New help please results added looking for T3

[Abbie89]

Could I be messaged a supplier for T3 please my T3 was stopped in August thanks now taking 50mcg levo

Diagnosed 2013

Tsh 5.9 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 13.0 (12 - 22)

Free T3 2.8 (3.1 - 6.8)

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Abbie

As you're a new member and there is no information in your profile, if you can post your latest thyroid test resuts, to include TSH, FT4 and FT3 (with reference rangess), and your thyroid journey and current medication, members are more likely to respond with source of supply.

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Was doing well on T3 now taking 50mcg levo thank you

Diagnosed 2013

Tsh 5.9 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 13.0 (12 - 22)

Free T3 2.8 (3.1 - 6.8)

[Abbie89]

Symptoms

sweats

difficulty swallowing

goitre

lumpiness in throat

constipation

muscle cramps

brain fog

depression

heavy periods

period pain

bladder infections

hair loss

puffy eyes

pale face

puffy ankles

joint pain

feeling cold

coldness to hands and feet

bruising

flaky nails

flaky skin

dry eyes

dry mouth

memory loss

dizziness

tinnitus

muscle stiffness

loss of libido

shakiness in legs and arms

eyelids feeling heavy

eyebrow loss

eyelash loss

loss of appetite

breathlessness

sore eyes

digestive problems

sugar cravings

salt cravings

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Abbie89

All this is very familiar and we are seeing posts virtually every day saying the same. Usually at the bottom of it is the endo doesn't really know what they're doing and we're finding the same problem with all the people who've posted like this and T3 is a very small part of it, there are other major problems that have been overlooked.

Some of your symptoms are hypo related due to being undermedicated. However, quite a few of could be indicative of low nutrient levels? Have you had the following tested, are you supplementing with anything for any of them:

Vit D

B12

Folate

Ferritin

Have you had thyroid antibodies tested - were they high - Hashimoto's?

Salt and sugar cravings can indicate adrenal problems, has this been investigated?

Why was your T3 stopped? Have you got results from the test that prompted the removal of your T3?

Why are you on only 50mcg levo when your results show you are grossly undermedicated? What has your doctor said about these results?

Sorry for all the questions, but I think there could very well be a lot to put right rather than just adding T3 which wont solve a lot of your problems.

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thank you T3 stopped because of over replacement but surely if I increase by 75mcg levothyroxine and add 10mcg T3 like I did 2 years ago my results would be the same? Even back then I had low vitamins and minerals and I still felt better

TSH <0.02 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 20.8 (12 - 22)

Free T3 5.6 (3.1 -6.8)

TSH <0.02 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 20.6 (12 - 22)

Free T3 5.3 (3.1 - 6.8)

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

GP and endo don't know I am only on 50mcg levothyroxine

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Cortisol had come back low no further investigation

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Removal of T3 prompted by

TSH 0.03 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 20.8 (12 - 22)

[Abbie89]

TPO antibodies 704.5 (<34)

TG antibodies 358.3 (<115)

Currently gluten free have felt no benefit yet

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Abbie

Removal of T3 prompted by

TSH 0.03 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 20.8 (12 - 22)

Was there an FT3 result when these were done? If not then there is no way the endo would know if T3 dose was too much or not. If he is prescribing T3 the least he can do is understand how it works. Adding T3 will lower TSH and often suppresses it. So the fact that your TSH was suppressed is no reason to stop the T3, your FT4 is in range and chances are your FT3 was as well. You can only be overmedicated if FT3 is over range.

**

Cortisol had come back low no further investigation

Why no further investigation? If it's low it signifies a problem. It needs to be looked into, you need to ask for this.

**

GP and endo don't know I am only on 50mcg levothyroxine

How come? What do they think you're taking? If you've adjusted the dose yourself, why, what prompted it?

**

TSH <0.02 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 20.8 (12 - 22)

Free T3 5.6 (3.1 -6.8)

TSH <0.02 (0.2 - 4.2)

Free T4 20.6 (12 - 22)

Free T3 5.3 (3.1 - 6.8)

What were you taking when you had these results? They actually look pretty good, how did you feel?

**

TPO antibodies 704.5 (<34)

TG antibodies 358.3 (<115)

Currently gluten free have felt no benefit yet

As you are gluten free, presumably you know you are Hashi's and are trying to reduce the antibodies? Are you also taking selenium l-selenomethionine 200mcg daily which can also help reduce the antibodies, as can keeping TSH suppressed.

Gluten free can take a long time to help, but it doesn't help everyone. Some people need to be dairy free.

**

What about vitamins and minerals, have they been tested?

