estrogen vs progesterone question

I have a question not strictly related to thyroid hormone, but I hope it's ok to post it here anyway as all hormones interact.

I have been reading a lot about estrogen dominance, which seems common after age 35 as progesterone production will decrease as much as 75%, but estrogen production only about 35%.

The hormone doctor I am seeing put me on both estrogen (cream) and progesterone four years ago, when I was 41. Estrogen is to be taken from day 5-25 of cycle, and progesterone from day 15-25.

I cannot help but wonder...if estrogen production decreases much less than progesterone production after 35, should you really take estrogen at all?!

Other meds I take: NDT, Medrol.

34 Replies

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  • thecat346,

    I haven't heard of oestrogen dominance as a common problem, would question taking both oestrogen and progesterone but wouldn't take either without a saliva sex hormone test anyway.

    Details about Genova testing on ThyoidUK website.

    You are correct in saying all hormones interact and the sex hormones can have huge influence on the thyroid gland.

    Good luck

    flower007

  • OK, thanks! I was put on both hormones after blood and 24 h urine analysis.

  • I agree that this is a good question. Too many estrogens in pesticides in inorganic foods we consume and livestock treated with hormones. More doctors recommend progesterone which fights cancer. You are correct that hormones are all related and I think it's included in this video on adrenal/thyroid.

  • From what I've been told, you should never take estrogen on its own, but always combine it with progesterone, in a way that mimics your own body's production (estrogen in the first half of cycle, progesterone in the second half). But some doctors seem to think that nobody should take estrogen at all, but only progesterone...indeed confusing! Thanks for the video!

  • I agree with that. I was also told they should always be taken together. But a lot of doctors Don't know that.

  • Video very interesting thank you.

  • Hi - can I just chime in here and say that a (female) GP that I saw told me that there is no such thing as prescribing progesterone (only for fertility issues....) :o/ - so i am interested in reading the comments on here regarding this.

    [I also believe that there are some symptoms in common with estrogen dominance and hypothyroid - certainly in my case - neither of which are being "treated".]

    x

  • That's probably because the NHS doesn't do real hormones for menopause (apart from estrogen pessaries which are bioidentical) and the fake progesterone is implicated in cancer (it also acts more like testosterone, apparently). One size fits all (says the NHS).

  • That's just not true. I have heard it down all the time, especially if saliva testing shows you need it to balance things out.

  • I just realised that it sounds as though I too think there is "no such thing" - when that's not the case at all..... It was the GP who put me in MY place when I asked about progesterone hormone therapy. She made me feel terrible (but that's part of a longer and duller story) and I didn't really have much information to back up my questions/request...... There would have been NO chance of bio-identical, which is what I would have been hoping for.

    (And probably desperately need.)

    :(

  • I take bio identical HRT, both estrogen and progesterone but the ratio is about 1 to 50. The estrogen helps stop vaginal atrophy, among other things. Your symptoms would show what you need to supplement.

    What do your bloods show about your levels?

  • Blood is not a reliable indicator of sex hormones because often they are bound and not usable, by issues with sex hormone binding globulin. Only Saliva and the dried urine samples, show the "free" hormones..unbound. I have been replacing my hormones since 2010, with compounded creams.

  • Saliva is not accurate if you are taking intrabuccal hormones as I am. My endo seems to think bloods are OK, but goes mainly on symptoms.

  • Going by symptoms would work to some degree. But i need a guide so i can get my hormones back to that of a young person, i can't tell that by symptom.

  • Hi Faith Can I ask what is compounded creams? Also, what led you to be replacing hormones or is it HRT that you mean?

  • Compounded creams are specially made up by a Compounding Pharmacist...the hormones are made to be identical to what your body normally would make. It is not the same as HRT, it isBHRT. ..they are considered to be much safer than HRT. HRT comes with risks of Cancer and Strokes etc.. I got on them after i got terrible symptoms of sweating, weight gain, acne ..etc..turned out to be my thyroid going low and i had developed Hashimotos.

    the sex hormone replacement didn't help my symptoms.

