I am currently taking T3 (tiromel) and feel good… daily amount taken in 62.5mcg per day in 12.5 mcg amounts.. throughout the day.
I had a recent blood test and had the below.. I did not stop T3 before test
TSH - 0.01
FT4. - 4.0
Is this expected taking T3?
it is quite important to test T3 if you are taking T3 only. Could you put the range for the T4? A suppressed TSH is normal on T3 only. Are you symptomatic?
Not symptomatic at all… feel great since taking T3… but the test I did only tested FT4 and TSH… but was curious if low FT4 is normal or a worry.. low TSH is understandable.. do I need to see an Endo?
Also carry a lot of weight measure 36% body fat.. should I be taking more T3?
we can’t really tell if your FT4 is low because you haven’t put the ranges, but if you’re T3 only and asymptomatic then your T4 will be below range and it doesn’t matter.
Re. The weight - how long have you been T3 only? Are you losing anything? Are you overweight? 36% body fat in a female might be appropriate but it depends on the factors, what is your age?
I am male 46 urs old and go to the gym 4 days a week doing 1hour + of strenuous weight training.. carry a lid of muscle, but feel I should be lower fat percentage. I have been on T3 for a year now… raised from 6mcg to 62.5 mcg.. I feel ok.. hard to loose weight as gained loads of muscle, so scale doesn’t move. I used to do Keto and the Carnivore. And my TSH was 3.8 and cholesterol 8.1, and so decided to quit Carnivore and start eating not carbs… I feel great and look ok.. just have this belly slap, that won’t go away below my stomach over my pelvic bone..
My HBA1c was above range (45) as well, and feel my fat mass contributes to that..
Cholesterol down to 6.7
My FT4 was below the clinical range of 10- 22..
ah OK. I did keto/carnivore for 14 months and I lost huge amounts of weight/lowered inflammation initially but then it ruined my metabolism - it’s the worst thing I’ve ever done for my health, I’m glad you’re eating carbs. Keto slows metabolism *very* significantly, and the belt of fat you describe around your stomach is likely cortisol-related as keto is so reliant on adrenals. Long term keto also contributes to insulin resistance, which may explain your hba1c and trouble losing weight.
Have you looked into ray peat? It is a diet designed to support thyroid function, many people who eventually find carnivore “fails” for them shift to ray peat. How do you eat now?
I do follow Ray Peat intimately and that is what I do now… thus taking T3, Pregnenalone and Progesterone.. my HBA1C was good on Carnivore (37) now 45… I have orange juice and salt with 2 Aspirin with magnesium and niacinimide when I wake up. Then latte with honey and molasses and salt… 2 bananas and another latte no honey etc.. banana or pear with low fat cottage cheese for lunch.. latte in the afternoon. Dinner is milk, 3 egg yolks, coffee, salt and honey.. 2 Aspirin… Carrot salad..Am I eating to many calories in sugar etc?
What else can I do for cortisol, as progesterone and pregnenalone are aromatise inhibitors..
I have loads of energy in the gym and built good amount of muscle.. weigh 120kg….
Is there anything I can do/ change?
Ah I see, sorry I was confused.
It looks like you barely eat any protein. Are you trying to avoid iron?
I think you should test DHEA and saliva cortisol. Are you testing progesterone and pregnenalone to see where your levels are?
thx .. will test cortisol.. I have a good pulse rate 85 bpm.. warm hands and good 37 degree body temp … I assume due to T3..
I haven’t tested progesterone or pregnenalone, as sleep well and have great skin.. no longer dry and scaly.. bowel movement is good as well.. perhaps carrot salad..
85 is a little high, I thought RP preferred around 75? But in any case, I wonder if you’re on too many sex hormone meds… your estrogen might be too high or something.
Did you have hypothyroidism before carnivore?
I take progesterone and pregnenalone to reduce Estrogen… and carrot salad.. not sure it is an Estrogen issue, as was bloated before taking these, and felt was high Estrogen. Do you feel I eat too much? I don’t get hungry… but did do OMAD ( fasting) as well on Carnivore.. before RP protocol.
I didn’t check my thyroid until I got into RP post carnivore and so unsure..
Should I dropT3? As I may be euthyroid now?
I still think your diet has way too little protein, and maybe some more plants. I know RP is against it but I think for endotoxin 1 carrot salad might not be enough.
The progesterone will likely temper the estrogen but the pregnenalone is a precursor to sex hormones including estrogen, so I’d assume it will raise it.
What was your thyroid result when you checked it before taking T3? We need this to work out if you have a hope of being euthyroid now. Being euthyroid will largely depend on whether you have thyroid disease, or whether you decided to take T3 because you wanted to follow RP. We also really need your T3 blood results.
