Hi all just some help please I've been told I av subclinicle thyroidism I don't know what it means. I been to my doctors moaning about not been able to get my breath doctor told me after test I've mild copd enough about that. I've been complaining about been shattered all the time. I get up I'm still shattered no energy just drained most days. I have to push myself most days. My body hurts all over. I'm on gavapentin 600mg I take 2 three times a day also solpadol 500mg 2 three times a day, also amitripline 75mg at nite, plus my inalers 120 salmeterol two puffs twice daily.and 200 ipratropium bromide 20 micrograms two puffs 4 times daily...I would be greatfull to some help please.

62 Replies

hypothyroid causes all manner of body aches and pains

it also causes very low




vit d3

all of which must be tested

taking gabapentin and amitrytaline must be adding to the problems

your fatigue and breathlessnes may well be low ferritin

but with knowing what your thyroid function test results are and the tests above we cant tell you how sub clinical anything is

sounds like you have asthma if you take an inhaler ............if it truly is COPD have you been or are you a smoker ?

Cheers for your quick reply. Yes I do smoke I know I shouldn't. Me mom as cops really bad also suffers with thyroid she takes 125 mg. my sister also as thyroid problems also my uncle as cops he he as never smoked ..... The doctor told me my iron was a touch below the norm. I do have the results I don't know were I put it, I've have a look... Also I forgot to mention I started getting a tremor or shakes it started in my right leg and now I feel it move around my body sometimes it's wakes me me it feels like I'm lying on a train track I don't shake on the outside either.I've told different doctors about it I get the feeling they think I'm daft. I also take tenge doc 200micrograms 1 fours times daily

Sorry that is temgesic I four times daily they for my nerves I think.

Hello Buma,

Welcome to our forum. Sorry to hear to you are feeling unwell and I do sympathise as have suffered many horrid symptoms myself, including the internal tremors that you speak of. states ........Subclinical hypothyroidism, also referred to as mild thyroid failure, is diagnosed when peripheral thyroid hormone levels are within the normal range, but thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH) is mildly elevated.

In laymans terms this means your thyroid levels are border line as to whether your doctor should treat you with thyroid hormone medicine or not , irrespective of your blatant hypothyroid symptoms which might get progressively worse.

GP's have strict guidelines advising them to only prescribe to patients whose blood tests fall within a certain range . There is huge debate about whether this range should be broader.

I suggest further discussion with your doctor emphasing how ill you feel and ask for tests to be conducted for Vit D, Vit B12, folate and Ferritin as people with thyroid issues often suffer deficiencies in these.

If you have recent thyroid hormone test results, you need to post them complete with ranges (numbers in brackets) in order for people to comment.

There is a forum also for fibromyalgia on Health Unlocked that you may might useful.

I hope you find your answers soon


Thank you so much flowerhead007 really nice of you. You seem so informed bless you...... I also have cold hands and feel the cold. Years ago I used to love the cold now I can't bear it.... What I do I put my hands under the tap to warm them up I do this quite often... I will sort That print out out. Once again cheers for your help😀


As "thyroidys" we all feel the cold when under medicated.

As one member put it last week " I can even feel cold in a boiling hot bath".


Buma, when you post your results, do it in a new question so that everyone can see it. If you post it on this thread, people who could be helpful might miss it. :)

Buma, please don't warm your hands under the tap or on radiators. It can cause chilblains which are very painful and unsightly. Warm your hands gently by putting them under your armpits and wear gloves if necessary. My poor fingers are still discoloured and slightly tender after developing chilblains in November which continued flaring up until Feb/March.

Thanks for your advice clutter really appreciate it. Have they sorted your problems yet?

Buma, thyroid medication and levels are pretty wellsorted now but I need to work on improving fitness and stamina after being inactive and bedridden for a long time. Getting there slowly.

Chilblains can be due to poor circulation. I've always had cold feet and hands but that was the first, and hopefully the last, time I had chilblains. Warming cold hands quickly can cause the dilated blood vessels to bleed into surrounding tissue which causes intense itching followed by pain as the fingers and joints swell.

It's rite thou isn't it 😀

Hi buma I'm new to this site also . I've got great advice an info . I'm not to well at the moment . Hope u get sorted just wanted to say I've the bad habit smoking also pains in chest neck practily all over . Decided to take my tyroxine tonight ... Wide awake club serious so crap

Hello Melmatt,

If you have been hypothyroid and taking Levothyroxine for three years and still don't feel well, then something clearly is not right.

