this might seem like a silly question but i going to ask it anyway. IS THERE SUCH A THING AS AN ANTIDOTE TO REMOVE EXCESS IODINE FROM THE BODY THAT IS STORED IN MY CELLS?
The excess iodine is playing havoc with thyroid numbers. I have no thyroid and resent numbers were: TSH 11.9 FT4 12.0 (12 - 22) FT3 3.5 (3.1 -6.8). Needless to say but hypothyroid symptoms have now driven me to the depths of despair.
High iodine in my my body was caused by a drug, namely Amiodarone prescribed for afib. Stopped taking this drug on 10 August. This drug is toxic due to very high iodine content that stays in the body for a very long time (half life).
Suppose i am grasping at straws here but just thought i would throw the question out here no matter how stupid it may be.
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DizzyD
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You're right... maybe it needs to be cabbage water 🤢 I can't find anything that suggests that locking up iodine then means it's easier to flush it from your system though?
Awww it's a great idea though....All I can find is to remove any iodine from your diet..... All very well and good but not easy as it involves removing a number of food groups... . Secondly there's probably more iodine in my Armour than food....have I got that right?
And to drink plenty of water that doesn't have iodine added in. Is it added in some countries. Is water iodine free in the uk?
I'm confused Greygoose. Please can you explain further. I'm unlikely to have any functionality in my thyroid as have needed high doses of NDT for years now. I thought the excess iodine blocks or patially blocks thyroid hormone receptors making it hard to get T3 & T4 into the cells.... As well as binding thyroid hormones hence Dizzy and I experiencing problems with our thyroid replacement doses back stacking so having to take very low doses. Have I got this all wrong?I need educating.....lol..
Im also wondering if I should be considering some Adrenal support like a glandular as I expect my adrenals are taking a big hit at the moment having to pick up the slack as I continue to be able to take only a quarter of my dose of ndt. However I've no idea what's out there these days. The one I used to take years ago recommended by Dr P is no longer made.
I was on Amiodarone for a month, Dizzy 17weeks.... I know this is going to take months to sort..... Awful...
I thought the excess iodine blocks or patially blocks thyroid hormone receptors making it hard to get T3 & T4 into the cells....
I have never heard that iodine - excess or otherwise - blocks receptors. Where did you read that?
As well as binding thyroid hormones
I've never heard that, either. And it certainly wasn't my experience. I didn't even know I had excess iodine because everything was going well for me. It was just that my doctor suddenly 'discovered' iodine, as it were, and wanted me to take it. We had a big row and I finally said, ok, test me, and iif I'm deficient I'll take it. But, it was quite the opposite, for some unknown reason.
Dizzy and I experiencing problems with our thyroid replacement doses back stacking
Back stacking? Where? Dizzy's blood test results don't suggest that: TSH 11.9 FT4 12.0 (12 - 22) FT3 3.5 (3.1 -6.8) In fact, she looks very under-medicated.
Sorry, I know nothing about adrenal support, I've never taken any. But you can support your adrenals by making sure they get adequate vit C, B vits and salt.
I know this is going to take months to sort.....
But it shouldn't take months - not unless you're continually topping up the iodine levels. And you'll be doing that with diet and thyroid hormone replacement, as I said above. Iodine only has a half-life of 8 days.
I thought it was the iodine in Amiodarone that had this effect.Certainly when you read about Amiodarone it talks about reduced conversion and partial blockage of uptake thyroid hormones....
I've no idea tbh TiredThyroid50. It's well outside my scope of knowledge or skill set tbh. What I do know is neither Dizzy or me has been able to carry on taking our usual dose of thyroid hormone replacement without going over range or feeling over replaced. We are both reduced to a much smaller dose as all we can tolerate. So something is preventing proper absorption uptake.
