Restless Legs Syndrome
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Cramp

How many of you with RLS also suffer leg cramps. I have quinine on prescription,take magnesium and calcium ,drink and much water as I can and often resort to bag of salty crisps yet I can have nights with no sleep due to cramp. Becoming exhausted as when the RLS is a little better then I seem to have cramp. Rarely have a night with little problem

Of course when the cramp is bad you don’t feel the RLS but it can be excruciating and I scream out with it

I am so tired these days I can hardly function

Just having a moan

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Drinking too much water can dilute the salts in your system. Just a thought.

Sounds a weird experience for you.

Hope you get resolved soon.

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J occasionally have cramps that wake me and cause me to jump out of bed and get my feet on the floor asap, I try to keep my potassium and magnesium levels up esp with food but sometimes when I don't eat right-fruits and veggies, foods high in pot and mag, and eat too much sugar the cramps are really bad. I believe much of my cramp problems are caused by having to take Lasix (furosemide) for a-fib. There is no way around this for me so I try to focus on healthy foods with the proper minerals. Wish I had a better answer for you. BTW putting my feet on a cold floor (my bathroom) rather than warm carpet makes a positive difference in relieving the cramps quickly. irina1975

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I didn't think quinine was prescribed anymore – too much of it is not good. Not sure baclofen is all that much better.

I can get very severe night camps in my calf muscles – rolling out of bed in agony if I don't get my leg(s) out of bed and put weight on them rapidly. I also get cramp in my 4th and 5th toes, the two smallest.

The leg cramps are most generally avoidable if I eat enough protein, about 80-100 grams of good absorbable complete protein. Trying to go a day on two bowls of muesli soaked in fruit juice is a recipe for disaster, even more so if I take any real exercise.

I tend to get the toe cramps after having taken a substantial walk (4 miles or more). I read it's a problem with the sural nerve and I've just seen that it looks as if it's rather age related.

So, I need zopiclone to act on my GABA receptors to get to sleep at night, ropinirole to act on my dopamine receptors to alleviate RLS, and apparently have some malfunction of my sural nerve. I won't be surprised if my doc thinks I might need to see a neurologist.

Regarding 80-100 grams of protein a day, I'm not sure if that's terribly excessive for someone taking as much exercise as I do or not. A blood test a while back tended to suggest to me that my liver is struggling with it, or at least needing time to process it, if not my kidneys too.

I supplement with magnesium citrate, potassium citrate (or sometimes potassium chloride) and di-calcium phospate, so if there's still a problem with my eletrolytes ...

Calf cramps can sometimes/often be avoided if, when you sense you're about to have one, you very gently point your toes up rather than extending them.

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Quinine is not sold in the USA, but it is sold in other places around the world. Quinine has been banned in the US, except in the case of malaria. It causes severe heart damage, to the wall of the heart. RLS and cramps are 2 different things, but on can have both at the same time.

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I am prescribed quinine in uk. I think my gp would disagree that it damages heart. I do have both. Have had RLS for 3O years and almost every night. Cramps not so often but very severe when it happens particularly if I have had a day out with shoes or boots on. Better in summer when I can wear loose sandals

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Hi smiffyliz,, i hope your doctor does know about this info on taking quinine, i am posting this for you to read. gov.uk/drug-safety-update/q...

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Thank you I will mention it to her.. The dose is small and cannot be increased

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I can't help but think that any problem distinguishing the two must be a seemingly low ability of the medical profession to recognize pain levels!

I had cramp before RLS. I wonder if cramp mightn't cause RLS – it's mostly the same nerves and muscles, I would have thought. And what's the main cause of cramps, a problem with myelin or a more neurological problem with signalling?

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I had RLS before the severe cramp I have now. Did have cramp badly when I was pregnant and was given salt tablets but info moved on in 40 years and now salt a complete no no

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Perhaps not a complete no, no. I think one needs a teaspoon or a good part of one of salt a day if you have no other form of sodium intake. More probably in the summer.

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Hi yes I get it all the bloomin time drives me crazy at night it just takes over and you can't stop it. Then it feels bruised the next day all down both calves😣. Yes I must learn to drunk more water that's my downfall but there's only so much water you can drink. Don't know about you but my RLS is so bad I sometimes have to punch my legs ha ha bit drastic you may think but takes my mind off the pain of the rls and focus on the pain of the punch 😂not funny really but you have to look at a bright side to it otherwise you will just go mad 😲🐴.

