionP]

Hi Marion, good to see you too!