I was stable on the same dose for 15yrs before Amiodarone was given to me.....for one month!! 😬
Sorry DizzyD I'm in the same boat. A month since I stopped it. Can only tolerate a quarter of my normal dose of Armour Thyroid. I'm living on fresh air re thyroid hormones as the levels must be plumetting. It's scary. Blood test next week. I was hoping you were improving as you are three months on. I've booked a private app with an Endo. Who knows what help that will be....
yeah detox stuff may well help blood levels but not cells but still i going to try it. I have contacted a bio-chemist on social media site to see if she can come up with any suggestions. I refuse to rot away here in my bed and do nothing.
Also wondering waveylines if iodine content can be measured on a cellular level?
This is weird Dizzy.... It's the third time I've replied to you but it doesn't seem to post......I don't think anything can be tested at cellular level unless ure a dead lab rat! 😂
Sorry I was referring to thyroid hormones at cellular levels.
I will ask the Endo I'm booked into see. Apparantly he knows a lot about Hypothyroidism and Amiodarone.... Hope he's ready for an enquiring mind, full of questions!!
Hi waveylines, 're your post above, something seems to have gone wrong with my devices after buying and setting up a new lap top. Not receiving any HU megs in my inbox at all, (phone, tablet, or laptop) I am not in the least bit techno minded so I unable to resolve the problem. In the meantime I will send/reply to posts that I do receive. Only just read greygoose replies...don't think she is getting the gist as to the extent of excess iodine playing havoc with our thyroid meds. We must remember not many people on this site, ourselves included, are not that knowledgeable as to the extent of what excess iodine via Amiodarone can affect thyroid meds. Don't think endos do either even specialised ones. Suspect they are only going to increase or decrease thyroid meds based on thyroid blood test results. Over time iodine will eventually reduce be it cellular or in bloodstream. Having said that, my main concern is the extent as to how being in such a hypothyroidism state is affecting my heart which is already in a bad enough state.
I do understand. This is why I want to look at adrenal glandular because currently I suspect my adrenal glands are probably having to work harder but I await my thyroid panel blood test -, even though I know it won't give as accurate reflection of what's going on.It's on my list to discuss with Endo. I don't want to end up with adrenal fatigue on top.
Whoops on top of everything else i already have adrenal fatigue. Do believe I am functioning on adrenaline which can't be good for heart at all. I bought Seriphos: Phosphorylated Serine Adaptogen for adrenal support, not taken it yet because got that much going on health wise would not be able to tell if it was helping me or not.
What is the difference, if any, between adrenal glandular versus an adaptogen?
I had my last thyroid test 10 October (dire results above) so still got few weeks to go for retest. Will then see if levo increase has made any diff or not.
Thanks Helvella that's very helpful. The company don't list iodine removal. It's users who think so. I won't bother with it. I don't need anything else adding to my woes!
Wavylines, that's actually an excellent article about Amiodarone. DizzyD says she (he?) doesn't have a thyroid gland, so all of the mechanisms in that article that involve the thyroid gland (including the large quantity of iodine released from amiodarone messing up iodine-based regulation of hormone production) do not apply for that case. For someone who still has a thyroid gland, the high levels of iodine WOULD be relevant.
However, Amiodarone itself is structurally similar to thyroid hormones T3 and T4 and causes problems of its own, even if you don't have a thyroid gland.
1) It inhibits conversion of T4 to T3, leading to reduced levels of T3.
2) It decreases the clearance (removal) of reverse T3, leading to increased levels of reverse T3.
3) It can lead to inhibition of T4 and T3 entry into peripheral cells, leading to reduced levels of both thyroid hormones in the tissues.
Amiodarone is highly fat soluble and is extensively taken up and concentrated in the tissues. That means it takes a long time to have its desired therapeutic affect as an antiarrhythmic, but also that it takes a long time to eliminate it from the body. According to the article, it can take up to almost 5 months to fully deplete the tissues of amiodarone.
