Question of the month for November: No pain no....?

[Yesletsgo]

Back in the 1980s when Jane Fonda invented exercise (well, that was how it seemed to me) she also popularised the expression ‘No pain, no gain’. As she stretched and jumped she encouraged us all to push, push, push until it hurt and she looked so fabulous (despite being in her 40s which was considered near-ancient back then) that she must have known her stuff.

It was a mark of honour to wake up the morning after an aerobics class aching, hardly able to move, aware of muscles you didn’t even know existed.

As a hangover from the ‘No pain, no gain’ era there have been other masochistic ideas about exercise in general. 'If it isn't hurting, it isn't working' may have been coined in the realm of economics but the idea is the same.

The compulsion that we should soldier on through discomfort in the hope that this will somehow make us a better athlete.

The feeling that if we stop and rest or even walk during a run we are wimping out.

The dangerous belief that when something hurts to the extent we say ‘Ouch’ we should just carry on and ignore it. I think a lot of us have done some or all of these things.

Well, I’m very happy to say that times and thinking have moved on. Your 40s aren’t old now, and, more relevantly, there’s a recognition that if exercise hurts you should stop and re-evaluate.

So, here's the question: How do you keep yourself free of pain (and injury) when you run?

My suggestion would be to make sure your running shoes are up to their job. This comes from bitter experience.

Towards the end of C25K I started getting odd pains in my right foot but ignored them. After I graduated I gently increased my distance to 5k (in well over 30 minutes😂 ). I was finally ready for Parkrun. I knew the advice, it wasn’t a race, do it at a comfortable pace and enjoy myself. You know what? I got totally caught up in the atmosphere and finished about 5 minutes quicker than I’d anticipated.

I could tell that I'd overdone things by the painful twinges towards the end of the run but I was having such fun I ignored them. By the time I had to walk home they couldn't be ignored, pains in my foot and ankle. As I reached my door I was limping badly.

A visit to the GP confirmed I’d damaged the peroneal tendon in my right leg/foot and it took six weeks before I could run again. I’d taken my running shoes to the appointment as I’d heard it was a good idea. He took one look at them and folded the toe so that it touched the heel. This apparently is not supposed to happen. They should be stiff and hardly bend at all so that your foot is supported.

These shoes had been sitting in a cupboard for the previous 10 years apart from the odd muddy walk followed by a wash in the washing machine. Not recommended. Since then I regularly check that my shoes are still firm and if I can bend them I get new ones. They don't go in the washer either, just a rinse in the sink if they really need it. That issue hasn’t recurred so I count that as a win.

The only plus (?) side of all this is that I discovered what a peroneal tendon is. It's not what I originally thought 😲

So what keeps you safe, comfortable and off the Injury Couch?

(Just to remind you, as this is a vaguely medically related theme, if you have a problem you should see your GP or a physio. We can't give medical advice here.)

PS: A much better expression to keep in mind when you run is: No pain, no pain

[MissUnderstanding Administrator]

I remember Jane Fonda! My mam was a huge fan and we use to do videos (proper old fashioned ones you put in a tape player rather than load up on YouTube!) in the living room. Lots of happy memories!

I think most of us experienced runners have a tale of woe from when we got over enthusiastic trying to push through pain. I had to pull out of a half marathon when my knees hurt so much I couldn’t walk, let alone run! What sorted me out was seeing a physio and doing a whole load of exercises to make various bits of me stronger. I’ve carried on with that and while I get the occasional niggle, working hard in the gym keeps me (mostly) running the way I want to.

I always get a tell tale grumble in my left hip when my shoes need replacing. I’m considering changing my favourite shoes at the moment-they’re definitely losing their bounce. I absolutely love them and I’ll be sad to say goodbye! They do smell so awful from wearing them in the pouring rain that they are usually quarantined outside so there will be an upside to new ones!

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to MissUnderstanding]

You're right MissUnderstanding physios are miracle workers. When they suggest an exercise I'll think 'surely a little movement like that won't do any good with this pain that's causing me so much stress'...but it really can make a night-and-day difference.

