The Stress Question and T3

There was a very interesting post on here yesterday from Reikimaster who was having problems with T3, and not wishing to hijack her thread, I am posting a question myself which is semi-related.

There was a reply from WildDeer, saying among the things that had set her back on her T3 'journey' was quote 'pushing on through stress and ending up thyrotoxic....main sign my internal voice chanting 'get me out of here'. I recognise this as my receptors being affected by stress and unable to absorb the T3'.

I don't want to write another book here as I always seem to do :-) and of course I know that stress can have a major effect on physical as well as emotional well being.

I also know from past experince that pushing on through any kind of stress, whether that means overdoing it physically or the never ending battles with docs over medication etc definitely has a detriemental effect on the way I feel.

I was just so interested in the 'get me out of here' from WildDeer's internal voice. I get much the same thing, except my voice isn't just internal, it's something that I find myself saying or thinking almost on a daily basis! OK, wrong to dwell on it I know. I absolutely hate where I live and began to get really sick after we had been here for about 6 months (that was when the T4 disagreed with me in a big way after 12 comparatively stable years). We had also had an incredibly stressful 3 years or so before we came here. (Let's face it, it's impossible for anybody to live a completely stress-free life, but this was worse than usual, even in the context of my somewhat up and down life).

I knew I was pushing it, but hoped I would get away with it, because at the time I didn't have any choice but to push on through. But it seems as though now I have exchanged all that stress for another kind which is just as bad. Actually it's worse, because before I was at least able to function.

I have tried to 'fit in', keep busy and think of here as 'home', and won't go into a long boring rambling tale of what has happened. I'm just wondering if (as I suspect) that the literal - not just internal - voice which is loudly saying 'get me out of here' could be construed as 'long term unrelieved stress with no prospect of relief in sight', which is what it feels like, and which I have read is the worst kind of stress to have as it's with you all the time. And of course rampant HypoT doesn't help at all, it's a stress factor all on it's own. So could all this be affecting my ability to absorb the T3? Or is this, as John Cleese once said, Stating the Bleeping Obvious'? It's so infuriating and frustrating to be hamstrung by you own emotions and physical body, as I guess everybody on here knows.

My own experience of T3 has been that when I first tried it I couldn't tolerate it at all, but having improved my vitamin and ferritin levels a bit, though they could be better, I went back to it as 'the least worst' of everything I had tried, including trying to go back on levo four times with dire results. I have only been able to take very small amounts and felt I had made a little progress, though without any huge leaps forward (to be expected with only taking a crumb).

I had an unpleasant run-in with a GP at the surgery last week - there is a HUGE thread on that somewhere :-D, and despite my determination not to fight with him, it was very upsetting and I've felt really lousy physically for the past few days, even though having a rant helped a lot emotionally. It's a daunting and frightening prospect that ANY kind of emotional or physical stress is going to make me feel so ill it's like I've made no progress at all.

I was surprised when I appeared to pass all the tests for adrenal insufficiency, (ie I didn't have it), but as I have huge difficulties with tolerating supplements, I haven't risked taking anything to support them for fear of feeling worse.

I would be interested to hear if anybody else has experienced this 'let me out of here' phenomenon - either internally or as a real issue, what effect it has had on them and what if anything they did about it?

I have tried so hard to adapt to my surroundings, and feel a failure that I haven't been able to and my health has become so much worse - whether because of that or just co-incidence, I don't know. And lo and behold, I HAVE written another flipping book! Sorry! :-D

Kanga xx

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  • Hi Kanga, You're so right, sometimes we don't have any choice but to push through the stress. There is no way out!

    About eight years ago, my job suddenly became much more stressful for all sorts of reasons beyond my control. At the same time, there was a massive drama and upheaval in the family and it all fell on my shoulders and I had to deal with it all.

    What effect did it have on me? Well, at the time, I didn't have the luxury of being able to think about my health, I just had to get through each day as best I could. But the tension built up and up and I don't think I've ever really got over it. I think my health is now ten times - a hundred times! - worse than it would have been without that episode.

    What did I do about it? I cracked up. One day I could take no more, so I took to my bed and stayed there for several days, not opening the door, not answering the telephone. Once I felt able to speak without bursting into tears, I rang my boss and resigned. Then went back to bed again.

    The whole episode completely took over my life and my consciousness. I couldn't tell you what I was taking at that time because the memory has just all been swallowed up and smoothed over with time. Maybe I was taking T3 then, maybe I wasn't, but I certainly wasn't aware of whether I was absorbing it or not. I was running on adrenaline, I didn't even eat very much. But it's all confused in my memory...

    But it was not long after that that I saw Dr D in Paris, and he took one look at me and told me my adrenals were almost dead. I would think that that last period of sustained stress had almost put the last nail in their coffin, but 50+ years of untreated hypo hadn't helped them, either. He put me onto Hydrocortisone, which helped... but that's another story.