Furthermore, amiodarone is metabolized to a compound called DEA (N-Monodesethylamiodarone) that is also active. DEA inhibitsT3 from binding to to the β1-thyroid hormone receptor in the cell nucleus, thereby interfering with the ability of T3 to do its job, regulating gene expression. According to a different paper published in Science Direct (sciencedirect.com/science/a... ), it may also interact with another receptor nearby in a very complicated fashion that sometimes increases and sometimes decreases normal binding (to a different compound, not T3), depending on the concentration of T3 and the concentration of DEA.
And the half life of DEA is about 40% longer than the half-life of amiodarone. I believe it is also fat soluble.
As far as how to accelerate elimination of amiodarone and DEA from the body, since they are fat soluble, it would make sense that mobilizing fat (for example, by dieting and exercising) would decrease both stored fat and stored fat-soluble compounds such as these. However, the trade-off would be increasing the concentration of those compounds in the blood (and hence, in other tissues, potentially worsening symptoms) until they could be eliminated from the body altogether. So it's not something I would necessarily engage in without consulting with the doctor managing your thyroid AND the doctor managing your cardiac arrhythmia.
Thankyou that is what I've been trying to say but got confused between the iodine part and the amiodarone part. You written it so clearly. Thankyou!I most certainly would not want to start dieting or enter a programme of exercise to reduce fat. I am on such a low dose of Armour I just won't have the energy. Secondly you are right I'm nearly 9 weeks post heart op and have been working on building up gentle walk mainly on the flat. Surgeon doesn't want heart stressed at the moment. I'm going for a cardiac assessment for cardiac gym later on this week. That will probably start in December....or they may say Jan.
I don't want anything more to stress my body. So will have to accept a slow lowering.
Such a nasty vile drug. Shame I wasn't heard when I queried it!
The body is supposed to rid itself of excess iodine, excrete it. That has not been my experience! I've only once had an iodine test and the result was sky-high. But, I wasn't aware that that was having any sort of effect on my thyroid blood tests.
The half-life of iodine is 8 days, I gather. Not much longer than the half-life of T4, so if you're not continually topping it up, it shouldn't take too long to decay away.
Not much you can do about the thyroid hormone replacement, except stop it for a few days, maybe? That's what I would do. Maybe just for a week? And a week or so of a low iodine diet wouldn't be too much of a sacrifice to get rid of the iodine, surely? Because all the time you're topping up the iodine it's not going to go away.
We are talking about very high excess levels of Iodine greygoose. In a 200mg dose of Amiodarone there is 75mg of Iodine. Both Dizzy and I went through a loading period (standard) so that's 600mg of Amiodarone per day for a week (225mg of Iodine per day!) then second week 400mg of Amiodarone per day (150mg of Iodine) followed by daily dose of 200mg Amiodarone (75mg of Iodine). This is a huge quantity of iodine that you would never ever get from food. So the body stores it all over the place in your body.My understand is that it takes 4months to half the level of excess iodine and 8-12months to rid the excess. Meanwhile the body is rendered back into a Hypothyroid state because it can only partially access the thyroid hormone replacement. This is why it's contrary indicated on NICE guideline. Unfortunately for me it was implemented without my knowledge when I was in hospital. Post heart surgery. I knew nothing about effects of Amiodarone but did question it at the time.
My surgeon says there is no way to remove the excess iodine and he had no choice but to give it to me..... .
I'm off down to see an Endo in two weeks who has I understand great experience in dealing with the terfible effects of Amiodarone on pre existing Hypothyroid patients and is used to Armour. Am not very hopeful tbh.... but feel out of my depth on this one.
I stopped my Armour for 5 days in total but can still only tolerate one grain (38mcg of T4 and 9mcg of T3). This then showed my thyroid hormones back in range. Its a month since I stopped Amiodarone. Doing another blood test next week to see if I have room for an increase but whether my body can absorb it I don't know.
My understand is that it takes 4months to half the level of excess iodine and 8-12months to rid the excess.
Well, how long it takes to get rid of it depends on how much you have in the system, of course. But, the body is equiped to get rid of excess by itself, providing you don't keep topping it up. And, as I said, I have never heard that excess iodine stops you absorbing exogenous thyroid hormone. It does have an anti-thyroid effect on a working thyroid, but yours is no-longer working. I don't know where this information comes from.
