Can Acupuncture reduce hot flashes

[happycamperguy]

I’m having 6-10 hot flashes per day/night on Lupron 3-month injections. They’re interfering with my sleep. Hot flashes are the only remaining side effect (of Lupron) after stopping Abiraterone and Hydrocortisone ADT in January 2022 when my MO said my PSA of 0.06 was “near undetectable.” Yippee, a bunch of Abiraterone side effects went away.

So I’m on Lupron ADT only now. My April 2022 PSA was 0.07. My June 2022 PSA was 0.08.

Can acupuncture help reduce hot flashes? Please share your experiences with acupuncture.

I got a prescription for Megace from my Urologist, but haven’t taken it due to side effects concerns. Later, my MO prescribed Cancer-Center-preferred Venlafaxine for off-label use to reduce hot flashes. I haven’t taken that, either, due to side effects concerns.

Let me know of your experience with Megace or Venlaxafine. Maybe I should just bite the bullet and take Venlaxafine. I’m not sure.

I do see a Physiatrist MD every 4 months for lower-spinal injections of dexamethasone for 2 slipped discs there. I also have 2 slipped discs in my upper spine, but those need no treatments other than I use a pneumatic neck stretcher about once a month to stretch my upper spine.

I’m awaiting a response from my MO, Physiatrist, Primary Care Physician and Urologist to my idea of using acupuncture.

Your thoughts?

[GP24]

Yes, you can. But I think there are just a few people who can treat you with acupuncture for hot flashes. Here is a small study: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[Tall_Allen]

There is nothing that will work completely in every patient. Acupuncture might help.

journals.sagepub.com/doi/10...

In addition to Megace and venlafaxine, you can try estrogen patches or oxybutynin. Hot flashes usually diminish over time.

[spencoid2 in reply to Tall_Allen]

My hot flashes are definitely not as severe as they were before. I tried almost everything and nothing seemed to make any difference. The only thing that works pretty well for me is cuddling with a big dog. Unfortunately my older dog feels displaced by the new guy and is not available for cuddling. The new guy is still a pup and he decides when to cuddle or not. Hopefully this situation will improve as he gets more mature. I believe the mechanism here is social thermoregulation. You can find studies (some are referenced by the company(Embr that makes the little cooling device that is supposed to reduce hot flashes) Maybe it would work to cuddle with another human but good luck finding someone willing to share a bed with an old guy who gets up to pee hourly, fidgets and probably snores.First link is one study on human social thermoregulation and the second for Embr where you can find some not very appropriate references to thermoregulation studies. I just looked over the Embr site briefly and it looks like they might have removed the references to social thermoregulation studies?

frontiersin.org/articles/10...

embrlabs.com/products/embr-...

[Seasid]

Why don't you just change to Firmagon injections? I have Degarelix (Firmagon) monthly injections for already four years long and I don't have any hot flashes.

[Concerned-wife in reply to Seasid]

I was curious so I looked up and saw Firmagon may cause hot flashes. In a clinical study, 26% of people taking Firmagon experienced hot flashes. In comparison, 21% of people taking Lupron Depot had hot flashes

[Seasid in reply to Concerned-wife]

I personally don't have it now. You can stay with lupron or try Firmagon.

[epfj3333 in reply to Seasid]

I'm on Firagon and have 20 to 30 hot flashes during the day and night. The Firmagon is working. I've learned to live with the hot flashes. I carry a pocket fan that helps.

[Seasid in reply to epfj3333]

I don't understand why my life is not disturbed with hot flashes like? What could be the reason that some people are experiencing hot flashes and I don't? Maybe I have them also just simply not bordering me? It is like tinitus maybe i have it but don't care.

Now I started to think about this. Is any reason that I don't experiencing these things like others? I believe at start i noticed hot flashes but now I really don't think that I can't sleep as a result of these hot flashes. Very interesting.

[spencoid2 in reply to Seasid]

I can't change to Firmagon because i have had orchiectomy instead. It is the 0 T that causes hot flashes for some people, i think, not a side effect of the drug. Now that I think about i, i think i have fewer hot flashes than when on Firm is Gone

i have occasional flashes during the day some times extreme but i just pretend i am in Florida. at night it is only when i wake up to pee. that is more what i need to fix.

[happycamperguy in reply to Seasid]

I switched from Firmagon because Firmagon injections messed up my belly where I needed space for my insulin pump ports and continuous glucose monitoring (CGM). And number of hot flashes on Firmagon were about same as Lupron.

[Seasid in reply to happycamperguy]

Hopefully it will get better soon. I really believe so. How long are you continuosly on ADT?

[happycamperguy in reply to Seasid]

On ADT indefinitely at this time. Taking it 90 days at a time. I know ADT is just slowing down the cancer, but not curing it. If my PSA triples or ramps up, my MO said next steps would be more imaging, then likely one of the “lutamides”—Apalutamide, Enzalutamide, or Darolutamide. Beyond that, chemo is a last resort.

