Ashwagandha

[Hypo65]

I now have Hashimotos, reducing the carbimazole from being hyper. My TSH and T4 has returned to normal and expected to go hypo and Levothyroxine to be prescribed after next blood test, my TPO is more than 1300, energy zero! Even though it’s a member of the nightshade family does anyone have experience of taking Ashwagandha and has it been helpful? Would you recommend? Thanks

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Hypo65

There are some "Related Posts" you might want to check out - to the side of your post of on a PC or scroll down of on another device.

I would suggest doing some research, Ashwagandha is known to lower cortisol so you might want to check that before considering supplementing. Best adrenal test is one that measures both cortisol plus DHEA not just cortisol alone.

[Hypo65 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Ah, thanks. I had an adrenal test, the one were they take blood, inject you with hydrocortisone and then take blood 30 minutes later and my cortisol reaction came back low but not low enough for treatment. Guess Ashwagandha won’t help for energy then. Just fed up of being exhausted. Thanks for your help.

[Hidden in reply to Hypo65]

If you've had a short synacthen test that shows low cortisol then you don't want to be taking Ashwagandha as it lowers cortisol.It may be worth getting your cortisol levels checked again a few months after the SST as cortisol may be lower again.

[radd]

Hypo65,

Yes but I don’t have Graves, just Hashi, and Ashwagandha seems to be like marmite in that you love or hate it depending on how your immune system works.

TH (T-helper cells) are lymphocytes, WBC's that recognise foreign pathogens (or in the case of Hashi, normal tissue) & initiate the cytokine (antibody) response. These are divided into subgroups that do different jobs such as deal with viruses, certain bacterias, toxins, allergens, etc.

There are loads but the two main groups associated with Hashi, Graves and other autoimmune disease such as Celiac, RA, Sjoren’s Syndrome are TH-1 (pathogens inside our cells) and TH-2 (extracellular pathogens, ie blood & body fluids).

In a well-functioning immune system, both groups of these T-helper cells work together to keep balance & as different circumstance dictate we continually switch between the two (& many others) to eradicate threats.

Both Datis Kharrizian & Isabella Wentz state that most Hashi sufferers are TH-1 dominant and it is this that dictates whether Ashwagandha will be tolerated. Not only is it the TH-1 that induces the exact inflammation that Ashwagandha is matched to easing but in those who are TH-2 dominant Ashwagandha can actually exacerbate their symptoms.

If you are allergic/intolerant of nightshades, I would avoid. Having said that it is one of my favourite adaptogens and I take it loads for everything as it just makes me feel better.

[Hypo65]

Thank you, I seem ok with nightshades but just looking for something to help with energy, lower the TPO antibodies and not mess with cortisol. Even the consultant said he was baffled with my hyper to hypo to hyper and back again and the TPO levels. I didn’t have the blood market for Graves, which they thought it was.

[radd in reply to Hypo65]

Hypo65,

Are you saying you were prescribed carbimazole in the absence of positive TRAb's? 😳

If so there have been a few members previously who have also had their Hashi fluctuations mistaken for Graves by misguided endos. Your poor body.

Ashwagandha tends to lower cortisol, although I have taken it for quite some time and it appears the lowering effect stops when cortisol 'normalises. It just makes me sleep so well and if you start reading of its benefits you will know it helps utilise bloods sugars, lowers cholesterol, reduces inflammation, etc, etc ...

Have you tried a g/f diet and supplementing selenium to try reducing TPOAb's?

[Alanna012 in reply to radd]

Can I ask how you dose it radd. Do you take it several times a day?

[radd in reply to Alanna012]

Alanna012,

Nope, just once a day. Usual dose about 400-500mg, Seeking Health or Moss Nutrition.

I have read you are not suppose to supplement continually so have roughly six weeks on, six weeks off. I am not supposed to have too much because it contains a small amount of iron and I have iron-overload.

I take less during the summer anyway because life is just calmer, lazier, less stressful beneath those warm rays, and tend to alternate it with Curcumin which again is supposed to be more beneficial when dosed in cycles.

[Imaaan in reply to radd]

Why can't you take it continuously?

[radd in reply to Imaaan]

Sorry Imaan, but I can’t remember!

One of the few times I can’t substantiate and hence didn’t advocate for others to follow but just advised it is my own protocol. It might be because of it’s iron content and I shouldn’t supplement iron. Equally it is one of the more potent adaptogens.

I originally supplemented under the guidance of a nutritionist to enhance GABA levels and have kept (on & off) at these dose levels. A cumulative effect is supposed to peak at 4-6 weeks (500mg doses that research has found to be most beneficial), but I feel these benefits much quicker.

I tend to read Datis Kharrizan (great knowledge on neuro stuff) & Isabella Wentz, & thought it IW who advised cyclical dosing but can’t find where, so maybe DK 🤷‍♀️.

[Imaaan in reply to radd]

Thanks for taking the time to respond. I wasnt looking for evidence per se but was curious to know your reasons behind the comment since you know a thing or two about adrenals

[Imaaan in reply to radd]

Can you pls share what other supplements you used to heal your adrenals??? I'd rather send you a pm but on your profile you mentioned that you prefer responding to others on the open forum.

[radd in reply to Imaaan]

Imaaan,

Haha, I used to be Queen Of Supplements & there's no one magic cure but a wholly given approach …. addressing gut issues, amalgam removal, optimising thyroid meds, balancing sex hormones, managing stress, patience and rest, rest, rest, etc, etc …. sometimes big life style changes, that is what improves years of badly compromised adrenal function.