"Thus, 6 mg of iodine associated with a 200 mg dose of amiodarone markedly increases the daily iodine load [1,2]. Amiodarone is very lipophilic and is concentrated in adipose tissue, cardiac and skeletal muscle, and the thyroid. Elimination from the body occurs with a half-life of approximately 100 days [3].25 Jan 2022"
"Amiodarone blocks the action of thyroid hormone by the inhibition of 5′-deiodinase which reduces production of T3 in peripheral tissues and possibly by blocking nuclear binding of T3."
Amiodarone and thyroid function
Author links open overlay panelKoonlawee Nademanee, Robert W. Piwonka, Bramah N. Singh, Jerome M. Hershman
Sorry the webpage is locked so wont let me share the link.
This is my understanding of why my replacement thyroid hormones back stacked in my blood tests. And why I'm finding I can only now take a small amount of thyroid hormone replacrment.
I'm no scientist or medic.... Just a lay person trying to understand why I have had to reduce so drastically. Any more results in over treatment signs and riding level of Thyroid hormones in blood tests.
I've also read elsewhere that it's 75mg of iodine in 200mg of Amiodarone.
So whilst this is all going on I'm guessing the adrenal glands have a bigger part to play to support the body while it cannot absorb enough thyroid hormone at cellular level. I don't know though!
Elimination from the body occurs with a half-life of approximately 100 days
Well, I would question that. It's not what I've read. But, of course, if you're continuing to ingest large quantities of iodine, it doesn't matter what the half-life is, you're not going to get rid of it at all. The thing is to avoid iodine as much as possibly while the stock slowly degrades.
Amiodarone blocks the action of thyroid hormone by the inhibition of 5′-deiodinase which reduces production of T3 in peripheral tissues
So, that is saying that it reduces conversion of T4 to T3. Not that it has any effect on the T4 itself.
This is my understanding of why my replacement thyroid hormones back stacked in my blood tests.
Well, I still don't understand what you mean by 'back-stack'. Do you mean build up in the blood? That's not what DizzyD's bloods are showing. They are showing very a very low level of T4. Too low to show how well she converts.
But I can't see that any of that explains why you can only now tolerate a low dose of NDT. And, as I've said before, that is certainly not what happened to me.
So whilst this is all going on I'm guessing the adrenal glands have a bigger part to play to support the body while it cannot absorb enough thyroid hormone at cellular level.
But nowhere does it suggest that you cannot absorb thyroid hormone a cellular level that I can see.
It's reduces uptake of T3 at peripheral level. I thought that meant cellular?
Whatever am stuck on only being able to tolerate one grain of Armour rather than 3 3/4 grains, my usual dose, for over 10yrs. There has to be a reason.... Lol
I'm not on Amioradarone now. It was stopped a month ago....
I will take this up with the Endo I'm seeing in two weeks.
My partner was given iodine by a well known naturopath who works with thyroid, the conclusion we came to after she felt a lot worse was
1. It appeared to lower Ft3 and raise TSH
2. I am very sceptical about the iodine tests, we did the non loading iodine urine test several times and showed too high iodine , the naturopath liked the patch test which showed she was low. We did the urine test several times over nine months and although it came down a bit it was still way over max. We gave up testing it and ditto with naturopath. She was on 4 drops iodine lugols per day.
I was given it by an idiot GP without any explaination of why, nor any testing, nor even a physical examination or any questions asked. And I was too ignorant in those days to question it.
1. It appeared to lower Ft3 and raise TSH
As I was given any tests either before or after taking it, I don't know if it had that effect on me. But, according to what waveylines has posted above, it inhibits conversion of T4 to T3, so that would explain the lowered FT3 level and the raised TSH.
2. As far as I know, the non loading iodine urine test is the most accurate. The patch test was discredited as rubbish a long, long time ago! The speed at which the iodine disappears has little to do with absorption and more to do with atmospheric pressure, air temperature, wind speed and a whole heap of other variables. I'm amazed that any doctor would still use it!