  • I had just had an ovary removal and cyst, some months before. I was told, by my Endocrinologist, to stay on the Hormones anyway, to protect me from further disease and protect my bones.

  • Ok, I hope you are on the mend now :-)

  • Bar the sweating (always cold) the other symptoms are exactly what I have been suffering with these past 5 years since being taken off the pill. I very recently have undergone saliva and blood testing in an attempt to get to the bottom of things. Waiting for results at the moment but hoping the even if the specialist that I am seeing wont prescribe that the health practitioner that I am also seeing will prescribe on symptoms alone.

    The GP prescribed The combined Pill recently, acknowledging that this was the reason I am suffering the symptoms - never been offered this in the last few years. Always been told no cos of my age but he said he would give me it to treat acne. I don't want synthetic though cos I only have another 10 years when I can take it.

    Can I ask, is the person who prescribes for you in the UK? Do you have a website/details on them that you can PM me please? Have you been on this combination long?Have your symptoms improved?

  • Should say that I was on the pill till the age of 35. The GP looked at my notes and at my symptoms and said that he could see in my case and in many other women of my age that this is a factor which is overlooked by most standard GP's

  • I am in the US. My symptoms went away once i was on Thyroid meds, the female hormones didn't help any of it. It still comes and goes due to my autoimmune disease.

  • Hi Angel of the North

    Are you prescribed those hormones in the UK? is it your GP OR do you have to source them privately? If private, are you able to PM me your practitioners details?

  • drrind.com/therapies/thyroi...

    This chart shows estrogen dominance and symptoms. Progesterone is robbed by the adrenals in order to make cortisol.

  • I can say, that if you are using standard pills, prescribed by a regular doctor and picked up at the regular pharmacy and not bio identical creams, made up by a compounding pharmacy and you have not had saliva sex hormone testing, to determine what you need..you may be putting your health at risk.

  • Did you know that the estrogen pills are usually made from horse urine? No way i would take that.

  • Creams were no use for me. Just couldn't absorb enough. I have to have intrabuccal lozenges. Foul tasting things (but they smell great)!

  • I would not use them. They are not safe if not bioidentical.

  • Mine are bioidentical as I said earlier (i think the only bioidentical you can get on the NHS is Vagifem pessaries) - no way would I take horse pee and progestin. Being bio identical doesn't prevent a foul taste unfortunately. Progestin (fake progesterone) is probably the most dangerous.

  • There is an excellent book by Dr.Katarina Dalton called "Once a Month" which i read years ago in which she charts the two hormones to see which one you are deficient in. Progesterone in the form of Cyclogest comes from the roots of yams growing in the Amazonian rain forest and there are no side effects for women who have had children, whereas Oestragen is made up of a compound and form HRT and the pill. Progesterone is gfiven by way of pessary or suppository or injection.

    Doctors are reluctant to prescribe Cyclogest because it is expensive, but I did manage to persuade my doctor to give me this whilst I was doing my law exams which always coincided with PMT.

    Hope this helps.

  • I take hormones prescribed by a Hertoghe doctor...the progesterone is a product called Utrogestan, and the estrogen cream is called Estrogel. According to these doctors, estrogen should never be taken in a pill form, but always as cream, gel, or patches. In his book The hormone solution, Dr. Hertoghe himself says this spares the liver.

  • can gp prescribe these Bioidentical hormones? Or an endocrinologist? Ive recently had the coil removed after 2 yrs and I'm guessing my progesterone has taken a hit! Sweatin, moods, pmt, pains odema in ankles and hands! HELP 😰

  • I'm sorry, I would have no idea if you are in the UK. I'm in Belgium, and there, any doctor can prescribe bio-identical hormones, including GPs. I hope someone here will know the answer to your question.

  • Yes I'm in the north of Ireland, I was searching posts to find out, rather than repeat a question someone may have asked already, uno? Thank you Anna I'll maybe do a wee post. Are the Bioidentical hormones not helping your menopausal symptoms? 🌺

  • Thats great news, I'd bought serenity cream, but I'm guessing the coil had tonnes of progesterone in comparison. I must look up your tabs 🕵🏻

    Thank you 

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