Hashi's and gut/absorption problems tend to go hand in hand and low nutrient levels are generally the result. In that case the absorption problem would need addressing so that nutrients can be absorbed, and nutrients need to be at optimal levels for thyroid hormone to work. So please post the results, say if they are current and say if you are supplementing.

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Free T3 5.6 (3.1 - 6.8)

I reduced it because they did not like overmedicated results of TSH 0.03 and free T4 21.1 (12 - 22) and they think I'm taking 150mcg levothyroxine

During those results taking 75mcg levothyroxine and 10mcg T3 but still didn't feel well

I know I have Hashimotos and eliminated gluten but not taking selenium

I supplement as well (5mg folic acid)

[Abbie89 in reply to Abbie89]

Folate 2.3 (2.5 - 19.5) folic acid restarted

Ferritin 10 (30 - 400) no longer taking iron

Vitamin D total 25.7 (25 - 50 deficiency)

Vitamin B12 148 (180 - 900)

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Abbie89]

Abbie

These are your latest results? Then you need to make an appointment with your GP as soon as possible to discuss them.

Ferritin 10 (30 - 400) no longer taking iron

What's the story behind this? Why are you no longer taking iron?

Were you tested for iron deficiency anaemia? Were you diagnosed with it? Do you still have results that indicate this?

For thyroid hormone to work (that's our own as well as replacement hormone) ferritin needs to be at least 70, preferably half way through range.

You desperately need an iron supplement and as your level is so low you should ask for an iron infusion which will raise your level within 24-48 hours, tablets will take many months.

You can help raise your level by eating liver regularly, maximum 200g per week due to it's high Vit A content, and including lots of iron rich foods in your diet apjcn.nhri.org.tw/server/in...

When taking iron tablets, take each one with 1000mg Vitamin C to aid absorption and help prevent constipaton. Always take iron 4 hours away from thyroid meds and two hours away from other medication and supplements as it will affect absorption.

**

Vitamin D total 25.7 (25 - 50 deficiency)

You are 0.7 away from severe deficiency and you need loading doses, do not accept a prescription for 800iu D3 daily - see NICE treatment summary for Vit D deficiency:

cks.nice.org.uk/vitamin-d-d...

"Treat for Vitamin D deficiency if serum 25-hydroxyvitamin D (25[OH]D) levels are less than 30 nmol/L.

For the treatment of vitamin D deficiency, the recommended treatment is based on fixed loading doses of vitamin D (up to a total of about 300,000 international units [IU] given either as weekly or daily split doses, followed by lifelong maintenace treatment of about 800 IU a day. Higher doses of up to 2000IU a day, occasionally up to 4000 IU a day, may be used for certain groups of people, for example those with malabsorption disorders. Several treatment regims are available, including 50,000 IU once a week for 6 weeks (300,000 IU in total), 20,000 IU twice a week for 7 weeks (280,000 IU in total), or 4000 IU daily for 10 weeks (280,000 IU in total)."

Each Health Authority has their own guidelines but they will be very similar. Go and see your GP and ask that he treats you according to the guidelines and prescribes the loading doses. Once these have been completed you will need a reduced amount (more than 800iu so post your new result as the time for members to suggest a dose) to bring your level up to what's recommended by the Vit D Council - which is 100-150nmol/L - and then you'll need a maintenance dose which may be 2000iu daily, it's trial and error so it's recommended to retest once or twice a year to keep within the recommended range. You can do this with a private fingerprick blood spot test with City Assays vitamindtest.org.uk/

There are important cofactors needed when taking D3

vitamindcouncil.org/about-v...

D3 aids absorption of calcium from food and K2-MK7 directs the calcium to bones and teeth where it is needed and away from arteries and soft tissues where it can be deposited and cause problems.

D3 and K2 are fat soluble so should be taken with the fattiest meal of the day, D3 four hours away from thyroid meds.

Magnesium helps D3 to work and comes in different forms, check to see which would suit you best and as it's calming it's best taken in the evening, four hours away from thyroid meds

naturalnews.com/046401_magn...

Check out the other cofactors too.

As you have Hashi's, when you buy your own D3 for your maintenance dose, for better absorption you should get an oral spray eg Better You. They do a D3 and a D3/K2-MK7 combo.

**

Vitamin B12 148 (180 - 900)

Folate 2.3 (2.5 - 19.5) folic acid restarted

Do you have signs of B12 deficiency - check here b12deficiency.info/signs-an... Think back to before you started folic acid because that can mask signs of B12 deficiency.

Please go over to the Pernicious Anaemia Society forum for further advice healthunlocked.com/pasoc Post these results, your ferritin result, any iron deficiency information you may already have, and mention any signs of B12 deficiency you may have had or are now experiencing. You will need intrinsic factor antibodies testing, you may have Pernicious Anaemia, you may need B12 injections. You should be off the folic acid to have these further investigations done, then B12 should be started before folic acid.

