Selenium Toxicity

[dang]

I've noticed that a lot of members are recommending selenium haphazardly. While it's true that selenium can possibly help, too much selenium can be very toxic.

Common signs of toxicity are hair loss, nail discolouration. Selenium treatment NEEDS to be done along side labs and with the help of a qualified doctor. I did 2 months of selenium treatment myself and ended up with a result of 194mcg/l (safe range is 50-150). And my Endo told me I had to immediately stop before it gets dangerous, this is in just 2 months of taking a low dose (200mcg). On top of that my antibodies actually doubled and my TSH went up and FT4 went down. So it's not just an easy, magical solution for everyone, it can actually be quite detrimental.

Guys if you're going to recommend selenium as a treatment please make sure the other person knows of the dangers, and that they need to be regularly tested for toxicity.

Cheers,

Dan

[Marz]

Always good to take a break .... so I leave mine behind when I go away ..

[dang in reply to Marz]

I didn't know to take a break... I didn't realize one bottle of selenium could send me over range.

[helvella]

A few years ago many, possibly most, of the selenium posts were recommending 400 micrograms a day. I posted quite often that I considered that too much, at least long term, with 200 micrograms being more than enough. From your experience, even my suggestion that less is adequate was too generous.

Pleased to see few 400 microgram products, and quite a lot of 100 micrograms.

Do you happen to know what level you had before taking any supplementary selenium?

You weren't an avid fan of Brazil nuts and north American wheat products?

[dang in reply to helvella]

I just checked my old results before starting: Sept 26, 2016: 99mcg/l (the range was 50-120 so according to this lab the upper limit is even lower).

I didn't start selenium until November. Completely Gluten Free and nut free (following AIP diet, so not even cross reactive foods). And I was never a fan of Brazil nuts either way

[Katepots]

Yes a lot of people take a lot of supplements as hock.

Very important to know levels.

There's enough Selenium in two Brazil nuts so that's what I take daily!

[dang in reply to Katepots]

Have you found benefits from taking selenium? Do you know if your antibodies have reduced?

[Katepots in reply to dang]

No my antibodies haven't reduced which I'm really pi^*ed of about as I thought I was doing everything! I watched a documentary recently that said that a huge % of people that they tested with Hashis had the Epstein Barr virus and until that was got rid of (or other gut bacteria) that the antibodies wouldn't come down. That's what I'm testing next!

[dang in reply to Katepots]

Ok we're in the same boat then. I just went through 2 months of tests and exams on my gut, just had my colonoscopy and gastroscopy done 3 days ago and what I was diagnosed with is something I've never heard of on this forum and I'm wondering if it could be connected, something we should all be testing?

It's called DAO deficiency (diamine oxidase). It's the enzyme needed to break down histamines in foods. I was also diagnosed with ulcerative proctitis and duodenitis, probably caused by the lack of enzyme.

Do you know anything about it? I'm thinking of making a new post about it here. I've posted in a number of bowel disease forums but they have so few members I've gotten no real help.

[Naomi8 in reply to dang]

Gut issues are so relevant to the forum members.

[Katepots in reply to dang]

Just found this link.

deficitdao.org/en/dao-defic...

[dang in reply to Katepots]

Thanks for the link!

[Katepots in reply to dang]

Actually thats really interesting,I wonder if there is a link??!! I have most of the symptoms and I know so many people on here and all the lectures I've listened to on Hashimotos the patients all have similar symptoms. Would've really interesting to ask some experts, I may email some and ask them about it.

What did they say you could do about it, any cure as such?

[dang in reply to Katepots]

I have to take antihistamines (Tefal) possibly forever, along with a couple short term medications (Pantoprazole, and Mesalamine) which would reduce the inflammation or repair damage (hopefully?). The doctors said that's the only treatment, but I'm hoping to find an alternative solution to where maybe I could rebuild that enzyme, it could be wishful thinking, I'm very new to this with very little info so I'm trying not to get ahead of myself (as I often do).

[Katepots in reply to dang]

Yes read a lot, Drs don't like to give us all the answers!

Found some other info;

Alternative treatment

Depending on the cause of proctitis, alternative medicine has several types of treatments available. appropriate antibiotic treatment is recommended. Supplementation with Lactobacillus acidophilus is also recommended during and following antibiotic therapy to help rebuild normal gut flora that is destroyed by antibiotics. If proctitis is herpes-related, antiviral herbs taken internally, as well as applied topically, can be be helpful. Sitz baths and compresses of herbal infusions (herbs steeped in hot water) and decoctions (herbal extracts prepared by boiling the herb in water) can be very effective. Among the herbs recommended are calendula (Calendula officinalis), comfrey (Symphytum officinale), and plantain (Plantago major). Proctitis related to candidiasis requires dietary alterations, especially elimination of sugar from the diet. Any immunocompromised person needs close medical attention. If proctitis is related to inflammatory bowel diseases, the resolution of the underlying condition should contribute to resolution of the proctitis. Acupuncture and homeopathic treatment can be very useful in resolving inflammatory bowel diseases.

Also found another site with a blog that may be useful

adrianaduelo.com/en/deficit...

The other conditions sound painful

I think your right and there could be a link especially as you were a long time undiagnosed (like me)

Good luck with research.

[dang in reply to Katepots]

Wow thanks so much! That's some really good information. Super helpful 😊. I'm really happy to see that change in diet is one of the common treatments.