Now I just had a moan back, try having a little nap in the day if you can just a suggestion take care. Jools (Thunder1).X

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Hi Smiffyliz, just my tuppence-worth here, If you have a reasonable diet you should not need extra calcium. We get enough from our meals. Any excess can unbalance the minerals in our body and cause cramps? Also any excess calcium can be deposited in between cells in the body, causing atherosclerosis and other conditions if unattended. So I would not take calcium supplements.

I would also see your Dr about stopping the quinine. My mother's cramps were better when she stopped it.

Salty crisps might dry out your body, so again, sea salt is better with your meals. We need the range of minerals sea salt provides. Raw, unrefined is best.

Also I was told in a post a while ago, when I had bad cramps, to dissolve a quarter teaspoon of sea salt in 20 fl oz of water and drink throughout the day. That worked for me.

These are only my opinions, I would not gainsay your doctor, but I hope you get relief from this pain soon.

Neil

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Thank you Neil. Not sure about stopping the calcium as have osteopenia and it is prescribed for me. I do stop quinine from time to time as I worry it affects my hearing but not noticed any difference. However I will try the sea salt. That’s what I use in cooking anyway so have it on hand. Wonder why GPS prescribe quinine for cramps. It helped mine years ago but doesn’t have much effect now

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Osteopenia is lessened bone density isn't it. I wonder why they always prescribe calcium when that is only a part of the bone. The density relies on other minerals as well. If they prescribed all the minerals, in proper ratio, depending on current cell levels, determined by a Hair Tissue Mineral Analysis I would understand.

It must be the extra work/expense in doing a thorough job.

The thing is we get so much calcium in so many additives we are actually unbalancing our systems, depleting our good minerals, which work with our vitamins, so they get depleted as well.

I suppose, like RLS, the doctors have too much to study and too little time.

Neil

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The GP is prescribing the quinine for the cramps, but not the RLS, I HOPE. You must be in the UK, or elsewhere and not in the US, since it is banned in the US>

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My RLS was preceded by leg cramps, mostly in the calves, but also in my quads and hamstrings. Scary bad! I tried everything - all the magnesium supplements, Mg. oil, sea salt, on and on. Then RLS came on and cramps were the least of my worries. The solution to the cramps is probably "The Adrenal Cocktail" or some variation of it. 1/4 tsp sea salt (I use Celtic Sea Salt) and 1/4 tsp of Cream of Tartar (Potassium), mix with juice - take this 2x day or when you have a bad cramp. I now use 1/4 tsp sea salt in a 20oz. water bottle, daily and with any exercise I do. Adrenal Cocktail is now a supplement sold by Jigsaw Health also a good source for Mg. supplements. Also good athletic cramp supplements at Hammer Nutrition. jigsawhealth.com/root-cause...

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I will try that

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Here's the link to Hammer Nutrition - read the reviews, interesting. Lots of science can NOT confirm that it is electrolytes depletion - but I'm a firm believer that it is. I had a severe hamstring cramp recently after a 13 mile backcountry ski - the adrenal cocktail totally took it away. I had done 2 water bottles w/sea salt and one of the Hammer Electrolytes. hammernutrition.com/product...

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Im not much help but my wife has had bad cramps almost every night since our babies were born 30 years ago. Doctors were annoying and suggested that it was "normal" Perhaps there is one magnesium supplement that you haven't tried??? Our standard treatment was Staminade in a very concentrated solution. We mixed it up from dry staminade powder as required in hot water to maximise the concentration then added ice blocks to make it drinkable. It was horrible if it was warm!

A few months ago I started getting very regular cramps as well so together we tried magnesium tabs. Two per day 40 grams of magnesium per tablet. Magnesium Diglycinate Recently my wife's endocrinologist recommended Magnesioum Orotate on the grounds that it was more available than the diglyncinate. I presume he knows more than me so we are about to switch to it. I have read that orotate is the best of all the magnesium treatments but I havent seen any evidence. I read somewhere that its best to take one tablet at lunch and one before bed. We now have about one serious cramp between us a month so its no longer a problem.

I once took Magnesium Oxide and it made my RLS worse so perhaps I am less sensitive now I have been on a diet for so long, or perhaps its just random.

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Re: leg cramps. Forgot to mention I also use quinine sometimes. But not prescription. In the US quinine is sold as quinine water in the soda section of grocery stores. It's considered more ofa mixer for alcoholic drinks like tonic water, club soda etc. I keep some in my pantry. It's sold with sugar and sugar-free like other sodas. irina1975

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