Negligent endocrinologists should be hauled in front of GMC

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

This newcomer to the forum wrote this post about two days ago :

"Endo says I have mental disorder due to ongoing hypothyroid symptoms

TPO ANTIBODY 577.4 (<34)

TG ANTIBODY 601.5 (<115)

TSH 6.4 (0.2 - 4.2)

FREE T4 12.9 (12 - 22)

FREE T3 3.3 (3.1 - 6.8)

Is he correct? Thankyou

"

Pray – how can a highly paid endocrinologist say that this patient of his has a mental health disorder? It is there in black and white that she is suffering from Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis.

Why can’t this endocrinologist be put in front of the GMC? He has behaved in a negligent manner and has not adhered to the Hippocratic Oath. I am truly appalled and disgusted. This behaviour is continuing. It happened to me in both 1994 and 2006. Thyroid patients continue to suffer needlessly. A psychiatrist would not know what to do with this patient, as happened in my own case (twice).

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Because the GMC is an old boys club. Works like a boys' Public School - don't tell on the other chaps, wot. The reputation of the institution is at stake.

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Are there no women at all within the GMC? sorry, I can't sleep, perhaps my cortisol level is too high at night now !

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Why would women endos be different ? It is all about professional solidarity.

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Treepie I asked if there are any women within the GMC. And Angel_of_the_North said :- "Because the GMC is an old BOYS' club. Works like a boys' Public School - don't tell on the other chaps, wot. The reputation of the institution is at stake".

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Girls' public schools are just as bad - play the game and don't tell.

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Sorry to have to disagree! If you take a look at the GMC’s list of doctors who have been disciplined you will see it’s a very long one. It seems that doctors fail patients on a very regular basis in all sorts of ways and are regularly removed from the register or disciplined. mpts-uk.org/decisions/data/...

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Espeegee,

There are many such disciplinary proceedings.

Quite a number are for issues other than failing to diagnose and treat properly.

What we do not see very often is the sort of case which might be made out where, for example, a GP failed to request an FT3 test, or requested it but failed to chase up why it was not done, allowed out of range results to be ignored, etc. The sorts of issue that are reported very frequently here.

The endocrinologist saying a patient might have mental issues is probably somewhat difficult to get raised properly. Although obviously it is of great importance.

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I agree but I expect most people, myself included, just walk away angry and fail to follow it up. Like the endo who told me I wanted to be hypothyroid as an excuse for being overweight. I was both upset and angry so just walked away, in retrospect I could and should have complained to the hospital but I didn’t. You learn though and I wouldn’t leave it like that another time.

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From what is being said on here, you don't get anywhere anyway if you do complain. You get blacklisted. It's obvious to me now (that my brain is 100% working capacity) that the whole medical industry is bent, self serving, money grabbing, liars, who do not give one fig about their patients - overall. I got myself better

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Yes I agree Marigold22, we only have a chance if we go it alone, lucky if you can afford to though, it breaks my heart thinking of those who are unable to pay for their own meds & tests! Beggars Belief what is happening in 21st century Britain!

Evep

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Not all, my sister worked for 30+ years on a crash team in A & E night duty. It took her a one hour drive to work as well.

Her son, my nephew is a stroke consultant in the NHS. He is caring and does no private work, he believes in the NHS. It's a great pity there are not more like them.

However I have been ripped of by so called consultants who are only interested in their pocket this was in the private sector.

You only have to look at the row of very expensive cars in the reserved parking outside any private hospital, this moonlighting should be stopped. It's simply called GREED

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But even when they do request T3 tests on the form the Labs say they are unnecessary and wont do them I had Thyca and sometimes the labs wont even do the thyroglobulin tests, they are a law unto themselves.

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salty6,

The doctor shouldn't just leave it at "The lab didn't do that test."

As I see it, doctors are responsible for getting the required tests done. If the lab refuses, then the doctor should take up the issue and, if it comes to it, report the lab for failing patients.

Much of the time, we as patients can't even be sure which lab was requested to do our tests. (Especially as some tests are farmed out to other labs.)

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But how many are doctors (like Dr Skinner and Dr Myhill) who helped patients but went against the powers that be, and were criticised by other doctors - not their patients?

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They don't swear on the Hippocratic Oath anymore either!

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Oh. really?

