Supplements

[Gill007]

Hi . Is there ONE supplement you can buy to make sure that all your levels are optimum for conversion At present I am buying B 12 , selenium and iron tablets. I feel really well so don't want to stop but I think I will be rattling soon with all these pills . Thank you

[greygoose]

No, there is not.

You will not find a pill with just B12, selenium and iron. Besides, iron needs to be take two hours away from anything else, or you will not be able to absorb the something else.

And, that's where most multi-vits fall down. They cram together all sorts of things that shouldn't be crammed together, so you do not absorb anything. Plus the ingredients are rarely the best quality, the most absorbable. Plus they usually contain things you don't want, like calcium and iodine. Plus, they rarely contain enough of anything. Multi pills are just generally a bad idea. The exception to that is a B complex - which you should be taking if you're taking B12.

Sorry, but no.

[Gill007 in reply to greygoose]

Somehow I knew that would be the reply , but I asked just incase there was a small chance or a new product . Thanks for your reply Greygoose x

[greygoose in reply to Gill007]

You're welcome.

[Steni in reply to greygoose]

Hi, I notice you say calcium isn't a good idea. My prescribed Vit D tablets contain calcium as well, should I ask the doctor to change them?

[Marz in reply to Steni]

Steni VitD in adequate doses improves the uptake of calcium from foods - so additional calcium is not a good idea I have read. Are you also taking VitK2 MK7 - which directs calcium in the arteries towards the bones and teeth. Too much calcium in the arteries has recently been discovered to be the beginning of athersclerosis.

How much VitD is in your prescribed pill and what was your test result before supplementing ? Often Docs prescribe too little. Magnesium and Zinc are also important co-factors.

VitD is not expensive to buy - Healthy Origins is a capsule with olive oil which I buy from Amazon. Important as VitD is fat soluble so the olive oil covers that bit

[Steni in reply to Marz]

Thank you 😊

[Marz in reply to Steni]

How much VitD are you taking ?

[Steni in reply to Marz]

The prescription is for 3 x 400 mg chewable tablets daily.

[Marz in reply to Steni]

Yes but that is VitD and Calcium isn't it ?

VitK2 MK7 - are you taking that along with magnesium and zinc ? What was your level when tested ?

[greygoose in reply to Steni]

Common problem. Doctors know nothing about nutrients. They think they're prescribing vit D with a little bit of calcium, but if you read the label, it's actually calcium tablets with a little bit of vit D. And, that is really not what you want. It's very rare to be calcium deficient in the UK. Excess calcium can cause things like kidney stones, or even heart attacks!

[Steni in reply to greygoose]

Thank you again Grey Goose

[greygoose in reply to Steni]

You're welcome.

[Marz in reply to greygoose]

.... I agree. Nor do they tell patients about magnesium - zinc - VitK2 MK 7 it seems 😊

[greygoose in reply to Marz]

I doubt they know!

[Marz in reply to greygoose]

So true 😎😎

[helvella Administrator]

For such a product to exist, you have to think that there are many people with the same needs. Otherwise no company would have any reason to make such a product. Trouble is, we all vary. Each one of us also changes over time.

For B12, taking a product that has more than we need is of little to no consequence. For selenium and iron, excess is seriously bad. We have to able to stop selenium, or iron, or both, if needed - but might well not wish or need to stop the other(s).

[Gill007 in reply to helvella]

Thank you

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Simple answer - no.

Multis don't contain enough of anything to help, and frequently use the wrong form of the vitamin with the least bioavailability. Some vitamins and minerals shouldn't be taken together as they cancel each other out.

Are you just taking those three - B12​, selenium and iron? I think I take 10.

When taking B12 we need to take a B Complex to keep all the B vitamins in balance.

Iron must be taken four hours away from Levo and two hours away from other medication and other supplements because it affects their absorption. Iron also is best taken with Vit C as it aids absorption and helps prevent constipation.

If you think you need other vitamins or minerals you should test and only supplement what isn't optimal.

[Gill007 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thank you

[elaine2447 in reply to SeasideSusie]

I can beat that 13(no calcium or vitamin D due to pHPT) and rhodiola drops, lol! Edited worse than I thought!

[MiniMum97]

I also take about 10 tablets a day! Rattling around!

[shelbydaws]

I just learned vitamin A, D3 & K2 are for thtrpud support.

[HLAB35]

I'm a maraca, actually make that a pair

Contrary to previous.. where I would recommend a b complex, I've just started a trial of b vitamins...separately! It makes your three supplements look extremely modest.

It sounds mad / perversely contrary, I know. I just wanted to get a better idea of what I actually needed and kept me on an even keel. This is because many b vitamins are great for adrenal stress and aid rest, so better taken in the afternoon - b12 and folate, an iron tablet that contains riboflavin and biotin, are my morning ones; thiamine, b5 and p-5-p taken together mid-afternoon (for adrenal support) and niacinamide in the evening (helps control blood sugar overnight). There are two b vitamins - b5 and biotin that compete for receptor sites and I really needed the b5 to get absorbed. I have an issue with absorbing 3 vitamins - b12, folate and b6 and need to have them super bio-available.