The only test I've ever had was a serum iodine test, which the doctor knew to be unreliable, but my result was so high that even if the test wasn't 100% accurate, my iodine level was obviously too high. I was taking NDT at the time - about 6 grains, if my memory serves me right. But it was a long time ago, so I don't remember all the details. So, conversion wasn't my problem at that point. And, I didn't feel any other effects.
It's not according to me Greygoose or what I allege, I sent links to published research.... I'm talking about Amiodarone and it's iodine content. I thought it was the high iodine content causing the problem with thyroid cm hormone conversion and uptake well that's what the research papers say... Hence my links.It's an evil drug but still very much in use today. So glad it didn't affect you. Lucky you.... disaster for me...
It's not according to me Greygoose or what I allege
I didn't say it was, or that you did. I said what you posted. And you posted the quotes and the links. I'm not blaming you in any way, just referring ainslie to your post.
And, I know what you're talking about, but excess iodine is excess iodine, whatever the source. I don't know why mine was so high - it was years after I'd been prescribed it that I finally got tested. Could have been my high dose of NDT, but I wouldn't have thought it was that high. 6 grains would give one about 175 mcg iodine, so not all that excessive. So, I don't know why my level was so high. Whatever...
I've never taken Amiodarone but it does sound like a horrible drug. I'm sorry you had to take it. But, having read what little I can of the link you gave - and I'm not prepared to pay to read the rest - it says that the effect it has on conversion is due to tn Intrinsic effects of the drug itself, not the iodine. So... I really don't know where that leaves us.
So Sorry Greygoose am being far too over sensitive. I really appreciated your comments. Thank you. It's a terrible drug! It does awful things to other organs too. I really can't see why it's used. Known for liver toxicity, Lung damage and damage to the eyes.....as well as thyroid. I mean can't they do better than that these days????
I have to say had I known it was going to be used on me post op I would have said no. But it wasnt discussed pre or post op. I just found out by asking a nurse what it was!!
It's called a drug of last resort for a very good reason...... 😵😤
I think it's terrible they way they stuff you full of drugs in hospital without your consent or explanation. It's happened to me, too. It's all wrong. Yes, you could think they could come up with something less toxic these days, but one has to ask oneself, do they even care?!?
I don't think it was thought through enough. My surgeons eyes widened when I said I'm on Armour because I don't convert thyroid hormones well.... He knew then..... as the implications of my statement sunk in. He's a lovely man, very dedicated, and does care, brilliant surgeon.... but clearly didn't realise the full impact for me by that decsision. It's why consultation is sooo vital!! But you are right it does make one very vulnerable when in hospital. Never mind they can never give you your medications appropriately. The nurse lumped mine all together & served them up at breakfast time.
Yes, I got that at breakfast! lol And breakfast was a huge bowl of milky coffee! (I'm in France.) When I mentioned it to the nurse in charge of medication, she got all huffy, so I left my levo til later.
No, I don't think doctors ever think these things through as carefully as they ought to. Last time I was given a beta-blocker without anyone asking me if I had asthma. And I do. So that wasn't good, either.
That's the main problem with the big pharma approach - got a problem? here's a pill. They want to mask the symptoms and have you go away and not bother them (but put you on that pill for life). And the 10 minute, one problem doctor visit doesn't give the doctor time to ask if you have any other problems or medications. As you experienced, these may may not go too well together and can create additional, unpleasant and even problematic side effects. All the best managing it all!
My impression is that Isabella Wentz is considered some kind of saint among thyroid patients. She is frequently quoted on thyroid forums and her books are recommended reading. Nobody ever seems to contradict her. However, I am not that impressed. I followed her advice for "reversing" Hashimoto´s and ended up with an atrophied gland.
I’m so sorry this book has always my been to go to when I first got diagnosed, her protocols might work for some and not others every one of us is different, she has been through this her self and knows what to deal with, she only gives ideas of root causes and explained what the best way to tackle them, to try!!