    Stress is bound to have an effect on your adrenals, and that in turn will affect how your body uses the thyroid hormone you're giving it. If you are unhappy with your life that is bound to cause stress, so... What's the answer? I don't know. My answer now is to shut myself away from people as much as possible. I can't trust people anymore. Or trust myself around them. My reactions have become unpredictable. I have my own little universe and if it weren't for having to buy the dog food, I'd never leave it, I don't think! lol It's a cold, hard world out there...

    Hugs, Grey x

  • Hi Grey

    It never ceases to amaze me how some people on the forum - and in everyday life I guess - have had such hard and sad times which have had a major impact on their health, yet on the outside (ie on the forum) they don't say anything about their troubles but are always there with support and a joke for others. Thank you so much for sharing your story, and I'm sorry you've had such a rotten time.

    I had to give up work in my thirties, when nobody seemed to know or care what was wrong, except that it was 'all in my head' - although it had been very obviously kicked off by the ubiquitous 'flu-like virus'. The diagnoses such as they were, ranged from infected sinuses to Anorexia Nervosa! I was 23 when it all started and managed to stagger on for another 10 years, albeit with loads of time off work - the usual thing of rushing back as soon as I felt a bit better, only to keel over a few months later. I did have a lot of tests, but I never knew if thyroid was one of them, they just never took me seriously.

    I remember vividly my last day at work - I shut myself in the loo and just couldn't come out until everybody had gone home. It was quite a long journey there and back every day, and when you're well you don't even think about it, you just do it - but when you're ill, every day is a superhuman effort to do those things (like getting to work, never mind doing your job), that you did before with no problem at all.

    I remember getting home and saying I can't go back any more, and I didn't, but after about a year (again!) when I felt a bit better, I took a part time job nearer home, and did that until the same thing happened. If I'd known then what I know now I probably would have given up sooner, but when nobody in the family understands, and tests come up with nothing (because they're not testing for the right things), you're under a lot of pressure to carry on no matter how bad you feel.

    Then throw in a light dusting of unsuitable men, domestic violence, elderly parents whom you don't want to worry so you can't talk about it, isolation from friends and destruction of any self confidence you might have had, and there's a recipe for something, probably disaster. I'm not blaming anybody else, I just wish I had been less naive and more trusting of my own instincts, because I dd get much better once I removed myself from the situations and people that were contributing towards making me ill. I'm not saying they caused it, just that getting out of the situation played a big part in getting my life and health back on track.

    It was a long time ago, and now things have gone pear shaped again - made worse by stress and throwing the dicky thyroid into the mix of course, it feels as though the option of 'getting out of the situation' isn't one I can pursue, so although my inner voice is screaming 'get me out of here' I don't see how it can be done. Somebody - Darwin I think - said 'Adapt or Die' or something like that. I suppose that means if you hate the way you have to live or where you live and can't change it, your one option is to adapt, and if you can't do that, tough luck.

    I have more or less shut myself away now too - not because that's what I want to do, more because I feel too wasted and anxious and old and ugly and unmotivated to do more than drag myself any further than the supermarket when I absolutely have to. And that's an ordeal of epic proportions. I try to force myself to get out of the house, even if it's only walking 10 times round the garden, because the less I do, the less I'm able to do - I can't bear the thought of it being like this for ever. I'm pretty sure I could bash through the 'old and ugly' stuff :-) if I could ony feel better physically - that's the main thing that drags you down.

    Grey, I hope you get some joy from your dog - their company and inconditional love can be balm to the soul when you feel as though the world has failed you, or you have failed it. I don't know what the answer is either, I'm just glad that we're all here for each other, and really appreciate your reply. I hope things can improve for you.

    Kanga xx (and hugs!)

  • Oh, yes, the unsuitable men. And the stress they bring! They are a main factor. Or mine was to me. Thank God I plucked up the courage to divorce before thyroid things got really bad! Otherwise I would probably be dead by now. I would have got no support, he would just have dragged me down further with his sneering and poisonous mind games. Yes, he was another link in the chain of my decline. And yes, I do blame him!

    But, as I'm sure you've gathered, I prefer my dog! Although the poor old thing is getting on now, nearly 11 years old and stiff around the hind quarters. But at least he doesn't stress my adrenals! lol

    I know the old and ugly bit, too. I look at myself in the mirror sometimes (as little as I possibly can!) and think: how is it possible? I wasn't bad looking in my thirties. And even at fifty I turned a few heads. But age alone can't account for what I see now. It's horrendous!

    I'm afraid I don't force myself to go out, not even to the garden. Would you believe I haven't been in the garden for about five years?!? I get straight in the car and off to wherever I have to go, if I can't avoid it.

    All sorts of bargaining goes on in my head: do I have to go out? Well, not much left in the fridge. Yes, but, there are tins in the cupboard, meat in the freezer, even bread... But what about the dog? He can eat pasta and some of the meat! You know he loves that! Yes, but what about... And so it goes on. And the one that doesn't want to go out wins nine times out of ten.