If you are taking your meds exactly in the correct way (am or pm doesn't matter), then maybe you are having absorption problems.

There are four important nutrients required for the body to utilise Levothyroxine correctly and they are Vit B12, Vit D, Folate and Ferritin.

If you are deficient in any of these you will need to supplement with a good quality brand free of rubbish fillers.

Do not take a multivitamin as these often contain iodine which can imflam the thyroid further and wouldn't be enough to readdress any imbalances.

You need to ask your doctor to conduct these blood tests and also test for thyroid antibodies (TPOAb and TGAb). This will determine whether you have Hashimotos auto immune disease which is prevalent in people with thyroid issues and can cause further Levothyroxine uptake problems.

Post all test results complete with ranges (numbers in brackets) and people with comment.

Good luck and hope you get sleep eventually. Lol


How is the levothyroxine uptake affected by antibodies please?

In my experience having Hashimotos certainly seems to impair the conversion of T4 into T3 - not sure if it is directly caused by the anti-bodies. I think when you have auto-immune issues absorption is poor of vital vitamins and minerals - which in turn can also affect uptake/conversion....

Thanks Marz ..... In my experience too xx

Hello lolajone,

A high antibody count reeks havoc on the body bringing inflammation, pain, further hormone imbalances and digestive issues.

Experiencing both hyper and hypo symptoms caused by fluatuating antibodies means precious reserves of both hormones and nutrients get run dry.

Hashimotos can cause serious nutritional difficiencies encouraging digestive issues & gut disease (IBS, acid reflux, constipation, leaky gut and celiac like symptoms). These in turn may have a direct bearing on the proper absorption of Levothyroxine.

The body requires a certain hormone balance to be able to convert Levothyroxine from T4 to T3. When Hashimotos prevents this from happening thyroxitosis can occur.


Thank you for relying flower007. I appreciate the leaky gut etc believe me I've got it. But. When you say there has to be a certain hormone balance... What

do mean as in what hormones ?

Hello lolajone

Hypothyroidism can be caused by problems with TSH (produced in the pituitary), T4 (produced in the thyroid), and T3 converted from T4 (in the liver and kidneys).

This conversation can be affected by mineral deficiencies, liver issues, adrenal problems, certain medications and Hashimotos which can also contribute further complications to any of these.

When I say we require certain hormone balances I guess I am referring to the hormones in our thyroid and adrenals as well as the HPA axis.

The hypothalamic is the command Center for our hormones, sending messages to the thyroid, pituitary, adrenals, liver, ovaries and mammary glands. It helps in regulating our immune system, digestion, energy, mood and sexuality.

A imbalance in any of these hormones would therefore have various consequences on other organs and glands and how we feel.

Remember Hashimotos is only an additional problem as we don't need to have raised thyroid antibodies to experience hypothyroidism. However when we do, I think it exacerbates any problem as all hormones work in synergy with each other.

Hope this helps,


Thanks flower did get some sleep up like a rocket feel pretty sluggish now trying not to go to bed today really need to grt a grip . I have been taking all my tablets together until I four weeks ago . I had been taking propanalol lanzoprazole tyroxine aspirin all vits at once in the morning . Mabe that's why I've went to ths15.4. I have changed all that now but didn't know about multivitamin I am taking solar everyday 2000 .... Oops

Get your Vitamin B12 checked also. B12 deficiency can also cause tremors and shakes

Best wishes to you.

Hi - it would seem that your Docs have been overlooking the ROOT cause of your various conditions. This happen to many of us I am afraid. So now you are in a good place to start your journey to wellness. I was once told about a Greek Doctor who could diagnose people with a thyroid problem just by looking at their necks - they will have two wrinkles like necklaces going around the neck. Yes I can see them on your photo :-)

I am also thinking that the many tablets you are taking will not be helping you to feel well. It seems that the poorly diagnosed and then poorly treated thyroid leads to many other symptoms being treated individually making huge lumps of dosh for Big Pharma....but not helping the patient to find wellness.