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I've been trying to work out how long ago it was now. My husband used to take into the lecture theatre a Greek plaque with Hippocrates on it and quoted the oath to them. He had to give up work after an RTA in 1992 and I've a feeling they stopped before that. I can't understand why as informing them of the history of medicine and it's aims is no bad thing!

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It's pretty much optional..........and the wording has been somewhat modernised. I think it's more popular in the US. Seems to me that UK medical graduates have to organise their own Oath ceremonies for those that are keen. How sad.

I asked my GP if he swore the Hippocratic Oath and he said yes and then laughed that it was "some time ago". To him it felt right and was a rite of passage to him. He's a good man and does his best like many doctors who feel constrained by red tape and "bl**dy NHS box-ticking exercises" as he puts it and wishes that more emphasis is placed on gut health, incidentally a favourite of Hippocrates who was also keen on walking, lots of walking for mind, body and spirit. :)

More on Hippocratic Oath here......https://www.nasgp.org.uk/whats-the-point-of-swearing/

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The same mental problems happen with B12 deficiency...it happened to my brother. These folk seem to be neglected too.

As you say marigold22 it is truly shocking what has happened in this case and I do hope the person can get someone to treat them who actually knows their profession!

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And when you ask for a B12 test and the result comes back just in range you are declared normal, if you have no thyroid gland you should be at the top of the range My result was Serum vitamin B12 level 309 ng/L [180 - 914] nowhere near the top of the range wonder why I felt tired?

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The only person with a mental disorder is the Endo and the only way he would 'do no harm' is collecting cans. It beggars belief that people in this situation are not accountable, what other profession would get away with it?

In 2014 a neurologist announced that the loss of feeling in my toes, severe pins and needles, balance and speech problems were due to the need of some antidepressants. I haven't visited a doctor or any so-called specialist since.

My health is now firmly under my control and I have made a better job of it, and not an antidepressant in sight.

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They are accountable if you complain. If you walk away and just tell your friends etc. the “professional” will continue, you need to either write to the hospital trust or the GMC. They look at complaints all the time, if they don’t know they can’t act.

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Yes I think the first port of call is at the hospital you saw the endo at, the PALS service. They should be able to advise on order of procedure.

Info on PALS here:

nhs.uk/chq/pages/1082.aspx?...

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Bit late now, nearly 2 years since I went.

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Oh!

Well maybe the info will help others who have or are going through the same thing. We seem to be seeing a lot of oddness in consultations and outcomes.

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The hospital and PALS didn't work for me. Totally negligent endo who lectures medical students. I even reckoned he's 'done a naughty' with a female endo whilst 3 patients waited over 1.5 hours to see him. The female endo walked out of his office giggling like a school girl, mumbling something about 'sorry about that'. If she had not giggled, I would not have twigged.... she was an Endo. It was a hot summer day in June; I'm not stupid.

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Where's that startled smiley when you need it? :D

Carry On Doctor indeed.

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PS I had an appointment with an endo at a different hospital to the above stated. Was sitting outside on a bench as early; two nurses were on a break and we sat and chatted. They were both very loud and OTT, I told them this story of endo having S.x during patient time, and they both hollered and said : "Oh yes, it happens all the time". So I wasn't incorrect. :-)

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I once had a specialist complain on my behalf, but it was something very trivial - I had a biopsy that came back with a diagnosis of 'contact allergic dermatitis' - 3 other doctors scoffed when I told them my diagnosis & one decided to write a letter to the other doctor telling them there's no way to discern the "contact allergic" part from a biopsy. It's obviously not serious, but some doctors do take the time. You just have to get lucky!

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The only doctors they 'haul' in front of the GMC are those that actually helped their patients manage their thyroid conditions effectively and in the end they killed him... RIP Dr Gordon Skinner.

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I was once told by a Consultant that the painful swellings in my shin bones could be an allergy to cabbage. Not the TB & Crohns I was later diagnosed with after 22 weeks in hospital - some 44 years ago 😊 Erythema Nodusum - lumps - indicate many conditions including Crohns TB & Cancer - pity he wasn't able to ask Dr Google back in those days - I may have been sorted earlier 😴

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This would be funny if it wasn't so serious.Like so many stories on here,its the obsurdity that makes one's jaw drop.

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I am sceared 2 ask for help now coz they r saying they will put me in a mental home! I has underactive thyroid sence having my baby girl since having scans and testing they say its ok bt i have developed a goiter and anlarged thyroid now have no energy and tightness in my chest bt them idots seem 2 think im ok i duno wht else 2 do coz i have 3 kids 2 look after!!!!