    Because, along with everyhting else, I now have more than a touch of agriphobia. I can be seen crying whilst dressing because I just don't want to go out. It scares me. It's all too fast out there. People in cars are aggressive. Whereas people on foot are over-caring (did I really say that?). Many times when the fatigue and the heat and the difficulty breathing have become too much, and I just have to sit down - red in the face and struggling for a breath - people have thought I'm on the verge of a heart-attack and want to call an ambulance! How many times have I nearly been carted off to hospital when all I wanted was a sit-down and a breath of air?!? I know it's very, very kind of these wonderful people but it does add to my stress, and it's just another reason I don't want to go out...

    You know, I'm as bad as you! I write books rather than posts too. lol But it's good therapy. And nobody is forced to read it. Long live Kanga's books! lol

    Hugs, Grey xx

  • Oops Grey, I missed this as I was further down the page. I will write a proper answer tomorrow - I just have to go to bed now as I'm about to fall face down on the keyboard.

    Speak soon

    Kanga xx

  • Hi Grey, sorry I'm a little behind getting back to you - had a bit of a not

    so good week.

    Don't get me started on unsuitable men - I really could write a book about that! And it would definitely be a Kanga Rant! :-D Possibly cathartic for me, but of absoutely no interest to anybody else.

    I'm sure there are people out there who are destructive to us and should be avoided - unfortunately when you're young and in thrall to them you always think things will get better, and they very rarely do. Often it ends up being a case of having to get away just to preserve your own sanity, or not end up on trial for murder! And getting away isn't always easy if you have no job and no money and not very good health.

    I've basically banned mirrors in the house, except for the one I use to put my makeup on, and that's so small I can only see one eye at a time! Unfortunately there's one in the bathroom which covers the whole of one wall and is virtually impossible to miss, though I do my best. It isn't our house, so I can't do much about it, or the colour of the walls - pale green - which isn't exactly flattering to the complexion. If I accidentally catch sight of myself I don't know whether to cry or run away.

    I do the same 'bargaining' with myself about going out, though it's more because I feel physically rotten than anything else. I have had touches of agoraphobia at times though, and it is horrible. I really do sympathise with you. Mine is very unpredictable, so I don't know if it really is agoraphobia in the true sense. On a day when I feel continually sick or dizzy or really exhausted, it doesn't seem unreasonable to feel more comfortable or 'safe' if you're at home within reach of a bathroom!

    On the very occasional days when I feel more normal, I can't wait to get outside, though I have to admit that if it's more than just down the road I do go in the car if I possibly can.

    But I have experienced that awful panic which doesn't subside until you get back inside your own front door again. And how about abandoning your groceries at the checkout when you have to stand in line for ages? I love the self checkouts (I seem to be the only person on the planet who does) - cuts out the queueing for the most part, and as the checkout people don't help with packing any more, you might as well do it yourself anyway.

    Having said that, it's been years since I was able to go to London or go the tube or anything like that - I hate the crowds and traffic and noise and the 'sensory overload' and especially the underground. And of course even getting onto the tube requres walking miles. To me it feels like a mixture of claustrophobia and agoraphobia! Luckily I haven't got the slightest desire to go to London these days!

    I used to feel that I 'ought' to be able to do these things. But then I thought, am I actually hurting anybody by not doing things that hurt ME? No. So I stopped putting pressure on myself by even trying.

    I can see how difficult it would be for people feeling the same who have to go and say pick up children from school - that woudl be a terrible ordeal for anybody with bad HypoT symptoms, never mind agoraphobia on top.

    I'm so sorry you have such a time of it when you do venture out. Like you, I know people obviously mean well when they want to help you, but all you want is to be left alone to get your breath back. When I was able to go out to work, towards the end I was always looking for places in the street - like alleyways, green spaces, churchyards etc, where I could go and be private if I had to sit down or suddenly felt ill.

    On one never to be forgotten occasion, I was in the middle of Colchester carrying a load of awkward art materials like big sheets of card, and suddenly felt really ill after being fine. I couldn't make the distance back to the car park, there was nowhere to sit down, so in the end I crossed a dual carriageway and actually laid down on the grass verge for a good half hour (crying of course) until I felt able to move! To add to the joy of it all, it then started pouring with rain!. I suppose I made it back to the car park in the end via back streets and various diverse routes, but it was scary, and of course very tiring.

    I know how distressing it can be so I don't blame you at all for preferring to stay in your own little world. I feel as though my life is shrinking more and more all the time and really hate it - but I don't know what the answer is, other than to try and ride it out in hopes that it will pass. In my experience, forcing yourself to do things that are beyond you often does more harm than good. It's so hard to strike a balance between forcing yourself beyond your capabilities or giving up altogether. I suppose it does depend to a certain extent on how much it affects your life and how much you actually want or need to change it.

