Cirrhosis/Nash?

[blumenthal]

Hi all.

24 years old, male. I don't drink, don't smoke, don't do drugs. Weight around 65 kgs, 6 feet tall. I'm not really into sports but I used to swim and ride a bike from time to time. Begining of this year my lifestyle has changed a lot. For 3 months my physical activity was reduced to walking 200 meters everyday, waking up often at 3-4 am and the worst ... food. 3 months only pizza, microwave stuff or some fast foods. In march I started feeling an abdominal pain on the right side, sometimes after eating fatty dishes I saw that my tongue turned slightly orange, I also noticed a slight gynecomastia. What is more I also see a little spider anigoma a bit below my chest, my waist size got a bit bigger, my eyes tend to be bloodshot (however this may be because of the fact that I spend 8 hours daily in a dry, air-conditioned room, I woke up every single night around 2 am (even if I didn't have to wake up that early). In may I started using silymarin plus quit eating pizzas and the rest of garbage and now it got a slightly better, the pain has lessend a bit, I don't see my tongue turn orange anymore, and I don't wake up at night anymore (at least not every night). Got my bloodtest done: glucose 87 (70-99), PLT 284 (150-400), AST 21, ALT 12, HDL 60, LDL 109 total cholesterol 186, WBC 5,8 RBC 4,95, HCT 42, no bilirubin or urobilinogen in my urine. Last time I also noticed that my nails and toes turned pale (Terry's?). From time to time I also feel a bit of pain on the left side of the abdomen (splenomegaly, maybe pancreatitis?). Basically that's it, things I am most concerned about are my nails, gynecomastia, spider anigoma and abdominal pain because these are signs of cirrhosis. Is it possible to develop this desease in such a short period of time? Before this year I lived just like a common person, from time to time I ate some fast food rubbish (once in two months maybe), drank coke but on the other hand as I said I didn't drink booze. Any thoughts anyone?


[jojokarak]

I think if your gp not worried you shouldn't be..... If you had liver problems it definitely would of shown in your blood's and they all seem to be in range and if they wasn't like I mentioned gp would of sent you for more testing. Fatty foods are a lot harder to break down and can cause problems with your pancreas and it can hurt if your eating to music rubbish and with you mentioning that symptoms improved with a better diet, then stick to that. We can all see things on our bodies especially when we have been reading up on conditions, but again probably explained by diet it's just nails and skin take a longer time to show improvement. food and exercise is all you need, don't not treat yourself a pizza once in a while isn't going to hurt but microwave meals constantly is a no no there is no nutrition in them and that's what your liver and body needs, good luck x

[Porphyrogennetos]

Judging from those numbers,you are as healthy as a horse, aren't you? You do not have liver disease, I'd risk any bet on that. You suffer from liver scare which is a frequent condition (strange, but true). You want to explain some ill-defined general malaise by blaming it on your poor liver. You should search elsewhere.

It is most probably an uneasyness with the current circumstances of your life that is becoming symptomatic.

Good luck,

P.

[ayjay64 in reply to Porphyrogennetos]

yes i agree with both posters , i would say cut salt out of ur diet, takeaways and ready meals are full of it--most of us lot are older but you only 24 and don't smoke or drink---u should be fit as a butchers dog

[blumenthal]

Thanks for the replies. On thursday I will try to take a picture of my nails and I will show you them. My gp didn't make any comment on them, tbh I'm not sure if these are Terry's, because on 6 of them I can see lunula which should be absent if Terry's nails were the case.

[Porphyrogennetos]

The 'Terry nail' stuff is a typical sign of liver scare. Also the posting of pic's of 'Terry nails'is typical of that condition. You can find the same question on every liver-related health board. Same goes for Palmar Erythema and pics of Palmar Erythema. You know how Don Quijote went crazy? By reading too many novels on knights and damsels. Same goes for people falling ill with liver scare. Reading too many cirrhosis search hits on google.

I dare say if you had real Terry nails, them nails probably would be the least of your worries, because you'd be a very, very, very sick man by then. I believe it has something to do with low serum albumin levels.

Good luck,

P.

[blumenthal]

Maybe you're right but the problem is that I did not imagine the pain that I felt (actually now I feel it from time to time as well, not as much as previously but still). On the other hand if Terry's nails are associated with really advanced stage of liver disease it shouldn't be the case because I live kind of normal life. I don't have jaundice (apart from this tongue thing that I mentioned) plus for ex. yesterday I was able to wake up at 4 am, go to work, finish it at 3 pm and then still drive a car for 8 hours .... I think it would be impossible to do such thing with cirrhosis. Dunno my gp is kind of vague on the matter, 'you're young, living stressful , sedentary lifestyle and that's you real problem. I think I will go somewhere private and do the CT scan or at least ultrasonography.

[blumenthal]

I added a photo of my nails in the 1st post. Pale toes are even more visible.

[Porphyrogennetos in reply to blumenthal]

"I added a photo of my nails in the 1st post. Pale toes are even more visible."

Blumenthal, man, you haven't served in the army, have you? In my times those nails might have cost you a weekend's guard duty if the sarge was in the mood. Do you chop off your nails? Or bite them off? Know what a file is?

Your nails are fine, unkempt sort of, but otherwise fine. Never mind your nails.

Best,

P.

[blumenthal]

Hi guys, I edited the first post once again and I put the pic of the suspected spider. Any thoughts on that one? It's slightly below my chest.

EDIT: I didn't talk about it with my gp because I noticed this just a couple days ago (maybe 2 weeks).

[AyrshireK in reply to blumenthal]

I would say there isn't a spider angioma there - a real spider angioma is a real dark red centre with spidery veins like long thin legs going off from the centre. My hubby has cirrhosis but only has about 3 of them - on his shoulders and one on his upper back.

[Nikki666]

Hi all my son has been doing so well diet weight loss got some energy back but today felt tired and I checked his urine now he has the ketones back carnt get this got rid of them 2 weeks ago when we first found out about this 2 days of good diet they went don't understand why there back any idears

[AyrshireK in reply to Nikki666]

Nikki, whilst I totally understand your worries about your lad's health but he's in the early weeks of diagnosis and is making the change to his diet which should help with his NAFLD. I also acknowledge that you work in the nursing profession but would just ask why are you checking his urine? Is this something that his doctors have advised? If not it seems you are potentially looking for or stressing over issues which you wouldn't have known about (and indeed might not be an issue) if you weren't testing at home. One reason for ketones in urine is following a reduced carbohydrate diet ..... I presume carb intake has been reduced in his amended diet.

It is best to leave treatment and diagnosis to your son's health team - for guidance on NAFLD have a look at the British Liver Trust page at:- britishlivertrust.org.uk/li...

britishlivertrust.org.uk/li...

Katie

[Nikki666 in reply to AyrshireK]

Yes I know I just tested because I suspected he hadn't ate but he said he had plus he has a uti which we picked a script up for so all okish