This is me though, and I like to experiment - firstly on myself! I was already staggering my minerals, for similar reasons. I also take an array of fat-soluble vitamins as well.

I managed to do a huge amount of gardening, well into the evening over the weekend, so I think it's working to a point (energy-wise). However, I'm also getting a bit of mild neuropathy (CTS) and wonder if the b6 is getting properly absorbed, or whether by doing more physically I'm going to need more of something.

[Camdentown in reply to HLAB35]

This is really interesting. When you get a moment (😀) would you be able to post the brands that you use?

[HLAB35 in reply to Camdentown]

I'm not really very loyal to brands, so honestly cannot make a specific recommendation.. I like to be flexible as I don't believe I'm there yet (I get occasional pains from my left kidney area - so something's up with my adrenals to be sure). Thiamine hydrochloride is the best form of B1, for example as it is (apparently) less harmful to the liver than thiamine mononitrate. P-5-P is a coenzyme in the conversion of glutamate to GABA which is why it's particularly useful for relaxation and sleep. I don't have a favourite form of b5, or riboflavin (yet) and I believe that Niacinamide does come in different 'flavours' but I haven't honed in on the best one for me just yet! Niacin (the flushing version) seems to be pretty effective at lower doses.

I have to go easy on b12 as I'm borderline diabetic and my kidneys object to the mega high doses (5,000 iu)...I'm still only in the low 500's with blood levels, so it's not great... this probably explains my, also, low levels of iron. To be honest all this jiggery-pokery with supplements for conversion would probably be helped if I switched to NDT - I'm not getting any younger. Fortunately I am sleeping at night and getting stuff done in the day; not sure how long I can keep it up!

[Camdentown in reply to HLAB35]

Thanks for all this; it's interesting to know how other people tackle things. Sometimes it gets too complicated; O level biology was such a long time ago......😄

[Howard39 in reply to HLAB35]

Hi

I am really glad taking things separately work for you.

The rda for supplements was set in 1941 so is v outdated. Niacinamide tests done in 1940 proved we need it 3 times a day say 300- 500 mg. There is a new slow release tablet which is 1500 mg. it lasts only for a few hours hence the new tablet.

Having visited biocare labs I saw vit b profiles done- all a persons levels at once. Also in the correct dose biotin does not fight with any of the b vitamins. ( it's 3-1 ratio with b5- biotin the lower)

Vitamin bs are normally taken in the morning, earlier afternoon should be ok but later affects sleep.

As someone who has had v serious adrenal issues( diagnosed with full saliva tests on cortisol and dhea) I would never leave any adrenal meds to the afternoon unless it's a just in case situation.

I am in favour of doing my own thing and seperating meds when I can but definitely not the b without a proper profile first otherwise it's a guess. I've seen too many people end up with b12 on the floor and unable to correct it.

Neuropathy may be caused by low b12. It depends which type it is. Or peripheral is low in b6.( 200 mgs needed if it's that)

New research out shows b12 levels should be 600- 2000. We can live in hope on that one!!

Good luck with your supplements please just be careful not to end up with an imbalance.

[HLAB35 in reply to Howard39]

Hi, Please refer to the reply I gave above to Camdentown.

It's peripheral neuropathy as p-5-p seems to 'cure' it better than the b12? My ongoing low b12 symptoms include mild memory issues and general low tolerance of prolonged / hard activity along with iron def. anaemia, so there's some overlap, but my blood folate levels are high - so there's definitely an imbalance! I took non-methylated folic acid for many years: firstly, way back, when trying for a family and then in a cheap multivitamin that, on reflection, was frankly, useless.

I noticed there's more than one lab offering genetic profiling for problems with methylation of b vitamins. Any recommendations?

[helvella Administrator in reply to Howard39]

Please take note of our guidelines, specifically:

12. Members posting on Thyroid UK must only post information which is true and correct to their knowledge. If relevant, please provide references to health or medical information.

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

You state: New research out shows b12 levels should be 600- 2000.

That really does need references, please.

[Howard39 in reply to helvella]

Hi

Sure I can quote my consultant / boss in future.

[helvella Administrator in reply to Howard39]

I read "New research out" as the research having been published. Is that not the case?

[Howard39 in reply to helvella]

Yes their research which is published is what I meant.

[helvella Administrator in reply to Howard39]

Do you have a link, please?

[Howard39]

Yes it's v helpful is p5p for heart attacks strokes and nerve pain. I've seen it used in hospital on burning feet when people have the diabetic form. It should always be used with magnesium which helps relieve pain amongst other things. I have it in injections so I know the benefits.

Sorry I don't know what you are asking. Which lab to use?