    Sometimes you have to push yourself out of sheer necessity - if you need food and there is only you to go and get it - in which case if you do manage it, it's a massive achievement. Maybe we should start counting the number of brave things we do in a day instead of feeling bad about what we DON'T do! I've often wished that people would accept me as I am instead of blaming me for my failings as they see it ( ex-inlaws for example), but maybe I should do the same instead of loading myself down with guilt.

    It's hard when you feel as though you're different to what is supposed to be 'normal' - but who is to dictate what 'normal' is? For people with perfect health who can do everything they want to without having to even think about the way they feel, life is probably a lot easier - but for all we know they may have other issues which affect them (though I must say I often feel like saying 'swap places?' when my husband comes home from work and says what a hard day he's had! :-D

    Thank goodness, as you say, others don't have to read our 'books' if they don't want to! It's difficult not to run on when you're sitting in front of the computer with only your own thoughts for company, trying to talk to a friend and doing your best to make them feel a bit better. But it is good therapy, and who knows, might even help a bit :-)

    All the best

    Kanga xx (and hugs!)

  • Much like you Kanga, I'm saying inside 'get me out of here' and like Grey I am shutting myself away from as many people as possible. At the end of this week my husband and I have to take our special needs son to look at a possible future home for him, and as much as I don't want to, it has to be done, as we are finding it harder and harder to look after him. Not, because he is particularly awkward to look after, but it is so relentless and we are not getting any younger. This also has to be done before we are no longer able to do it, or before we 'go'.

    Things came to a head about three weeks ago, when he said he was no longer going to the Day Centre. Although we get 10 weeks of respite a year and he is willing to keep this up (at present), looking after someone 24/7 begins to wear you down. Although I have mentioned to him that he will have to eventually go to live somewhere else, he is not at all amenable to the idea and I think we will have problems at the end of the week with him even agreeing to look at the accommodation (much the same as he gets in respite). He will not go anywhere with us, even to visit family, so that means we are tied to the house, only going out each of us alone unless he is in respite. By the time respite comes around we are too wound up to arrange anything, but sometimes it is just nice to be able to relax in your own home and not have to think of anyone else.

    Sorry for the moan and will Blog when/if I have some good news about the impending move.

    I desperately want it to happen, but at the same time feel that no-one will look after my son and care for his welfare like I do.

    Feel I need some adrenal support and was feeling much better on NA under Dr P's care, but local endo said not to take it. Am seeing Dermatologist re skin problems after antibiotics (another Blog if I get an answer) at the end of the month, so don't want to go back on NA until I have seen him in case it jeopardises any possible treatment from him.

    Hope you do manage to make some progression Kanga and find an answer to your problems.

    Wish you well, Janet.

  • j_bee, that must be absolutely heartbreaking. I am so sorry you're in that difficult situation. I do hope things work out for you and that your son settles down happily in a nice, new home.

    Lots of hugs, Grey

  • Thank you for your kind words Grey, such balm to the soul. Janet x.

  • Janet, I'm so sorry! I answered your post on the day I received it, and I can't see it anywhere now. Maybe I just logged off without hitting the reply button, it was late at night, but it seems to have disappeared. You must think me very unsympathetic. I hope you will understand and put it more down to absent mindedness than anything else.

    As Grey says below, your story is just heartbreaking and I'm very sorry that you find yourself in such a difficult situation. Those of us without those kinds of problems must consider ourselves very lucky - although I'm sure you adore your son and wouldn't have things this way for the world if it could only be changed or made better.

    That constant feeling of being torn in two must be very hard to endure. It's one of the worst kinds of stress - something that goes on and on with no prospect of relief, and the very difficult conflicting decisions you have to make only compound everything. Add that to the absolute exhaution you must feel, and it's no wonder you have those 'get me out of here' feelings.

    Feel free to moan as much as you want or need to. (Although I wouldn't call your post a moan - far from it!) Often as we all know it helps to have a bit of a rant and maybe say things we can't say to our nearest and dearest. If anybody understands the need to let it out, it's our friends on the forum, and we all have our moments of anger or grief or frustration or just plain despair. Thank goodness for a safe place where we can let it out and others will understand.

    I hope so much that you wil be able to resolve this and find some kind of answer that will make things happier and better for everybody in the long run. Please keep us posted about how it goes and what you decide about the NA - if it was helping you I'd say go for it once you have the skin problems sorted out.

    Thank you for sharing your story - helps us all to put out own problems into perspective - and wishing you all the very best.

    Kanga xx

  • p.s. re your run-in with your GP, I find that after any altercation I am very shaky and usually resort to tears, so feel that adrenals are really troublesome after stress with any form of thyroid disease.

  • Hi again - yes, I think you're right. I'm just not used to being such a bag of jelly and apparently at the mercy of my own emotions - or rather at the mercy of my thyroid and it's gang of associates.