When the Doctor says things are fine or normal - they mean in range - which is a problem for many of us. Where in the range is so important. So when we see your results with ranges many people will step forward to help. Probably best to start a new post with the results and that way more people will see it.

I was diagnosed with a thyroid problems here in Crete at the age of 59 - all the thyroid results were in range - but the anti-bodies were high and so treatment began back in 2005. So we need to be on the ball with GP's who do not always know everything/anything ! I joined this forum over three years ago and learnt so much about the fine tuning that is needed to make us well. My husband also has Hashimotos....

I am convinced that once you are optimally treated for your thyroid you will be able to drop so many of your pills and potions as you will begin to feel well. Lots to learn I am afraid - so keep reading when you have the time and of course keep asking questions....

Not only the lines, but the 'fullness' of the neck and the puffiness of the eyes. The upper lip also shows signs of low Growth Hormone, which can go hand in hand with low thyroid.

Buma, so sorry to disect you like that! lol But it's not often someone posts a photo (I wouldn't dare!) so we Don't often get the chance to analyse from appearance alone. Thank you. :)

If you've not had a recent test for your thyroid hormones. Request a Full Thyroid Function Test (probably wont do them all but ask anyway). TSH, T4, T3, Free T4 and Free T3 and antibodies.

Also ask for an antibodies blood test.

Get a print-out from the surgery with the ranges and post on a new question. Marz is correct. The underlying cause of all your ailments may be under one 'umbrella) i.e. thyroid gland.

Get your blood test at the earliest and don't take any medication until afterwards. If you are put on levothyroxine and are having blood test for your thyroid hormones you take levo afterwards, not before the test.

It will save money and bother if you are diagnosed with one main Important cause and can reduce your other medications which might only be due to your thyroid hormone in the first place. Levothyroxine is taken once daily but you must gradually increase it every 6 weeks with a blood test until you feel much better. Breathlessness especially as well as the others. The GP should also take your family's history into account.

All the above information is correct but Buma until you stop smoking I am afraid nothing will change and your wasting your time looking for answers

Smoking is the root cause of majority of your ill health and will have triggered a cascade of problems

A situation with which I find it hard to sympathise

I'm sorry but I find your last comment a bit harsh...we like to try and help people on this site .

not judge or be critical of ill people

Unfortunately Buma simply will not get well while their current lifestyle continues its pointless trying to hide that truth

But to have no sympathy . ? That is must remember that we are real people that came on this site in desperation most likely to find some support

And help and a little bit of comfort ...not for someone to say that they find it difficult to sympathise . .that makes me very angry

I said "I find it hard to sympathise " with someone who fails to see their addiction is a big part of their problem

I have immense sympathy with those who are ill and whose doctors refuse to face that or treat them precisely why I battled for 12 years tooth and nail for my husband

I am currently tearing my hair out worrying about a 16yr old granddaughter who was hit on the head 2 yrs ago by a cupboard door falling off due to a companies outright stupidity this has landed her with intense headaches day after day eminating from the point of impact which theres not one painkiller etc that touches it despite being an exceptionally bright student who had a glittering career ahead of her the headaches are wrecking her life

Not one single medic has any solution beyond this is "just one of those things "

All the sympathy in the world is not helping her

I am sorry for all your problems and I have great sympathy but I stand by what I said ...maybe you need a break from here until you feel more empathy with others that seek help ..wishing you and your family all the best

RFU, if someone came and said there hair was falling out, would you be unsympathetic with that, too? Because that's just another symptom.

Any form of addiction - be it drugs, cigarettes or alcohol - can be - and probably is - due to low thyroid hormones. It is a form of compensation, if you will, A way to off-set the feelings of being so ill. So many people find they can give up their addictions WHEN their thyroid hormone levels are increased.

(And no, I see you coming there, I'm not saying that ALL addiction is caused by low thyroid. Neither am I saying that ALL hypos are addicted to something. But I am saying that there is a strong possibility that addiction is caused by low thyroid.)

So many people are diagnosed hypo after they give up smoking, that it is said that smoking causes hypo. On the other hand, could in not just be that they were smoking because they were hypo, and the smoking masked it. The medical community is so very fond of putting the cart before the horse!