[London441]

Acupuncture results vary for sure. The hot flashes should calm down after a while regardless of what you do. What do you do for exercise?

[happycamperguy in reply to London441]

I walk and sometimes run part of the time 1.5 to 2 miles several times a week. I sometimes wear ankle weights of 2.5 lbs. each. I also sometimes us an “Abslide” core strengthening rug exerciser.

[Seasid in reply to happycamperguy]

Don't wear ankle weights of 2.5 lbs. One Swiss doctor was against it. How did you find out that it is good for you?

[happycamperguy in reply to Seasid]

I just figured ankle weights make fore more exercise. What did the Swiss doctor say was the reason for not doing so?

[Seasid in reply to happycamperguy]

It was 20 years ago. Dr Walser if i good recall from Zurich. I can't remember but he said that and I agreed with him.

[London441 in reply to happycamperguy]

Frequent and strenuous exercise is the best thing for all the side effects, including hot flashes. Cardiovascular yes but also weight training , which is a must on ADT a must really. The loss of strength without it compounds quickly and spells trouble sooner than later.

[happycamperguy in reply to London441]

I need to work on weight training. Thanks.

[spencoid2]

megace did nothing for my hot flashes but everyone is different. have found nothing that works. my hot flashes occur at the same time as the need to urinate. not sure which causes which but it does interfere with sleep. i tried a large dose of indica dominant cannabis as an edible (cannabis flour mentioned on this list) and it seemed to help me sleep and have fewer wakings peeings and hot flashes. my urologist wants me to have a suprapubic catheter so i don't have to wake up to pee but i am against this. i have had Foley catheters a few times and i get bladder spasms. Of course they have a drug for that I wish i knew what causes the urgency when my bladder is not even close to full.

[Seasid in reply to spencoid2]

I am also against the catheter. You can have i believe flomax or something similar.

I didn't read your profile yet so I can't say more.

[Joeym1040]

I used to get them every 45 minutes like clockwork. Some extreme, some not so. Tried acupuncture did nothing. Apparently a lot depends on the practicioner. Also tried Chinese herbs, some other ugly stuff, nothing helped. Did Venlafaxine for a time. Did diminishe them some but dont miss a dose or two! Also very difficult time getting off the drug. I am now trying estradoil patches. Started at .025mg, then .05mg, the .075mg but had no results. Just starting .01 and we will see if that works. Lots of guys on this group seem to be using the patches.Everybody's experience with all these remedies seems to vary somewhat.

Good luck.

Joe

[Seasid in reply to Joeym1040]

Maybe it's depends on our personality type. If you are sensing personally type than you are more sensitive. Are you showering in warm water? If yes you may be intuitive personality type and therefore less sensitive.

[Joeym1040 in reply to Seasid]

Thank you...yes warm water showers.

[EmpireGradeCyclist in reply to Seasid]

Can you explain the concept and science behind this? This is the first time I have heard of this.

My experience is shower temp depends on my condition - If I’m feeling the impact of ADT my body gets colder and I need warmer showers. When I workout more and I am farther from my Lupron Depot date, my temperature is more regulated (cooler showers). However, we are having a cold winter in the Bay Area and with no heater in my bathroom my showers are all generally warm!

[happycamperguy in reply to EmpireGradeCyclist]

EmpireGradeCyclist, I don’t know how acupuncture worked. I just hoped it did, and it did reduce hot flashes.

I just laid on the acupuncture table for about 45 minutes as he pot small needles in my hands and lower legs/feet. He never explained why it worked

So I’m sorry I don’t know WHY it worked. It just did.

[Maxx2006]

I tried Acupunture, but it did nothing for me I went onto Veneflaxine with no luck but have used Gabapentin for 5.5 yrs and they have been under control.

[happycamperguy]

I had Acupuncture from Sept. 7 to Nov. 10. It was to reduce hot flashes from my Lupron hormone injections to delay prostate cancer. Acupuncture was for about 2 months as planned. 

My hot flashes reduced to only zero or 1 hot flashes from Nov. 4 to Nov. 18, which was about a week after my last Acupuncture session. Yippee! However…

I had 7 hot flashes on Nov. 19. Then zero to 1 hot flash for 3 days. Then 10 hot flashes on Nov. 23. Since then, I’ve had zero to 4 hot flashes per day. So…

Acupuncture worked to reduce my hot flashes overall from 15-17 per day down to about zero to 4 per day ( except for that 7 hot flashes Nov. 19 and 10 hot flashes Nov. 23). 

Acupuncture appears to work pretty well. I’m not sure why, but it generally worked. 

FYI My Acupuncturist has now left the local practice, which is also closing down to allow the owner to be closer to her aging Parents in Sequim, WA. 

And Insurance limits my Acupuncture visits to 20 per year, of which I had 8 sessions. 

I’m pleased with the overall reduction. I’ll see how it goes from here. 

Upcoming is my “90-day” checkup on Dec. 14 with my Medical Oncologist (MO). I’ll get a PSA blood test and more. I’m hoping my PSA is still “near undetectable.” We’ll see.