I think you should test things a bit more because just going by “feeling” you have high X, Y, Z isn’t safe. Sex hormones really run the body so it is a good idea to make sure things are within the right limits 😊
understood on all of the above… as mention my TSH was 3.8 last year post carnivore, and was cold and felt high adrenals.. since taking T3 feel great! I know feeling is not an exact science…. But is what we have all day everyday..
I agree on more protein… I eat eggs and homemade biltong.. so do I need more?
Yes, I only say from experience, I believed I had high cortisol which was actually very badly low cortisol and I had been taking all sorts of supplements to lower it… this forum esp. will definitely advise that you test.
So what I want to get to the bottom of is if you were hypo BEFORE carnivore. Like why did you do carnivore? Do you have hashi’s? Were you medicated prior?
I did Keto and carnivore as was pre-diabetic and lost loads of weight doing it.. but then had high TSH and very high cholesterol (8.1).. and RP said the 2 are related… taking T3 has lowered cholesterol (6.7)… better than 8.1..
but doing RP… I have put on 18% more body fat.. and so ultimately want a way to get lean, but be healthy… I had a better HBA1c in carnivore, and so now thinking was it that bad?
I think if you want to improve your hba1c then you need to reduce your simple carbs intake and increase your protein. I really don’t recommend going back to carnivore, ultimately it leads to electrolyte deficiencies, nutritional deficiencies and the adrenal stress can make the thyroid unstable.
So you don’t know if you were hypothyroid before carnivore? “High TSH” - do you mean above range or high in range? How high are we talking? but you had high cholesterol (which is a marker of hypothyroidism but can also be caused by other things). If you feel well and don’t show signs of over medication then I guess you’re OK, but I really think you need to test T3, drop the pregnenalone, test your progesterone (are you taking progest-E or medical grade progesterone?) and include more protein and fewer simple carbs for the hba1c, how are your trigs?
will add more protein.. and lower simple carbs.. I never have blood sugar issues, and feel my blood sugar is good… confused on why HBA1C was high..progesterone is diosgenin gel from Amazon…not pure progesterone cream.. Will test T3…
Trigs was high when I did the blood test but I was not fasted and had orange juice and honey and a latte before the blood test… I should do another test fasted…
hba1c is a measurement over 3 months, you won’t be able to “feel” hbac1 unless you have very uncontrolled, full blown diabetes but even then that would be an insulin issue you’d feel “in the moment,” which you’ve presumably also not measured.
yes I think less simple carb more protein is a wise move 😊 and do try to get that FT3 tested at the very least!
do I test FT3 while on T3 or stop taking it for a few days? Also what range am I looking for?
You don't stop taking T3 before a test. You split the dose the day before and take last part of dose 8-12 hours before the test. What you have to stop, if you take any, is biotin or any supplement containing biotin (eg B Complex) as biotin gives false results for any blood test unless it's stopped 3-7 days before. (as per Seasidesusie’s advice)
My understanding is that T3 only you want to be just above range.
I take T3 in 12mcg dosages throughout the day in 3 hour+\- intervals… so I stop taking 8- 12 hours before blood test and take no B3?
B3 is fine, biotin is B7. Yes, stop T3 8-12hrs before the test.
thx… I had raised ALT score… could that be I drank coffee or had the test non fasted… what could cause ALT to be raised.. taking T3?
It’s unlikely that raised ALT is caused by T3, low T3 would be more likely. How raised was it, above 45?
yes ALT was 51….
I think you should increase the protein and lower the simple carbs, maybe the liver will appreciate that. Also I am really thinking the pregnenalone is overkill.
thx you have been very helpful!!
no worries 😊 hope you can get that hba1c down 🙏🏻
is fruit ok only honey and molasses not.. define what carbs I should have?
Rice… pasta sourdough?
I think the most important thing is that you are pairing carbs with protein, having them bareback is going to make your blood glucose very high.
Fruit, honey, molasses - simple sugars
Rice, pasta, sourdough - complex (contain different starch types that will slow digestion and therefore blood sugar rise)
Whichever you have, have it with protein.
thx
I see this is your first post and not knowing how you arrived at your current regimen might be a factor in making a decision. I am doing a female version of what you are doing. My FT4 is lower than yours and truthfully I don't know if I should try to raise it but without some sort of sign I don't intend to. I would probably only add T4 and not reduce T3. It's just a personal opinion. Your FT3 could be several points over range when tested.