Buma is 'lucky' in that he has been diagnosed before he gave up, which will give him a better chance of being able to give up. Which was also my case. Once treated for my low thyroid, I found it very, very easy to give up, even though I'd smoked since I was 14, and I Don't feel any need to smoke anymore. Always best to know the possibilities before judging, eh? :)

I smoked for about 26 years. As soon as I was on the correct medication for adrenals and thyroid problems I found it a doddle to stop smoking. But before the adrenals and thyroid were sorted, stopping smoking was impossible. Have been stopped for over 5 years now.

Xx g

Yup, exactly. :)

Well done :) It is very difficult to kick any sort of addiction when you are unwell with any health condition, even substances like sugar and caffeine. I'm pleased you were able to quit smoking when you felt well enough. Quitting smoking is difficult at the best of times! I have a couple of healthy friends who are very strong people yet they say quitting smoking is one of the hardest things they have ever had to do.

Buma, I hope you are able to quit smoking one day but you deserve all the support you need regardless of whether you are able to quit smoking at the moment. You are always welcome here.

Thanks for your support CarolynB .

I do smoke but only about 8 a day it used to be about 20.

I used to smoke 25+ a day, depending on what sort of day I was having and how much I slept! And I really felt I needed it. Especially in times of stress. There was no way I could just 'cut down', it was all or nothing. I went cold turkey...

I did try several times before being diagnosed and treated, and it would work for a while - I could go a few years without smoking. But when things got tough - like my divorce, for instance, or a death - the first thing I did was buy a packet of cigarettes. Now, I find I can face up to the 'slings and arrows' of life without a cigarette.

One theory I read is that nicotine aids the absorbtion of T3 by the brain, which is why a lot of hypos smoke - the brain needs more T3 than any other part of the body. So, it would make sense that people would gravitate to tabacco to help their brains get the T3 it needs. The body works in mysterious ways!

You are doing well to reduce your smoking to only 8 a day. Keep up the good work :)


I understand your frustration at people who you deem to bring illness upon themselves, when you & your own family have done nothing to encourage it.

However, if you are not positive to others, they might never find the courage to post, or else lie about things they know you don't want to hear.

We all make different choices in life (some good, some bad) but this forum is here only to advise & support each other.

Not to judge each other.

Maybe those who are addicted or have bought problems on themselves actually need a shock to wake them up and face the reality

[In the opinion of this admin, this response breaks this guideline:

7.  We want all members to be comfortable posting here. In order to ensure that, any Post, or Comment which causes alarm, harassment or distress to any person, whether or not intended by the poster, may be removed. ]

when I find support and help for my granddaughter I might think differently

Right now I have ZERO sympathy for self inflicted illness like COPD through smoking which we all know is harmfull

Reallfedup123 your intitled to your opinion. If you read my article you will find that my mother and uncle have never smoked in there lives who both have copd Can you explain that.


If your Mother and Grandmother have never smoked in their lives but still have a diagnosis of COPD I would wonder how good their doctors are


If you put 'COPD causes' into a search engine, you will see that whilst smoking is by far the most likely cause, there are others.

Typically quoted are Passive smoking, exposure to fumes, dust, air pollution and having a genetic tendency.

Is your granddaughter on this board? If she is, I'm sure she gets support, not criticism.

Right now no one gives a dam about my granddaughters plight except me and my Hashis husband

especially the entire medical world from GOSH to local

That is really tragic, and I'm so sorry, RFU. I wish there were something I could do to help, I really do. But is that a reason to take it out on one of us?


I'm sure we can all understand how distressing this is for you, but it does not give you the right to be judgemental about members of this forum.

If you cannot abide by the guideline previously mentioned above, then please do not comment at all.

7. We want all members to be comfortable posting here. In order to ensure that, any Post, or Comment which causes alarm, harassment or distress to any person, whether or not intended by the poster, may be removed.

RFU, I'm sorry your grandaughter isn't getting the support she needs but please don't take your frustration out on new members. If you can't post supportively because you don't approve of a member's lifestyle choices please refrain from posting on such threads.

And we really sympathise because we are all in this together reallyfedup123.

We have to support each other to get through this terrible place we ALL find ourselves.

Positive thoughts to you all and especially your very special granddaughter.