Sorry your shoes are on the way out. Maybe you could put them through the washing machine now they're no longer being used for running

[IRunning]

Hi Yesletsgo . I too remember Jane Fonda revolutionising the wold of exercise and making it normal for people to jump, stretch and roll around in front of their TV,

I hope I’m being fairly sensible about trying to avoid doing things that may cause injury, my one piece of advice is plan in your rest days as much as you plan your run days. A few weeks ago I hadn’t been able to run for 4 days so to keep up with my plan I ran 5 days straight. That may be ok for some, but I could definitely tell my body needed a rest by day 4.

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to IRunning]

You're 100% right about rest days, especially for new runners in the first 18-24 months of starting running. Our bodies need those rest days to repair and recover.

Running for five days in a row would not be advised for anyone just starting C25K. Putting too much stress on joints and ligaments will increase the chance that you hurt yourself. Very pleased for you that nothing bad happened.

[Annieapple Graduate]

🍏🤣 I was a school nurse at a boarding school. When it was time for the annual cross country run, the queues at my morning dispensary were always double. “I have a sore tummy” “My back hurts” … all looking for the magic “Excused from Exercise” note with my million dollar signature ✍️ on it! I eventually put up a sign on the door. “Dispensary will only open today after the cross country run, No pain no gain … if you can’t run, walk! “

Of course those who were genuinely unfit to run were excused…

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to Annieapple]

Ooh, what power your wielded Annieapple ! I only ever skipped PE once when I was at school. It was a horrible wintry day and we were supposed to play hockey. I claimed period pain, the PE teacher looked at me and said 'well as you've never told me this before you must be telling the truth'.

Dear reader, I lied 😂

[Annieapple Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[GoogleMe Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

My mother said she'd had to hide in a cupboard to avoid PE so she would write me a note to excuse me all year (there were grounds for this... ) I got a report which said I had been a quiet and considerate pupil who had made steady progress (another teacher remarked drily that you couldn't be more quiet and considerate than not turning up...)

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate]

Great post, great question... and loads of really useful and pertinent advice, for our forum and our friends!

My tip... and it is one that appears in my posts and replies, here, so so often... I listen to my body... and more importantly, I hear it. Our body tells us very clearly what is going on and we ignore any warning, at our peril.

I have ignored my body once... and once only...having had a niggle and twinge... I had treated with the usual (P)RICE routine... and then gently headed out across my fields...

A slight tightness as I head down to the fields, I put down to, time on the couch and general lack of use... but...as I ran on... uh oh... and suddenly... a searing pain and a very quick stop !

Sitting on the field, in tears... I was in real pain. So... pride took over and I hobbled home... ! Later, iced and elevated... I sat and underwent a good telling off from Mr OF and son in law... a) for ignoring that tightness and, b) for not ringing my son in law. to come and help me home!

The end result... the Sports Physio and I became great friends

So...yes, and I love your expression... it is so true... if there is pain, there will be NO gain,,, !

If it hurts. Stop.

Timely question .... I am looking forward to reading other folk's advice x

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to Oldfloss]

I nearly posted this question in terms of what our bodies are trying to tell us, so you must have picked up on this Oldfloss . The hints are often there for us - tightness, soreness, niggling pain that doesn't go away. Ignore at your peril (as we have both found out).

[Mummycav Administrator Graduate]

great question Yesletsgo …listening to my body when it’s shouting at me helps me stay off the couch…haven’t been on it that many times so I must be doing something right… 😇

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to Mummycav]

This is so true Mummycav ! Sometimes we really do need that run, we feel it in our bones. The body knows what it wants

[Run46 Graduate]

Great post...I think when you're younger you can likely get away with no pain no gain for a while!

As you age you realise there's more chance of feeling strong and being able to get out there regularly if you actually take good care of your body.

I'd agree with you re shoes, and also for me making sure to do some dynamic stretches before a run, and stretch out properly after a run.

If I wake up achy or sore, occasionally it's one of those things as I've increased distance but most of the time it's because I've forgotten or convinced myself I can get away without stretching out!