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Hi Cassie101 Please write a new Post on this forum, say what you have said here and people will come along and help you. Your answer here will get lost in this post and you won't get the best replies. It needs to be your own Post. You are in a good place to get help and advice. I too was diagnosed with underactive when my baby was 8 months old and it does happen more than we realise.

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I was told my vitiligo was due to not washing properly.

I was told my allergy to iodine was all in my head, as he watched my skin blister.

I was told the surgeon not tying the renal artery, and me bleeding out, was my fault as "you made your arteries go into spasm".

I was told I did not have hashis as I was too thin.

I was told I did not need my adrenal gland.

All different Doctors. The depth of ignorance and lack of thought is frightening.

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DID NOT NEED YOUR ADRENAL GLAND...... sorry to shout :-)

That is just amazing.

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"Endo says I have mental disorder due to on-going hypothyroid symptoms"

I obviously wasn't there at the time but there are at least two possible ways of interpreting

One is that the endo is saying it is all in the patients head but another is that the endo was acknowledging that being hypothyroid can be a cause of mental disorders such as depression and anxiety. Personally the use of 'due to on-going' makes the second, or something akin to it more likely.

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You make a very good point Gambit62

Unfortunately, the member who wrote the post saying "Endo says I have mental disorder due to ongoing hypothyroid symptoms" hasn't made any further comment and didn't give any further information in answer to questions asked, eg dose of Levo, did she know that she had Hashi's, didn't comment when asked about vitamins and minerals.

So a fairly sweeping statement was made, very similar to many we have seen on here lately, so the natural reaction of members is to jump to the conclusion that she has another ignorant endo. But of course, something may be being done to help the member by an endo who understands that she is undermedicated and that is causing those symptoms and he was explaining that to her. Unfortunately, without any further comment from her we can't know either way.

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thank you SeasideSusie - I did see the original post and was aware of the lack of feedback on it.

Totally understand the assumption but just wanted to say that it was an assumption.

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Have made further comment if the post being referred to is my one

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Endo is saying symptoms are in my head if the post being referred to is my one and does not consider my symptoms to be thyroid related

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Yes Sashak, it was your case I was referring to. Thank you for confirming exactly what your Endo is saying.... ie symptoms are in your head and does not consider your symptoms to be thyroid related.

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I bet you that there are many, many people who have been diagnosed with a mental health conditions rather than hypothyroidism. Probably never had a blood test for their thyroid glands at all. Or TSH didn't reach 10 before being diagnosed.

There must be quite a few who have been incarcerated for months, if not years due to being undiagnosed.untreated and deteriorating badly .

I had a wide range of symptoms and not one doctor nor specialist diagnosed me at all. In fact my GP was surprised when she had an alert from the NHS Lab to get immediate prescription. She asked 'who gave you the blood test form' I said I did. (I had phoned the surgery from Scotland demanding that a form was left out for me). I had gone straight to the A&E from airport and kept in overnight discharged as 'probably viral with high cholesterol' still wasn't tested..

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How about writing a farce for the stage and then a film, about endocrinology?

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A doctor may express an opinion but it doesn't make them negligent. It's up to us to ask them to evidence or prove their opinion and if they can't then we can refuse or accept their opinion. Doctors have a lot of training that is useful for patients. We ask their advice based on their knowledge and experience but we don't have to accept their opinion.

The problem for thyroid patients is that GP's don't have specialist knowledge about thyroid conditions and unresolved symptoms but are being expected to treat hypothyroid patients. In addition most Endocrinologists are diabetic specialists. This means patients have nowhere to go to get specialist advice on hypothyroid problems within the NHS.

Thyroid imbalance can affect the brain so it becomes very difficult to manage appointments and healthcare without support or advocacy. When thinking becomes slowed then it's nearly impossible to work out whether the doctor is giving good advice or poor and try to research options. When trying to also hold down a job and care for a family then the challenge simply becomes overwhelming.

With 1 in 20 having thyroid conditions in the UK (a high percentage being women), then it seems that primary care needs some specialist input to treat unresolved thyroid symptoms effectively, speedily and with continuity when symptoms are ongoing but perhaps nowadays it's going to transfer to online forums like this?

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It's too bad that we can't state names of docs here...

We could make a great list!

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The problem is that physicians won't police the bad apples amongst themselves. If there were justice in this world, this Endo would be taken out to the woodpile and whipped.

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