I didn´t mean that Isabella W was responsible for the destruction of my thyroid, only that her advcie did not do anything to stop it. From the articles I´ve read, she seems to think that Hashi´s can be reversed, but that is not at all my experience. And, since she calls herself the "Thyroid Pharmacist", many people are likely to consider her advice expert advice.
I have tried the autoimmune protocol etc a number of times but the best results I've had for normalising my TPO antibodies was after following the carnivore diet for a few months. My TPO antibodies dropped to just above the normal range despite the thyroid test being taken after Xmas when I broke the diet and ate all sorts of crap excluding gluten for a few weeks. I think my TPO results may have been even better had I taken the thyroid test before I broke with the diet. The carnivore diet goes further than Wentz/autoimmune protocol in the way that is kind of like the ultimate elimination diet . It also starves off bacteria and so can be very helpful for SIBO and other bacterial overgrowths that one might unknowingly have. SIBO and dysbiosis has been implicated in loads of autoimmune diseases so the fact the carnivore diet has been shown to clear SIBO may be an important part of why so many people have success with it for so many different diseases. I have no idea if this information will be useful for you but I'm always interested to know what has worked and not worked for people in reversing disease so I'd thought I'd pass on my own experience.🙂
I couldn't find anything there to address the specific issue asked about - excess iodine after amiodarone other than reduce intake. That is, no way of speeding up reduction of iodine levels.
(I'm also not impressed by people who claim their articles are medically reviewed when they do that themselves as appears to be the case here.)
Suggesting that someone takes selenium in that situation comes across to me as a real stab in the dark.
It might help. It might not help. And if the person already has plenty of selenium, it is likely to be a positively bad idea. I wouldn't suggest anyone takes 400 micrograms of selenium a day unless they have proved deficiency. Maybe 100, even 200, but no more.
You might find this article useful, this is an excerpt...
To quote Philli- pou, et al:4 “We can, therefore, conclude that the effect of amiodarone, benziodarone, Na iopanate, and other iodine containing substances with similar effects is due to the entire molecule and not to the iodine liberated. It should be noted that the cytotoxic effect of amiodarone in all cultures is also due to the entire molecule and not to the iodine present in it.”
The article is written by a doctor who has studied iodine supplementation for many years and who is referenced by Dr Sarah Myhill in her book "The underachieve thyroid".
Wow! So Amiodarone kills cells (cytotoxic)!!! No wonder my thyroid meds went over range...thyroid meds were in my blood but not getting into cells and used up because cells were being killed off so thyroid meds had no where to go. Hence, over range thyroid results 7 weeks after starting Amiodarone. Still over rang after 2 levo reduction......!
Well lol, that's my simplistic interpretation limonene7. This is scary stuff but really do appreciate the informative link you so kindly sent.
Hi, I believe it is referring to research that concludes that the drug Amiodarone is toxic to many cell types in the body due to its action on these cells. It is not the iodine contained in the drug that is responsible for the cytotoxicity, it is the drug itself.
But isn't this the effect of Amiodarone on the thyroid gland and the kidneys? It's highly likely I don't have a functioning thyroid & Dizzys thyroid was removed.... How does this relate.Sorry I still don't understand. Lol..
DizzyD's post was asking about trying to remove iodine from the body due to the belief that the iodine in the Amiodarone was cytotoxic. However, the research concludes that its is the Amiodarone drug itself that is cytotoxic to the various cell types, not the iodine. If this is the case, there would be no benefit to trying to remove the iodine in her body, especially as it will naturally lower over time anyway. 🙂
Yes thank u Limonene but the iodine also has an effect on conversion and uptake. I think but not sure the dying off of cells was organ specific. Given Dizzy doesn't have a thyroid and mine I very much doubt it has any functionality am not sure how that explains the low TSH, highFt 4 & high Ft3?