Crocodile7992
I had a recent blood test and had the below.. I did not stop T3 before test
You don't stop taking T3 before a test. You split the dose the day before and take last part of dose 8-12 hours before the test. What you have to stop, if you take any, is biotin or any supplement containing biotin (eg B Complex) as biotin gives false results for any blood test unless it's stopped 3-7 days before.
TSH - 0.01
FT4. - 4.0
Is this expected taking T3?
Taking T3 lowers/suppresses TSH, and as you're taking T3 only there will be a very low FT4.
do I need to see an Endo?
Endo would probably flip if he knew you were self medicating at such a dose, they don't understand T3.
Why are you taking T3 only? Do you have a diagnosis of hypothyroidism and have had Levothyroxine in the past?
Also carry a lot of weight measure 36% body fat.. should I be taking more T3?
T3 is not a weight loss drug. You cannot tell if you need more or less T3 unless you test FT3, when taking T3 it's absolutely essential to test FT3 as it's this test that tells you if you are over or under medicated. If you are self testing as opposed to GP test then buy a test that includes TSH, FT4 and FT3. If GP is testing does your GP know that you take T3?
thx appreciate the response…never told GP.. as wanted to see results… if I feel good with loads of energy.. should stop T3?
should stop T3?
Nobody can say. You need to test to see where your FT3 level is.
Do you have a diagnosis of hypothyroidism? Have you ever been prescribed Levo?
ok will get FT3 tested… I did have a TSH of 3.8 last year and albeit below the4+ range is high, and as was doing Carnivore decided to take T3 to help… which it has as TSH is ultra low..
Your TSH is low because you're taking T3.
So you don't have a diagnosis of hypothyroidism nor have you ever taken Levothyroxine. Sounds like you're playing with fire and just want T3 as a weight loss drug. I hope you're getting your Tiromel from a reputable source and not a body building site.
why playing with fire? Yes Tiromel is from pharmacy in Turkey.. not looking for weight loss only… wanted more energy and not fall asleep every time I ate.. and gaining weight eating 800 cal diet..
some things to consider ( in no particular order):
taking T3 has supressed your TSH .
TSH (Thyroid Stimulating Hormone) is a message from the pituitary gland to the thyroid gland asking it to produce more /or less thyroid hormones (T4/ T3) .
So taking T3 has turned off nearly all of your own thyroid's production of T4 and T3.
T4 is the 'inactive' & long life pro-hormone which the body turns into the 'active' & shorter life T3 ,
So ..... ? does turning off your own supply of T4 matter if you are taking synthetic T3 anyway to replace the T3 you would make from T4 .? Well ... it might .
T4 has a half life of 7 days in the blood ,, it therefore provides a stable/ continuous store cupboard for the cells to make T3 from.
T4 may have other complex roles we don't fully understand. Some people on here who take T4/T3 combo feel really lousy if their T4 level is low , despite their T3 level being fine ... whereas some feel ok taking T3 alone, even if they then have very low T4 levels.
TSH also has effects on conversion of T4 into T3 .... you've turned your TSH off .. so as well as turning off your own production of T4 and T3 .. you have also slowed down your ability to convert any T4 you do have, into T3 .
I think ? Cells in some parts of the body prefer to get their T3 via conversion from T4 (as opposed to taking it from T3 produced from the thyroid) ( i've forgotten which parts , sorry, might have been brain ?)
The natural system is infinitely variable in the amount of T3 it can provide in response to demand , a fixed daily dose of replacement hormone is not. TSH feedback allows the thyroid to increase T3 :T4 ratio . (a thyroid doesn't only produce T4 it also produces some 'ready made' T3)
in theory T4 production 'should' resume (at whatever level thyroid was previously capable of) if you stop T3 and your TSH goes back up _ but this could take a long time because the TSH can be very slow to respond when it's been supressed .. and there is no guarantee things would return to the exact same levels you had before ,, the balance of the HPT axis can be temperamental if you fiddle with it .
(HPT =Hypothalamus/Pituitary/ Thyroid axis)
Taking replacement thyroid hormones for life ,out of necessity (if the thyroid is no longer able to produce enough T4/ T3 due to damage / disease) leads to some unavoidable compromises in this highly complex and finely balanced system .
~it's just not possible to balance fT4 / fT3 /and TSH at the same levels as they were when the thyroid was dynamically involved in producing variable amounts of T4/T3 for itself.
Turning your own thyroid off out of choice by taking a TSH suppressive dose of T3 without first finding out what , if anything, is wrong with the thyroid .. (and then not replacing any T4, and then not testing the active T3 level ) is ... erm .. well i don't know if it's playing with fire ,or not ....... but it's certainly fiddling with the knobs.
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