Just a quick one - how much NDT are people taking. I take 2.5 grains per day to feel normal. What are others doing.
James
NDT Pole: Just a quick one - how much NDT are... - Thyroid UK
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3 grains. But have thought lately it might not be enough cos I’m knackered all the time. Need to do some bloods.
I am on 3 grains and feel like I’m getting back to my old self slowly. Very hopeful 🤗
I’m on 2 1/4 grain, and I’m considering upping to 2 1/2 grain a day. For about a year I was taking feeling good taking 1 3/4 grain, and then my TSH went up and my T3 and T4 went down. I think it was due to a change in the NDT formulation. After blood tests my doctor told me to increase to 2 Grains and 5 weeks later I repeated labs. My TSH was lower but I was still having hypo symptoms of hair loss, fatigue, anxiety, and the list goes on. So now 2 weeks later I’m at 2 1/4 and waiting to repeat labs next month. Hoping I can get my energy and feeling back to normal soon,
What is ndt I just take levothyroxine
NDT is natural desiccated thyroid made from pig thyroids. Levothyroxine is a synthetic (man made) drug that is T4 only. NDT is made from pigs thyroid, and it is a combination of T4 and T3. Our bodies need the T3 for energy. Some people are able to take levothyroxine and convert the synthetic T4 to T3 naturally in their bodies. Others of us are not able to successfully convert or change the synthetic T4 to T3, and that's why some people feel better taking NDT.
3.75, feeling pretty good although I may have to increase it to 4 soon.
3 grains although that might need to be increased, or t3 added. Next bloods will tell.
We are all different, and many factors affect how much medication that we need. It's pointless asking others what they take.
I wouldn’t say pointless. There are many misconceptions out there about how much to take, fuelled by doctors’ misunderstanding of how NDT works. So I don’t think it hurts to see the wide range of dosages taken.
Love the name!! I would say not pointless as the responses show an average which the questioner is close to. It has made me for one feel more knowledgable about doseage!
It depends what the TSH, t3 and t4 came back at. Not everyone takes the same amount. Most people take one or two 60mg pills per day. There are many different strengths as well. I take 6 grains of WP thyroid (natural) per day which is very unusual for anyone to take that much but, I have been on that dose for 30 plus years. I was on Armour thyroid for years and it worked great then, they reformulated it and it never worked the same since but, I do much better on natural desiccated thyroid as most people do. Naturethroid, WP, NP thyroid are a few.
Could you please private message me where you get your WP Thyroid from?
I live in Colorado. I don't think it would do you any good to know where I buy it from.
I used to buy WP Thyroid from International pharmacy in the US but they stopped production so it would be helpful if you could kindly let me know where In the U S you get your WP Thyroid from. Thankyou in anticipation
They have shut down and aren't making it anymore here in the states as well. Not sure what were going to take now. All the companies that make thyroid medication is either raising the prices so high or their plants have gone into making other medication. All of us hypothyroid patients are left out in the cold.
As Hypopotamus has said we are all different, I'm only on 1.75 so as you can see we cover such a wide range. Also as with NDT increases are usually slight, 0.25, so looking at the range a quarter at a time then the range is very wide!
Hi I’m on about 4 at the moment, depends on the individual. If you increase just take it slowly and see how you feel and if possible to blood test
2 1/4 but just had bloods back and just slightly over with freet3 tsh suppressed and t4 at 13 thought l was a bit over so am reducing back to 2 grains , wish there was a accurate way of cutting a 1/4 in half! I think l would be just below top of range for freet3
I don’t think the cutting accurately is that important because it soon balances up. I find teeth are the most accurate for 1/4 or less compared to the pill cutter. A scientific study on variations when dividing tablets on levothyroxine demonstrated it was of no significance. Of course Levothyroxine has a longer half life than T3 so it might be more evident with the T3 part of NDT but I am inclined to think it would not be greatly so and the T4 part would be similar to levothyroxine in this regard. You could try using your teeth on a 1/4 and see. Might depend on your brand of NDT as some are more crumbly than others
Actually hadn’t thought of that!
Will try am using Thyroid -s Thankyou
Ah same as me then. 1/2’s best with cutter, 1/4’s are ok (teeth better than cutter) I think 1/8ths might be feasible but a bit flakey with ones teeth may be have a catching receptacle to hand to get most of it. Worth a punt I’d say. My body does not like alternating dose changes but the same each day. Hope it does the trick.
2 3/4 grains
Thank you all. The reason I ask is when I look at Levo to NDT conversion tables my 2.5 grains equates to somewhere around 250mcg Levo, a massive dose for my 84kg. And I read all these warning about osteoporosis and suppressed TSH's. thoughts ?
TSH tends to be suppressed in people with hyperthyroidism. But it’s not that low TSH in itself causes osteoporosis. There’s a link between high T3 and osteoporosis (and high T3 causes suppressed TSH). Low TSH in itself isn’t the cause.