It's probably too late to post on the PA forum tonight, but make sure you post in the morning, then discuss their advice with your GP.

I have read (but not researched so don't have links) that BCSH, UKNEQAS and NICE guidelines recommend:

"In the presence of discordance between test results and strong clinical features of deficiency, treatment should not be delayed to avoid neurological impairment."

And an extract from the book, "Could it be B12?" by Sally M. Pacholok:

"We believe that the 'normal' serum B12 threshold needs to be raised from 200 pg/ml to at least 450 pg/ml because deficiencies begin to appear in the cerebrospinal fluid below 550".

"For brain and nervous system health and prevention of disease in older adults, serum B12 levels should be maintained near or above 1000 pg/ml."

**

Hashi's causes gut/absorption problems and the result is often dire nutrients, as yours are. Nothing will work with nutrient levels like this so you have to address the absorption problem. Check out SlowDragon 's reply to this thread for information and links to help healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

At this stage it's not T3 you need, you have to address the other problems first, get your nutrients at optimal levels, get your TSH down to 1 or below with a decent dose of Levo then see where your FT4 and FT3 lie before you can know if you need T3.

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Latest results

No longer taking iron it was stopped by GP and I don't know why and I have MCV 74.1 (80 - 100) MCHC 379 (310 - 350) haemoglobin 113 (115 - 150) iron 7 (6 - 26) transferrin 14 (12 - 25) thanks

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Abbie89]

Abbie

These results all say you are iron deficient. You must talk to your GP, ask him why your iron supplements were stopped, you must be treated, if necessary ask for an urgent referral to a haematologist.

Do not let this GP keep you ill. You have all these dire deficiencies which urgently need treating. See a different GP, change surgeries if necessary, but you have to get proper treatment and you have information above of what is needed, now insist on appropriate action being taken.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Abbie89]

Abbie

You weren't overmedicated with TSH 0.03 and free T4 21.1 (12 - 22) and Free T3 5.6 (3.1 - 6.8). FT4 and FT3 are in range. You can only be overmedicated if FT3 is over range. TSH is suppressed because you were taking T3, it does that. You weren't feeling well most likely because of nutrient deficiencies if those below were were from the same time, they bring their own symptoms.

I'm not understanding why you are letting your doctor's think you're taking 150mcg Levo, that could cause problems when needing a dose change in the future.

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thanks worried about losing weight and having tremors and sweats

[Abbie89 in reply to SeasideSusie]

GP and endo say sweats and tremor are hyper symptoms and because I'm slim I don't want to lose any weight

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Abbie89]

Abbie

The tremors and sweats are part and parcel of Hashi's. The antibody attacks cause fluctuations in symptoms and test results.

You can have hypo and hyper type symptoms, it's the nature of the beast - all the more reason to try and reduce the antibodies to slow down the attacks.

Gluten/thyroid connection: chriskresser.com/the-gluten...

stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

hypothyroidmom.com/hashimot...

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

Your low weight problem is likely to be connected to your absorption problem, so another reason to address that.

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Abbie89]

Your gut is badly affected as under medicated so can nit absorb nutrients easily

Clutter can offer advice on how to keep weight on

Suggest you make an urgent appointment, ideally with different GP

Today or Monday

[SlowDragon Administrator]

You absolutely have to fix low vitamins FIRST before taking T3

You're now extremely under medicated on just 50mcgs and vitamins likely absolutely dire

Gluten free is probably helping, but you won't feel the affect until Levo at higher level, bringing TSH back to around one and FT4 towards top of range

But also must fix low vitamins

Can you post most recent previous vitamin results

Plus get vitamins redone now, if not had them since T3 stopped

[Abbie89 in reply to SlowDragon]

In above reply thanks

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Abbie89]

So follow SeasideSusie advice on vitamins, and increasing Levo back up in 25mcg steps until TSH around one and FT4 near top of range

Remaining strictly gluten free

Then if your FT3 remains low, your body will the be ready for small T3 dose

You are unlikely to get full thyroid and vitamin testing from GP

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

Medichecks Thyroid plus ultra vitamin or Blue Horizon Thyroid plus eleven are the most popular choice. DIY finger prick test or option to pay extra for private blood draw. Both companies often have money off offers.

All thyroid tests should be done as early as possible in morning and fasting and don't take Levo in the 24 hours prior to test, delay and take straight after. This gives highest TSH and most consistent results

Email Louise at a Thyroid UK for list of recommended thyroid specialists [e-mail]