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to Run46]

When you're young I think there's a tendency to think you're invincible. Then life teaches you otherwise😂

You're so right about the stretching Run46 . Dynamic stretches before and static ones after a run can really help. Also, if you feel sore next day then doing the right stretches and maybe foam rolling can help sort out those odd little niggles and aches. It seemed counterintuitive to me at first but the best form of recovery can be to be active - stretch, take a walk, get up and move

[SweatyHettie Graduate]

Haha good old Jane “feel the burn”Fonda! We actually used to wheel the school TV trolley ( remember those) into the hall after the kids had gone and a few of us would prance around for Workout Wednesday! 🤣

I have learnt to my cost about ignoring niggles and I’m on a much reduced timetable at the moment as I ease back into a running routine. Definitely not as young as I used to be and need to be sensible! When I did C25K initially I was religious about post run stretches and I never had any pains but then I didn’t always keep it up. Now as I ease back in, my stretches before and after are sometimes longer than the run itself but I won’t skimp.

If’s interesting that you mention about shoes as I wonder if that is also a factor for me - I’ve been thinking about it for a while and wondering if it’s time to replace my trusty Brooks - I’m definitely going to try the squash test. Stupidly I’ve got an identical replacement waiting in the wings that I got in the end of season sale a year or so ago 🤦🏼‍♀️so I’ve got no excuse.

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to SweatyHettie]

Stretches can really help, mine are part of my routine when I run when I'm at home. When I'm away they tend to be the first things to be missed and I'm pretty sure my IT band problem last year was down to not warming up/cooling down properly.

This is how my old Brooks looked when I checked if they still had life in them...they were gracefully retired after this photo and are now my favourite walking shoes

Running shoe with toe folded up

[SweatyHettie Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

Ooh thanks for the photo I’m going to do that tomorrow- I’ll report back!

[SweatyHettie Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

So I tried the shoe fold and although there was a bit of give I had to squeeze quite hard - for now my old Brooks have a stay of execution but the new ones have been moved out of their box and are ready to step in ( no pun intended). I was all set to run in my new ones this morning but in the end not needed. Just a short run but so far feeling good - don’t want to jinx anything but no *whispers* Achilles niggles 🤞🏼🤞🏼🏃🏼‍♀️

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to SweatyHettie]

Glad to hear there's still some life in your old friends! Maybe keep them for the shorter easier runs and use the new ones for when your runs are more demanding?

[SweatyHettie Graduate in reply to Yesletsgo]

That’s a very good suggestion thank you 👍🏼

[GoogleMe Graduate]

I have been lucky and have yet to experience the extremely dubious delights of the injury couch. I've had scratched ankles from the kind of bramble that runs after you and similar wounds after running on and falling into rhododendron brashing (ugh) Oh and being rubbed raw by shoes - that's been the worst thing.

One of the things that put me off running was all the associated fuss and bother - so I have always kept it simple and I'll run in walking boots, I'll run in sandals if the mood takes me. (But then... I don't have rigid soled walking boots and my sandals have a closed toe and a big bumper)

But I do have a strategy to try to reduce the risk of injury:

1) No consecutive day running

2) Walk at the beginning and end of a run (the only time I feel the need for a stretch associated with running is if I've not done the latter)

3) Vary the surface... and not running too many times in succession on hard surfaces. What you may think is a challenging surface is keeping your mind busy and continuously changing (and thus spreading rather than concentrating) the bodily impact.

[Yesletsgo Administrator in reply to GoogleMe]

Blisters are horrible! I got one the size of a 10p coin from a pair of cheapie sports socks that had a tiny lump where two pieces of the yarn had been joined. That was when I invested in my wonderful Balegas, no recurrence thankfully.

Your strategy is excellent, like you I almost never run consecutive days (very, very occasionally, only a handful of times in 3 years running). I always start and end with a walk. I'm lucky in that the fields where I like to run are 5 minutes/0.5 km from the house so it's easy to know I'm 'warmed up'. I do stretches too, my poor old joints need all the help they can get😂

Surfaces are so important and something that doesn't seem to be talked about very often. When you start, especially if you have knee issues, it's so much kinder to run on soft grass than tarmac.

Like you say, uneven surfaces challenge your balance and mobility more than running on, say, a treadmill. They really contribute to a much tougher workout than you may think you're doing. And then there's the impact of surface on pace: when it's muddy or slippery you have to slow right down to keep safe. Your run may take longer but I'm pretty sure that km for km you work much harder than a smooth surface.

Thanks for raising excellent points GoogleMe