The research findings are skewed because so often, the research is based on the wrong trial subjects using the wrong variables.
It’s not as simple as doctors like to make out. Worry about your FT3 level, not your TSH.
4.5 grains and 57kg! Everyone is different and you need what you need, it's as simple as that. If you're t3 levels are low and you are symptomatic then you need more hormone regardless. My endo also says that there hasn't been enough research to say that high doses cause osteoporosis. If you were over medicated and suffering with hyper symptoms then that would be an issue.
I have no thyroid and no other health issues either. I take 2/5 grains of NDT per day. I am a 5 ft 8 inches tall, women and weight 9 st 13 lbs. It's very hard to compare people we are all so different. The only time I gained weight was after my TT when I was put on Levo for a few months and I gained 10 lbs and felt very ill.
2.25 grains
1 1/2 to 2 a day in winter of Nature-Throid. But felt ill and bloods not right on new pot, so reciently switched to T. Man where 1 little pink pill seems to be doing the job , most odd. Bloods in a few weeks will shed more light on the subject.
I don’t know how people taking 4 to 6 a day afford NT ! It’s so expensive now and with VAT and PO charge on top! And I have a brand new pot left which I cannot use😞. I wrote to RLC labs and asked to return it (worth a try as I was not told I was buying a totally different formula than before) but they are not replying to emails because of the volume they are receiving.
Has anyone notice that,on line, RCL labs are telling people to take NT on an empty stomach with 8 oz of water. I thought NT was better taken with food? How to administer it is not stated on their leaflet with the pot.
I was taking 4 grains of Thiroyd (slightly "underpowered", compared to others), with TSH stable at 0.4 for several months but then had a flare and went back to Levo for 18 months. Slowly built dose but TSH stuck at 2 to 3 until it suddenly went under-range and continued dropping despite staying on 175 mcg Levo. Certainly didn't feel over-replaced, so asked for a free T3 test and FT4/FT3 was over 4.6 so decided to add Thiroyd to Levo. Started at 1 grain + 100 mcg before settling on 2 grains + 50 mcg for a bit. Now taking 2.25 grains + 50 mcg.
This is really interesting to me as TSH readings 0.01-0.03 on Levo and doc advised reduce 159 mcg to 125 then as minimal difference in reading to 100mcg. Pretty sure from my history that I am NOT overmedicated - no shakes sweating and certainly no weight loss. My daughter takes NDT and thinks I shoukd try a mix so your post us rather encouraging! Thanks.
I had finished a three month course of antibiotics, so left it four months before getting tested, when my TSH had dropped from 2.0 to 0.2 (0.3 - 5.0). I'd made sure to keep to one brand of Levo. Unsure why, but my GP suggested I might want another increase, but I refused. For the following tests, TSH dropped to 0.13 and then 0.06, with free T4 ranging between 21 and 24 (9 - 25). I was regularly shivering, so asked for the free T3 test and then explained to GP why and how I wanted to try NDT (I suggested 100 mcg Levo + 1 grain as looking like "sensible" ratios, but I knew straight away they weren't right for me). On 50 mcg + 2 grains my body temperature and bowel movements improved quickly, along with other functions, but I've been tired this year, so may add 25 mcg of Levo. I've an 18 year history of Lyme disease, which I now know was inadequately treated. Chronic Lyme is denied (after adequate treatment, at least), yet I had a Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction when on antibiotics and I wonder if some drug side-effects I've experienced are due to stirring up the bacteria. Lyme disease is also said to mess with the pituitary and I've had some odd thyroid tests before and during treatment, with low TSH and lowish free T4, though I definitely have a high autoimmune component to the disease.
Thanks for responding. Yes there seem to be so many factors involved and not easy to unravel cause and effect. For Thirty odd years I've taken Levo and felt fine - no change. But purely based ina TSH reading another doc (my own asks how
I feel- how novel!!!) decided I should reduce Levo and now I'm beginning to think some NDT would help. It is true that people can have more than one auto-immune disease but don't think we have enough research to say there are links. One theory I heard was that having sunburn can dirt ot the endocrine system and can trigger autoAimmune responses.
That's interesting, as I'm very fair and have "turned lobster" several times. My father equally so, and he was a Desert Rat and later succumbed to rheumatoid arthritis. I think he was also undiagnosed hypothyroid. My GP has tested me for lupus twice, though I didn't see a particular reason to. I had to request a test for Sjogren's, after complaining about dry eyes and mouth for many months.
I had to have a test of cholesterol etc. soon after adding the Thiroyd, and those results were much better than before, including when I was taking 4 grains of Thiroyd, so I think they were helped by drinking cistus incanus (rock rose) tea.