    K xx

  • Thanks for getting back to me - you certainly weren't unsympathetic. Things are looking a little more promising after having met the main carer and an associate of the company involved. Although we didn't get to see the house (they came to us to meet us and our son to see if he would fit in with the two gentlemen already there). It is a bit of a slow job, but we have every confidence in the company dealing with it. I will blog when things have progressed a little further, but with our son seemingly quite agreeable after my husbands chat with him this morning, my mind is a little calmer now. He is fairly happy with the idea so long as he 'doesn't have to go to that @!&%ing day centre again' in his words. Also my husband told him about things that wouldn't change, i.e; annual trip to Disneyland that my husband takes him on annually.

    I have used the Art shop in Colchester too, so keep up with your artwork as you can really 'get lost' and relax in it.

    Wish you well, Janet.

  • Hello Kanga

    this may sound a bit off the wall to you, but will mention anyway.

    Do you have WiFi in your home? Do you have it on at night? Do you live in an area that there is a Lot of WiFi around you, neighbours?

    Is their a mobile phone mast nearby?

    If the answers are Yes, then you may want to explore How this can affect you. Many don't believe it at all. Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion. I have been interested for very many years about this. It is my belief that maybe not in my lifetime, but in my sons/grandsons lifetime, WiFi will be found to be a very debilitating frequency on mental health, physical health - and yes it can also contribute to anxiety, feelings of unease, ill health, inability to settle for long..... and many other things if you are sensitive to it.

    I had my home scientifically tested for the frequency's I believe were affecting me. The readings went off the scale (high) of the v sophisticated instruments. Furthermore, the sound the mobile phone mast frequencies and WiFi frequencies made were HIDEOUS to the ear. Yet our bodies are bathed in the hideous noise, we just cannot hear it...

    I will not have WiFi, but neighboiurs have it. The frequencies bypass any walls in any direction.

    I don't think I am as sensitive to it as some others, but I still had physical symptoms, maybe because my body was also struggling with HyPO etc.

    anyhow

    just offering as something that may ring to you or not

    best

    JLTsirius.

  • ......I am on your wavelength ! - Apparently our cells communicate with each other on the same frequency as mobile phones - now where did I read about that ? Am sure someone will produce the science to prove me wrong but meanwhile I can't help feeling as you do about technologies and the effect it will have on further generations. It used to be electric pylons that were a problem if near housing......but I feel we now have much more to be concerned about.

  • Hi JLTsirius - thank you for your interest and the suggestions. I have to confess that I'm never 100% sure what Wi-Fi is! So I asked my husband if we've got it, and he says no. He explained it, but I'm still not sure I took it in. :-) And I always turn off the computer at night.

    I don't have any idea if the neighbours have got it, but we are detached so if they have, hopefully it isn't affecting us. And there aren't any houses to the other side or in front, just a huge hedge which blocks all the light! And no houses beyond that either.

    We have got high speed broadband, because when we moved - only about a mile down the road, our speed went down to practically nothing, so we had to invest in the BT one (other options are available as they say!) that uses I think fibre optic cables to give you a better service.

    Apparently we are now 'too far' away from the telephone exchange to get a good reception in any other way.

    As for the mobile phone masts, I don't have any idea about that either! I have Googled to try and find out where the nearest ones are, and it appears that there is a site with two mast about half a mile away (as far as i can tell on the map) and another site with one mast a good 2 miles away in the other direction. I don't know how far a 'safe' distance is. The two which are a half a mile away might be a bit too close for comfort I suppose, but I just don't know.

    I don't have any idea if this could make any difference to my health or not. I wouldn't need any persuading whatsoever to move as far away from here as possible, but we have to stay here (even if not in this house) because of my husband's job - so even if it is a danger I don't know what I could do about it.

    I have no doubt that the masts can affect those who are vulnerable to things like that - if only because I used to drive past a mast every day on my way to work years ago, and it always sent the radio absolutely wild for about 100 yards before and after the mast! There were houses directy opposite and I used to wonder how they ever got to watch TV or listen to the radio.

    It's an interesting concept, and thank you for suggesting it as an area for investigation. There are undoubtedly a lot of things we're being subjected to that OK, might not bother those who are 100% healthy, but those already ill might be made a lot worse.

    Kanga xx

  • I'm with you on that one, Kanga, I have no idea what WiFi is either! lol Don't think I've got it because I never asked for it.

    Dr D told me to unplug EVERYTHING after I'd finished using it (I shamefacedly admit I don't alway do that...) especially the micorwave oven. Well, I won't have a microwave in the house after some of the things I've read about them. Call me a Ludite if you wish but I don't think all progress is in our best interests. I won't have a mobile phone, either. It chills me to the bone when I see how much time some people spend on their mobile phones. And now my 9 year-old granddaughter wants one... It's terrifying!