Where are you reading that high iodine affects conversion of T4 to T3? I'm not finding anything, but I haven't spent that long looking. Iodine concentration DOES affect iodine "uptake" -- into the thyroid gland, part of the process of producing thyroid hormones; and "conversion" of thyroid precursors to thyroid hormone - again, in the thyroid gland, by adding iodine to them. The cytotoxicity of amiodarone and its metabolite, DEA, is reported in certain tissues - including the thyroid gland itself, in lung tissue, and in the liver. I see one study demonstrating toxicity to epithelial cells and renal cells, as well.
I think I answered this in my reply to your clear explanation in the message before this. I've found the whole subject of Amiodarone and it's effects very complex & confusing!! I will have a look tomorrow as I thought iodine did have a role....
My endo said something last time I saw that I don't remember hearing before. She said if your ft4 is really high, your tsh will be correspondingly low, usually too low. Something is out of balance. (my tsh was very low last time. She lowered my dose from 112 to 100. We'll see at the next test.)
And was your Ft4 really high? What were the results? In a normal functioning thyroid when the ft4 get high or high enough the pitutory will lower the TSH response. This is not always the case in Hypothyroidism especially on a combination thyroid replacement. The T3 content is known to suppress the TSH. This is why the actually thyroid hormone levels and their ranges are very important not necessarily the TSH. TSH is Thyroid Stimulating Hormone - it's not a thyroid hormone. Going by TSH has been proven to lead to under treatment.
Yes, it was actually over the suggested range (in a range about 11-22, I was 24 and my tsh was .093, too low.) I only get t4 here in Poland, you can't even fight to get ndt or t3 unfortunately. I asked my endo last month why that is. (Having spent a few years in UK where I found this forum, I know there is more out there). She gave the standard pharmacy reply that ndt is not always accurate for dosing etc, etc but did admit that perhaps 5% would do better on it. (not sure how many people that would be here but probably a few thousand). And then she said, "but it's thyroid from a COW!" and shuddered. I almost laughed. She is a pretty good doctor generally but they are all so brainwashed by big pharma, who sponsors their medical training and career...
It is a little high and so yes would probably lower but then you would hope she would consider your Ft3 level. Did they test it? Because if your conversion is poor, like it or not, you would need some T3 added in. The only other thing you can do is to ensure your vits minerals are optimal (not just in range) that is B12, vitD, folate and ferritin. And try going gluten free for a few months to see if that helps.... Or not.Really feel for you. The ban on T3 just isn't logical and seems to have developed its own pathway no matter what rational argument is put forward for it....
She always tests ft3. Mine was 6.08 on a scale of 3.5-6.5, so at the high end. I don't feel bad generally. I've tried gluten free and it doesn't seem to make a huge difference. It would just be nice to have choices. I did try t3 (on my own) for a bit in UK but it wasn't a proper trial. It didn't seem to help much and it's so hard to get that I just left it. The worst problem is the weight gain on t4. It just doesn't come off. ☹️ But otherwise, compared to what some people here go through, I feel thankful.
A.... Judging by those results seems to me it is converting well so what you report T3 not really helping adds up. It's a question of whether it's getting into your cells. To that end am guessing you've optimised the vits mins above?
I take all my vitamins. This Dr actually got me on Vit d and niacinamide years ago. As I've read more, I've added others. Selenium was a key one for me. Thanks for your interest and care. I hope your situation is good and everything working as best it can. 🙂
And then she said, "but it's thyroid from a COW!" and shuddered.
Most NDT actually comes from pigs, not cows. I'm a meat eater and will eat both beef and pork, so the fact that NDT has ingredients coming from animals is not an issue for me.
If anyone ever mentions cows or pigs in relation to NDT in future ask the person if they eat meat e.g. sausages, bacon, steak or whatever is appropriate.
If anyone ever mentions T3 and suggests that it is addictive, just remind them that they have T3 flowing through their veins, and quite possibly have more than you have even if you are taking T3. The same comments apply to T4.
The nonsense doctors speak about thyroid hormones makes me furious!