Dr Wilsons book ‘Adrenal Fatigue. The 21st Century Stress Syndrome’ was my bible, until I discovered the forum in 2011 after finally a Hashi diagnosis. My own favourite supplements then were salt, and 1-3g of Vit C which I still take daily. I went through the Dr Wilsons range (since sold on but retaining the name) which have became ridiculously expensive, and now a days there are many cheaper equivalents.

I have tried glandulars several times, not just adrenal but all different glands without success although many members find them very useful. (They make me spacey & weird). I also periodically take liver support supplements (Vit E/ALA/Milk Thistle/etc) which I notice seem to positively help everything work better.

The forum is a little anti multi-vit-combos but when deficiencies have been properly addressed I'm a fan if the mix doesn’t include anything that risks inhibiting absorption such as iron/calcium. I have reduced my standard number of daily pills to 3 or 4 by using combos - Vit B complex that includes methylated forms, multi nutrient complex minus iron & iodine, Vit D+K2, and combo/single adaptogen(s)- favs atm are Ashwagandha & Curcumin. Shakes include Vit C, magnesium, pea protein & collagen (coz I’m not a great meat eater). I use Betaine HCL + pepsin/ACV & digestive enzymes/ox bile with meals to improve absorption.

If I was considering a blend of healing herbs for adrenals atm I would be looking at something like Seeking Health Optimal Adrenal, Nutri Adreset, or Power Adapt. There are many adaptogens and it is a case of seeing what suits. For glandulars I would suggest Dr Peatfields favourite, Nutri Adrenal.

Everything is hugely amounts better but I still have to pace myself.

[Imaaan in reply to radd]

Thank you for taking the time to write an in depth response.Its much appreciated. Wishing you a blessed 2022.

[Alanna012 in reply to radd]

Thank you! Interesting and it makes sense you would need less in summer.

[eiddew in reply to radd]

Hi radd

Cortisol, like I guess most of /all other hormones, has a circadian rhythm. It's highest in the morning, lowest towards midnight.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Just curious if you take ashwangandha at a specific time. Silverangel takes it at night, sounds like before bed time.

Circadian rhythm of cortisol

[radd in reply to eiddew]

eiddew,

I think taking Ashwagandha before bedtime is much more common because of its effects on the HPA axis, but I have also taken at lunchtimes and it still helped me sleep better. I am a big fan as amongst a mountain of other benefits, it just basically promotes me calm.

I originally took under the care of a nutritionist to help normalise HPT/HPA irregularities and balance cortisol release after optimising thyroid meds, addressing other health issues and having mercury removed followed by 6 months of chelation. Ashwagandha can’t be taken indefinitely so now a days I tend to have a bottle and then leave off for several months or when I feel I need some again.

Be aware I have noticed Ashwagandha has drastically reduced cortisol & induced horrible side effects in some forum members, so there can be a preference towards Rhodiola. I think with adaptogens you have find one that does what you want it to and that you can tolerate. Datis Kharrizian is a big believer of taking adaptogens that enhance how our immune system is working. See more here …. healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

[Hypo65]

Yes I was on 10mg for about 3 months, prescribed by endo, in the absence of TRab’s. Then I was told I had adrenal issues and was put on hydrocortisone tablets for three days until the consultant rang and said do not use, so errors definitely made there but I can’t find the truth.I’m still on carbimazole 5mg every other day for 6 weeks until the blood test and have been told I’ll probably go back onto Levo after that. TSH and T4 currently perfect but TPO more than 1300 when maximum should be 100 apparently. I did a celiac test and was negative but happy to give a g/f diet a go. Happy to try anything, had a year of various prescribing errors it seems. I do take selenium also. Can I ask, do you take thyroid meds with Ashwagandha?

Thank you, you’ve been really helpful.

[radd in reply to Hypo65]

Hypo65,

I think with such highly elevated TPOAb’s thyroid hormone fluctuations would be expected.

Yes, I medicate NDT + Levo. Don’t take thyroid meds & Ashwagandha at the same time though. I leave a couple of hours between.

I went from years & years of sluggishly inadequate cortisol levels never quite low enough for adrenal insufficiency diagnosis to relatively high cortisol after medicating thyroid meds.

[radd in reply to Hypo65]

Hypo65,

Any adaptogen's aim is to ‘normalise’ the HPA axis (hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal), and theoretically many are capable of both raising & lowering cortisol (known as ‘normalising’ or 'balancing'). However, most research regarding Ashwagandha points towards its abilities in lowering cortisol levels.

Apart from your endo's mistake that you cite above, I have also just noticed your reply to SeasideSusie advising your SST results were low. I wouldn't take Ashwagandha as a single supplement with low cortisol levels as it could exacerbate your condition.

You could try the adrenal glandulars that Dr Peatfield always advocated (I personally never got on with glandulars).

nutriadvanced.co.uk/nutri-a....

or the Dr Wilsons Adrenal Rebuilder range which I successfully used but they are expensive. Other considerations might be a combo including a small amount of Ashwagandha mixed with other goodies such as Seeking Health Optimal Adrenal . I'm quite into the Cordyceps Extract atm 😊.

[Silverangel]

I take two capsules each night and I’m sleeping better and feeling better for it, not sure if its the ashwagandha but I’m sure it definitely helps