[mourneadventurer in reply to dang]

Dr Ben Lynch mentions the DAO in his book Dirty Genes and how to clean them up.

[dang in reply to mourneadventurer]

That’s interesting, is it about how to reverse something that is genetic? Because I do have DAO deficiency, and I happen to have all 4 gene variants that cause it (I’ve had the DNA test done). Doctors have labeled me type 1 intolerant, which basically means that because it’s genetic they can’t offer me any treatments to reverse it.

[mourneadventurer in reply to dang]

Epigenetic changes that are affected by lifestyle and diet can help clean up faulty genes so they can function as best as they can. Dirty Genes is worth reading.

[dang in reply to mourneadventurer]

Thank you for this advice I’ll look into this

[mourneadventurer in reply to dang]

You’re welcome. Best Wishes.

[Tile in reply to Katepots]

It took me 15 years to drop my antibodies into the normal range. It happened when i was on a higher dose 200mcg of synthroid. I also.had Kenalog injections in both hands due to injury. Kenalog a type of cortisone lowers inflammation. So hard to say. Couldve been a combo of the 2 plus all the supplements I took. They are still low. 10 to 21 TPOab and Tg ab.is 3.

[Tile in reply to Katepots]

Be aware Brazil nuts are high in lead. Plus they may have too much selenium.

[helvella in reply to Tile]

Do you have any evidence that brazil nuts are high in lead?

I have been unable to find any reference to them having high lead content.

Unless someone posts believable references, it is probably as well to ignore lead content as being of any importance.

[Tile in reply to helvella]

Ps Kale is also very high in lead. In the USA there were health alerts. I like kale but not worth the high lead levels. Do a deeper search for "brazil nuts health hazards lead levels". I didn't do a search for these the info just showed up when I was reading about brazil.nuts.

[helvella in reply to Tile]

I did search on those words - the word "lead" in almost every case was the verb not the noun.

I have still not found any evidence to support your statement.

[ShinyB in reply to helvella]

No mentions on google scholar either.

[ShinyB in reply to Tile]

I too could find no references about brazils being high in lead. Most articles I found used the word 'lead' in the context of 'x could lead to y'.

I found this link that suggests brazils can lead to higher LDL levels motleyhealth.com/diet-and-n... but other links that suggest brazils can reduce the risk of heart disease.

But no mentions of lead content.

As with a lot of foods, moderation seems to be the answer. Any food can be toxic in high quantities.

[Tile in reply to helvella]

Look up Lead in Brazil soil. Must I remind people that Brazil is bathed inside and out with the most HAZARDOUS PESTICIDE CHEMICALS for MOSQUITO CONTROL. Brazil Nuts is a big money maker for them. Brazil nuts can have toxic doses of Se in just.a couple of them. I love Brazil Nuts but don't need that much Selenium or Lead or who knows what is in that soil.

[helvella in reply to Tile]

Bolivia is the largest exporter of brazil nuts. (Which actually is why I use lower-case "b" for the nuts but upper-case for the country.) Do they have high lead content?

I did not find any evidence of high lead content in brazil nuts wherever sourced. If you think this is an issue, please provide some links.

One issue that has repeatedly been raised is that many brazil nuts contains radium. Another is the high levels of aflatoxins when imported in their shells. But lead content continues to elude my searching.

[Katepots]

Yes I'd do a separate post. I've not heard of that but will investigate. Lots of us myself included have gut and bowel problems, a lot linked to Hashimotos. I guess if we are all deficient in so many things and have gut microbiome changes it's all linked.

[dang in reply to Katepots]

Ok I'll make a separate post when I get a chance, probably after spending all night tonight obsessively reading online about it haha. Cheers!

[Katepots in reply to dang]

Haha you're like me 😂

[jacrjacr]

so true...people automatically assume you need it if you are thyroid deficient etc......even drs so I had dr test me b4 I take it and I was HIGH without supplementation......so beware...high can cause hair loss and I don't know why my selenium is high and I also had high vit a and high vit e even after stopping all supplements for 4 months.....so beware...all can effect the body if too low or too high

[rosserk]

Oh dear that’s worrying. I’ve been taking selenium without knowing my levels. I thought I had to take it to maximise absorption of Levo. God I’m so dumb! 😭

[dang in reply to rosserk]

You’re not dumb, it’s hard to find all the proper information. In general it’s a good idea to have your levels checked for whatever supplements you are taking. It’s also useful to know if those supplements are even working for example.

As a small side note, I’ve had good results taking zinc to help with absorption and conversion to T3.

Annndddd... I should say since this post has been resurrected: there is a chance that I got sick from that selenium due to my Histamine intolerance and the specific brand I was taking. I have been back on selenium for a couple months now without negative side effects.

[rosserk in reply to dang]

So would you advicse to stop taking them until I have my levels checked. The doctors unlikely to go for that.

[dang in reply to rosserk]

I can’t really say. Considering I’m not a doctor, my personal opinion would be if you’re not suffering from any of the signs of toxicity then keep taking it. And in the meantime find a way to get it tested, and you may as well ask your doctor first.

Sorry I wish I could more than that 😓

[Tile]

Beware that too much selenium is TOXIC. That is why it is the main ingredient in some pesticides. Maybe with all the pesticides we are exposed to we don't need to supplement!!!!