    Grey

  • Hi Grey, Sorry I've been out of touch for a couple of days, had a sudden attack of the bleurghs and haven't been able to really do anything. Just when you think things might be improving a bit...

    I must admit I'm not very good about unplugging absolutely everything, although I do turn things off. I'm not sure what would happen if I actually unplugged the computer every night - I'm probably worrying more about wear and tear on IT, rather than on me! Did Dr D explain the reasoning behind unplugging everything - I mean surely you'd be in a bit of a mess iif you unplugged the fridge and freezer, it would be a tossup between food poisoning or leaking electricity....

    I'm also afraid I'd be lost without my microwave (obviously no hope for me then). :-D I like to cook veg in it because it's so quick and they stay green, and jacket potatoes take a fraction of the time they do in the oven. I make my mash by wrapping the spuds in damp kitchen towel so they get sort of steamed in the microwave and then then peel the skin off. I don't really like the taste when you do them in the oven.

    It is rather scary to see how much people use mobile phones, and how strange it is that you manage most of your life without one, then once you have one you feel weird leaving the house without it!

    I first had one when I had an old car which kept breaking down, and going to evening classes across country in the dark in the winter felt a bit scary, so I thought I'd better get one. I'd have been lost without it quite a few times when I needed the RAC in very awkward situations, so I can't say too many bad things about them. I don't use mine very much now I don't go out a lot, and it is worrying when you hear all kind of stories about what they might be doing to you. Most kids text more nowadays so hopefully it isn't as bad as having a phone glued to the side of their heads.

    It's difficult to strike a balance between avoiding technology altogether, but at the same time not putting yourself in harm's way any more than necessary. I just wish I knew the truth about all this...or do I? I feel bad enough as it is, I'm not sure I really want to know about all the other things I might be doing wrong! (I'm sure there's plenty!)

    Kanga xx :-)

  • Oh my, I have lots of stuff running in my study, my ears are ringing a treat and there is a cordless phone, the wifi hub, my mobile, 2 computers, printer, 2 monitors, wifi mouse, wifi back ups, wifi keyboard. I use a grounding mat in bed but I think I should get one for the study. I have noticed it as well at my Mum's home, she has wifi, I just thought it was tinnitus but now you point it out I don't notice it anywhere else. I feel unwell after being stressed, and it takes me backwards with back tension, breathlessness and anxiety about being stressed and then tiredness as I am stressed. The list then gets longer. Then the confidence goes. I meet up with my friends and I sit there in a daze, not bothering to get the energy up to actually say anything. They have energy and talk over me and I give up, just can't be bothered. I sit there with my vegetable soup, I can't even eat the bread as they don't do gluten free bread while they eat pie and chips. Oh what fun we have. I used to get anxiety attacks after I had eaten out, my last one in Tescos, draped over a shopping trolley trying to breath was when I realised this, I think I had eaten something that didn't agree with me an hour before at a pub. Thank goodness for shopping trolleys, I managed to ride one out of the shop back to the car and recover, you can't do that with a basket!!

    Shutting off my wifi now and going to ground myself, night all x

  • Hi Kanga,

    After years of really serious stress my health went downhill and I was diagnosed with ME. My adrenals had been hammered and there had been a knock-on effect on my thyroid, digestion an immune system. I had a "stop the world, I want to get off" feeling and very very low tolerance to stress - I preferred to shut myself away. That's virtually disappeared now and I'm substantially recovered.

    I had to take a lot of radical steps to reduce the stressors in my case - stop work, move house, and change diet and lifestyle to support the adrenals. There's great general practical advice in James Wilson's book about Adrenal Fatigue - or you can Google for guidelines. If it is your adrenals that are the problem then having a low GI diet with a good protein content is important (to keep blood sugar levels stable). Taking regular naps/relaxation periods is also important - I listen to a relaxation tape on my ipod - there's a free download on a website called glasgowsteps.

    You say that you passed all the tests for adrenal insufficiency - which ones? I had a slow achilles reflex, and blood pressure which dropped on moving from sitting to standing - classic signs, but my cortisol profile was normal. My DHEA, however, was low, so I took it as a supplement (under the guidance of Dr P) and felt much better for it. If you can afford a private consultation, Dr P is good on adrenals.

    It sounds like tough medicine which I think it has to be - whilst we can do what we can to reduce stress in our lives, we can't prevent it completely, and some personalities will be more vulnerable than others, (me included) - so I try to maintain the changes I've outlined above.

    I hope this helps!

    Xanthe

  • Hi Xanthe, thank you for all your helpful advice. I'm sure you're right about some people having a lower resistance to stress, and in the past I've been able to use certain strategies to lessen the load - like literally moving away from a situation or person, cutting out foods that made me sick, even something as mad sounding as giving my brain a few hours rest by going out to a nightclub and having a dance around. I don't drink, I never liked the taste and it doesn't agree with me, so it wasn't a case of going out and getting blotto! More, as I say, giving my brain some time out.