Could be a self medication thing? It is known that nicotine gets us going by causing the release of sugars and adrenaline. However, because of this it contributes to adrenal fatigue. Also, thiocyanate, found in smoke, inhibits iodine uptake by the thyroid and inhibits thyroid hormone synthesis. See: for more details. Finally, research, from 2003, has shown ''that one of nicotine’s metabolites, cotinine, may improve memory and protect brain cells from diseases such as Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s. Another study found that nicotine can help improve some of the learning and memory problems associated with hypothyroidism. Such studies suggest that nicotine — or drugs that mimic nicotine — may one day prove beneficial in the treatment of neurological disorders. However, “These findings don’t mean people should smoke,” warns neuroscientist Michael Kuhar, PhD, of Emory University.'' See:{0C16364F-DB22-424A-849A-B7CF6FDCFE35}

It is very interesting to read and speculate - I think there might be something to it.

Some people have to slowly start smoking and can't cope. I thoroughly enjoyed my first and smoked for far too many years.

Please come back buma. 99.9 per cent of the time we do not have these problems. You are very welcome here. Please do not be put off.


By one person! The rest of us are on your side. :)

Thanks for your kindness and understanding foreversummer. Like in my article my mom and have never smoked yet have copd really bad.

Inwhich case Buma your mother and grandmother need to ask WHY they have COPD

because the people i know with it is either via smoking or medical failure to diagnose

My mother had copd and never smoked in her life neither did any of her family or the extended famiy but she definitely had copd, it was not a misdiagnosis.

Indeed, hypohen, there are many causes of COPD other than smoking. Including, for a few examples, workplace exposure to various substances (cement factories and textile industry), pesticides, and several inter-current disorders.

Hello hypohen like I was saying my mom or uncle never touched a cig but my uncle was diagnosed at 41 me mom in late 40s, I was told it could be a faulty gene..... Make you wonder...

Anybody got any helpful advice by all means please answer😀

Hi Buma. I see you're on Gabapentin - is that right? If so, you should be aware that they damage the thyroid. the longer you've been on them, the more damage they will do. They also lower your white blood cell count. Both of these things will make you feel tired and washed out. In fact, Gabapentin can do a fine job of making you feel ill all by itself, no other conditions required! I don't know why you take them, but unless it is for something essential, like epilepsy or trigeminal neuralgia, I wouldn't recommend them. I know a lot of docs give them out for various kinds of 'untreatable' pain, but they really are not merited (nor doing much good).

If your family has a history of thyroid problems, they are completely the wrong drug for you, unless, as I say, they are unavoidable.

Hi there chancery thanks for your advice,no I wasn't aware of ha spending could cause damage to the thyroid I will take it up with gp on next visit. I take gabapentin for pain I suffer with bad back pain. Plus pain all over body. I also take solfadol 500mg capsules I take them on top because gabbpentin wasn't touching my pain anywhere.i also take temgesic under my tounge I have bad tremors 24/7 365 days no end to it most days it feels like I'm lying on train track. If I'm awake or wake up with pain or it's the tremors they move around my body 24/7 no it never stops some days as well as the pain the tremors are worse. Yet on the outside I don't shake I can't Explain that.. I get the impression doctors think I'm daft. I may have a really bad memory nothing sinks in I'm afraid (memory like a fish) it's no joking matter. I also take amtripylin to at night.

Enough about me and how are you?

Hi Buma. I'm not surprised you feel tired and washed out, taking Gabapentin, PLUS other painkillers AND Amitriptyline. You're like a walking pharmacy! I don't suppose it would be possible to do a medication review with your doc? See if you could weed some of them out? You sound as if you are suffering from drug-induced illness!

I took Gabapentin for around 6 months, I think it must have been. I've only recently stopped it. Like you, I never found it useful. Although it gave me the full array of side effects, it did bu**er all for my pain. I'm still on Carbamazepine though, which I'm hoping to wean off shortly. It's a slow process though - terrible withdrawal symptoms. Just as bad as trying to get the dose up in the first place - plus the fear, always, that my pain may come back (trigeminal neuralgia).

I know tremors are a feature of Gabapentin and the other anti-convulsants. Could be from the other drugs you take too? I wake up shaking until I get my meds down me. Then I get shaky again if I'm too slow getting the next dose. Plus coming off them gives you the DTs like nobody's business.

You're in a very difficult place - you need the meds but they are creating illnesses all by themselves, by the sounds of it. Do you think there is anything you could let go of, or try and find a better version of?

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