Insulin was from animal sources until synthetic/lab-produced versions became available in the early 1980s. And some porcine insulin is still listed by the MHRA as approved products.
Then we have heparin, gelatin, lactose, shellac, carmine and some other substances.
Well said Humanbean. 👏👏Just shows how ignorant they are. It's quite shocking to hear. Sadly these days am even more in shock when a doc spouts from an actual knowledge base.... Rare species in my world. 🙄
Hi waveylines, please have another look at the original post. DizzyD has hypo thyroid results and hypo symptoms. The results suggest under medicated. Perhaps DizzyD is not absorbing thyroid medication very well at the moment. The info I have read regarding elevated TSH after suddenly introducing high doses of iodine are said to be transient but I have not looked into the research deeply enough to have a clue as to whether high iodine could be responsible for DizzyD's current thyroid results. 🙂
Thanks Limonene appreciated. Dizzy and I are private messaging each other. As we are both suffering. The effects of Amiodarone are awful even when stopped for weeks. I'm suffering the same problem. She's been on an exceedingly low dose of thyroid hormones as advised by an Endo because the Amiodarone produces DEA and this interferes blocks T3 conversion and uptake at cellular level. It can also cause problems with major organs causing damage. I though it was the iodine that was causing the blockage but not the whole picture. but that does cause problems as well. She did increase her thyroid meds since which her levels whilst not normal have improved.... But who knows what will be going on at cellular level. Amiodarone has a very long half life and takes months to leave the body.I've decided to see a private Endo as my thyroid dose is also far too low but all I can now tolerate. It's a mess!
So sorry to hear you are having such an awful time. Sounds like the drug has taken a major toll on your body. Nature is an amazing thing though and I would hope that given time your body will heal and recover from your ordeal. x
Thanks Limonene. 😊 It will but not till the Amiodarone has gone. Till then it's an enforced chemically induced Hypothyroid state that you can't get round. Hey ho...
Isn't it normal for THS to be low if T4 an T3 are high? TSH low? Doesn't this mean pituitary gland is not releasing any TSH (hence low), because it (pit gland) had detected your T4 an T3 levels are high enough so it's not releasing any more TSH? In comparison my TSH 11.9 high T4 an T3 low. My pituitary gland releasing TSH in order to stimulate thyroid gland (which I don't have) to release T4 an T3.
Cytotoxic means Amiodarone kills cells in body. That's what it designed to do. No idea what actual cells are killed but I imagine Amiodarone targets cells in thyroid (if you have a gland) heart, kidneys, liver and lungs...these are all parts of body that can be damaged by Amiodarone as per mentioned 're side effects of this drug. Ohh they not permanently dead, sure they regenerate after period of time. The human body is Marvellous thing!
Thanks to you limonene7 and this forum i already feel better because jigsaw is falling into place. Via info you sent, my wandering mind has accepted final conclusion (piece of jigsaw) and i now have some peace of mind. Priceless!
I notice there are some reports of antioxidants protecting cells from the drug. Whether or not antioxidants would help with your recovery, I have no idea. I imagine looking after yourself, keeping stress at bay etc and time will ultimately be the healer for what the drug might have done to your body.
Thank you limonene for link. Surprise, surprise...paper referred to Vit C and NAC as a method to help reduce harmful effects of Amiodarone. Finding were not conclusive but regardless of that I have been taking high doses of vit C and NAC for quite sometime now and will carry on taking them. The only way is up! Sincere thanks
Something else to consider is the amount/type of filtered/unfiltered water you may/may not be drinking. Fluoride, if you are drinking unfiltered water, mimics iodine and attaches to iodine cell recepters blocking the ability for iodine to enter cells. "IF" you are drinking a lot of unfiltered water (with typical levels of Fluoride) and taking a drug with a lot of iodine, it could possibly raise your levels..
It's a combination of both Sharoosz. A more nasty drug I've not encountered. I found it all very confusing as it's very complex..... taking me time to absorb and understand!! 😊
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