    I had to give up work years ago too, but always tried to keep myself occupied by getting more involved in art activities and furthering my education in that direction whenever I could. .

    But that was years ago and most if not all of the mad strategies I used to use aren't options any more. Except avoiding the foods that seem to make me ill. My art has always been very valuable in taking my mind off how I feel, but since the thyroid went haywire (or should I say more haywire) it's been really diffcult to stay motivated or raise the energy. That's quite upsetting.

    My endo did the BP test, and I got a gadget so I could do it at home, and it didn't appear to do anything untoward when I stood up. It didn't drop anyway. I had a Synacthen test which also appeared normal, although I know people say it isn't worth much. I did the 'shine a light in your eyes from the side', and although I couldn't tell, my husband said my pupils didn't fluctuate. I have a feeling there was something else, but I can't remember what.

    We tried the achilles reflex, but nothing seemed to happen at all, so either we did it wrong or I'm worse than I thought. I wasn't 100% sure what was supposed to happen. I do get a reaction on my knee but I thought the achilles was at the back of your ankle -anyway, nothing happened. I've never had a test for DHEA, but will look into it and see if I can find out anything.

    I opted to see the private endo because she came very highly recommended and was a lot closer for me that any of the other doctors. She did do a lot of tests and didn't make any further mention of the adrenals, so apart from doing a few more things myself I didn't push it any further. I have got James Wilson's book, so perhaps I need to have another look at it.

    I've had no option but to rest a lot this past year anyway, I've felt too bad to do anything else. So I haven't exacty been leading the life of Riley. (Although definitely overdoing it in every possible way for three years or so prior to that - but had no choice in the matter). But there's still the ongoing stress of feeling rotten and hating where we live, (pathetic as that sounds), so I'm not sure what more I can do except ride it out and hope the T3 and time and rest will help. It gets more and more flipping tedious though! I don't want to shut myself away at all, but it's been forced on me.

    There seemes to be one school of thought that says you have to get your adrenals right or nothing else will work, and another which says if your thyroid i being treated properly, the adrenals will benefit anyway and 'fall into line'. I don't know which is right.

    It sounds as though you had a rotten time but have turned a corner and now things are looking up. That's very good news, and I'm glad you found things that have worked for you. Thanks very much again for your interest and for the advice.

    Kanga xx

  • ....Hi Kanga - if you would like to read more about the post from JLTsirius then click onto drmercola.com and check out his articles about EMF - Electro Magnetic Fields. They are very informative. It's not a battle I want to take on but I think it needs to be taken into consideration.....along with Flouride in water. Both are big issues as far as the Endocrine System is concerned but one I will have to leave to future generations !

    Hope youy soon feel better.......... x

  • Hi Marz - thank you for the info - to be honest I think I feel the same as you - it's too much for me to take on as well as everything else. At the moment I'm kind of doing the best I can and I'm afraid I'm being a bit ostrich-like as far as anything else is concerned. If it means more complications and I can't do anything about it, I'm not sure I want to know, at least not right now.

    I have drunk bottled water for years, but then there's the worry about plastic bottles...

    oh dear....that was mostly because of the taste of chlorine, before I ever knew about the thyroid/fluoride connection.

    Where do you draw the line though, and what if you have a 'conflict of interest'? For example, my teeth all went south and when the bottom ones could no longer be crowned or bridged, my father in law (just died, bless his heart), paid for me to have implants along the bottom (only 4 with a bridge, but still cost a small fortune and was a real ordeal. 7mm of bone shaved off my bottom jaw to name but one gory detail). It's absolutely crucial to keep them really clean and the dentists recommend a really strong mouthwash which I'm sure is full of things that are detrimental to my thyroid.

    So what do I do? Risk the failure of one or more of the implants (I already had to have one removed and replaced which took a year and was a complete nightmare), or do what they tell me and risk having the mouthwash affect my thyroid? All I need now is for somebody to tell me that titanium is bad for the thyroid - I've got about a pound of the stuff in my lower jaw. :-) No, I don't even want to go there...

    Thank you for the good wishes, and the same to you.

    Kanga xx

  • I can relate to the 'get me out of here' feeling. I've been struggling with my thyroid health for the past year or so, after a thyrotoxic period, and am pretty sure it's adrenals that are my issue as T4 stopped being effective and even T4+T3 is only slightly better as I feel a bit better do a little more, but then yoyo with something like flu or other stress knocking me for six again. I'm intent on coming off T4 and seeing how I do on T3 alone as I think that might be the key to improving and worth a try as neither T4 or T3+T4 have worked for me in the last year.