I read someone's comment that Graves' antibodies can leave the patient with a low TSH but feeling hypo. I had been subclinical hypo then had a flare (one of several, during my life) and anti-TPO antibodies were tested. I once had an overnight hospital stay with concussion, so central hypothyroidism due to that may be a factor in some of my odd test results, but my GP shrugged it off, saying the tests couldn't be relied on!
After near 40 years I just want to go back to NOT thinking about it too much and getting on with life . .just taking my daily pills and having a yearly test (to please NICE guidelines I imagine. Last few tests I've realised were just TSH and not full bloods. Before I was fully diagnosed I was trying all sorts to feel better . .must have spent a fortune on homeopathy (and herbal stuff ) as they seemed to have something for all the crazy symptoms you feel when un- or under treated. Just building up to another test but will insist on full bloods. Really thyroid probs should be easy to sort . .especially if the patient is LISTENED TO. Instead they can diminish your quality of life, interrupt your career and waste good years of your life that you won't get back. Good luck with everything!
I take 3, increased to 4 for a couple of wks in July & felt energised then reduced again but some symptoms are returning - constant see saw eh? Good luck..
1.625 grains. I take a 97.5 (1/2 AM and 1/2 PM) and a quartered 32.5 (8.125)
I’ve just switched from 100mcg Levo to 1 NDT 60mg daily. I’ve been on Levo for 11 years but I fell ill this spring and noticed not converting to T3 well. I’ve just upped NDT to 1 and a quarter as TSH was slightly high at 4.86. I’ll see how I go. Big thing is that I have put on over a stone since August when switched to NDT. Anyone had big weight gains and if so what is the best method to lose it please. Maybe it’ll go naturally once my TSH is nearer 1.0? Thanks. Pam
Thank you for replying. I need to speak with my Endo to establish what dose I should be in then. No wonder I’m knackered all the time and putting on weight!
Thanks 👍
Hi James,
I take 2 grains every morning and 2 at night days a week and 3 at night 3 days a week.
I find 4 grains too little and 5 grains too much. It's taken several years to fine tune this. I started on 1 grain a day and gradually increased it when I found it tailing off. It took 18 months to get up to 4 grains and then another 6 months before that tailed off too. The last 12 months has been fine tuning and now I've been on this dose for a year with no more tail offs, so this is the right dose for me. My test results are on the high side, but not enough to concern my GP. Although that may be because they don't really understand 😉
Hi Ib003 - do you find exercise alters your requirements. I jog, cycle or swim 5 days a week for lunch. Today I did a hard 20km cycle in strong wind and I've gone low thyroid 2 hours later. I normally take 2.5 grains split 3 ways but today it will work out to 3.5.
I think it would affect me, in fact it used to. I struggle to exercise now dueto other pain related issues.
The biggest positive impact on my energy levels was taking the right supplements and getting into the top third of the range for VitD, B12, Magnesium,Ferritin and Folate.
I also take Betain HCI Pepsid to increase stomach absorption, Serraptase and probiotics. Liquid iron supplements were the last key to full energy. Interestingly my GP test results all showed in the normal range for vitamins, but I clearly wasn't as I had no energy.
I find NDT is only part of the puzzle to solve to get good health again.
My NDT needs changed a lot over the years but finally I feel I've settled where i need to be, but it's taken 4 years.
I hope you manage to solve your puzzle too. L x
I take 2 grains and feel fine
3.5
2.5 grains.
These were two experiments I did:
50mcg T4/1 tab Thyroid S (38mcg T4 / 9mcg T3)
TSH: 0.262 (0.27-4.20) FT4 11.5 (12-22) FT3 4.66 (3.1-6.8)
2 tabs Thyroid S (74mcg T4 / 18mcg T3); 6am/3.30pm TSH: 0.377 (0.27-4.20) FT4: 7.6 (12-22) FT3: 4.23 (3.1-6.8)
I feel more well on 2 tabs of Thyroid S, even though my FT4 is lower and FT3 about the same. With the Levo and 1 tab I had a hard heartbeat and didn't sleep so well.
I'm still playing about with my diet before changing dose again - finding that too low a carb diet also produces the hard heartbeat and early waking.
Should have included part 3 of the experiment:
25mcg T4/1 tab Thyroid S (38mcg T4 / 9mcg T3) TSH: 0.667 (0.27-4.20) FT4: 8.96 (12-22) FT3: 3.34 (3.1-6.8)
how long did you trial the two experiments before deciding on what suited you?
I did three months on each, and I've been on the 2 tabs of Thyroid S for 5 months now and feel quite reasonable. I am trying lots of things to get well though, apart from thyroid meds, at present it's saunas and ATP Fuel. My point being that even experimenting on myself, other things are shifting of course. I found it interesting to see fairly predictable changes in my FT levels though with the different levels of NDT and levo.
when is it best to take NDT?
Thank you for your reply.
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