    In particular I've been bothered by stress coming from my job, which I don't so much enjoy. I kept saying to myself, stick it out, it'll be better once you're healthy again, went part time even to try to make it more manageable but of course the stress of struggling to do it and to get through even a fraction of what I used to do is part of what seems to be holding me in that pattern. So I've ended up resigning, which seems crazy as it's a good job but I just need something different, even delivering leaflets/catalogues or something menial where I can be sure of what the task is, straight forward, not much thought, clock in and out, go home. My instincts have been telling me for months that I needed to be able to simplify my life and make efforts to just be able to be happier even if I don't get better - I know I can't do what I used to anymore and trying to has been hurting me further. Here's hoping my instincts are right.

  • Hansaplatz, I'm sure your instincts are right. A really stressful job can do a great deal of harm, even more so when you feel ill anyway. I've had jobs that I hated and jobs that I loved, but whatever it is, when you feel ill, doing things that you used to do without even thinking about it become like impossible mountains to climb when you're ill.

    Even more, forcing yourself to carry on in a job you don't like can be absolute hell. (In fact being forced to do anything you really hate for a long time isn't so good). I used to use strategies like getting angry with myself just to get to work,(but that only works in the short term and is really exhausting). Another job I had which was only just down the road and was easy until I relapsed - at which point it became hell - I used to sit and play my guitar (very badly:-) ) for about half an hour before I was due to leave each day in an effort to calm myself down and take my mind to 'another place'.

    But all these things are stop-gaps really. I carried on to the point where I was so ill I was flat on my back for three months and thought I was going to die, and nothing is worth that. It was mostly pressure from inlaws (now ex-inlaws), and people who didn't understand that made me force myself to keep going. Even when I keeled over, my boss still got work sent to the house for me to do - that's when you really do start screaming 'Leave me alone!'

    The trouble is, carryiing on in the hope that things will be better once you're well is like a viscious circle with anything thyroid related. It isn't like getting over a bout of flu or something where you can usually see an end in sight - this darn thing is like a perpetual nightmare rollercoaster. There's no quick answer - except for the lucky few and no two days are alike. Or at least, you get plenty of bad days, and only the ocasional good one!

    Sometimes you just have to be kind to yourself and follow your instincts. It's so much harder if you're under pressure to do things to keep other people happy, and if I could turn back time I would have given up sooner and told them to - well, told them something :-) And of course it's always doubly difficult if money is a factor. But I was young and stupid. I'm sure if I hadn't carried on to the bitter end, I wouldn't have ruined my health for ever like I seem to have done. Now the least bit of stress floors me.

    Being happier is also something to aim for, and that alone seems to help health wise. Another viscious circle really - how can you be happy when you feel rotten? But I can think back to a few times when I was really happy, and didn't feel ill at all - or maybe I felt happy beacuse I didn't feel ill...anyway, being miserable and stressed makes it all worse, that's for sure.

    I hope you find the T3 alone works for you. Like you, I thought it was worth a try as T4 had turned on me and even NDT which would be the combination of T3 + T4 made me feel worse. I don't know if I've developed an intolerance to T4 in any shape or form, or what. I haven't noticed a massive improvement in the way I feel, as I can only manage a crumb at the moment, but since starting it in late November my TSH has gone down from 150 to 95 - still terrible I know, but at least it's going in the right direction, if only at a snail's pace. :-) It's a long hard road, so good luck with it all - I'm sure you did the right thing in resigning. In fact, congratulations on grasping the nettle and having the courage to do it.

    Kanga xx

  • Only just seen your reply, sorry.

    I resigned, and then my boss renegotiated for me to do reduced hours and responsibilities which I decided to accept since money is an issue - down to 2 days a week now. I should be able to have much less stress but still some financial security. I'm really hoping that'll find a balance in allowing me some rest and to do stuff that makes me happier and in turn healthier. But yeah, I think following instincts about when is enough is important - it's too easy to get wound up in other people's opinions or your own guilt about not doing enough.

    I'm still on T4+T3 right now, got one last endo appointment next week to try to convince them to reduce T4 and increase T3 but doubting they'll agree - they otherwise seem to want to do nothing or decrease my T3 despite improvements, due to my suppressed TSH. :/

    I really hope your situation improves too even if it is little by little, always better than nothing despite it being frustrating to wait.

  • Well at least you know they still want you! I hope the reduced hours will mean less stress and in turn you'll be happier and healthier. Being stressed up to the eyeballs because of money isn't much fun either.

    Good luck with the T3 /T4 - if the worst comes to the worst, you could always still do what suits you best by getting your own T3 and taking what you want to with regards to the increased T4 - if they insist on changing something that's making you feel better.

    Obviously it is better if they will work with you and everybody knows what's going on, but when you've struggled so much to feel better it does seem crazy (but not unusual sadly) for them to want to decrease T3 and increase T4.

    I'm sure there is a lot of evidence out there - on here if I could only remember where I saw it - which says a suppressed TSH isn't an issue to worry about when you're on T3. Getting your docs to believe it is another matter!

    Good luck

    Kanga xx

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