My Story with pmr/GCA - Ragnar (Sweden) - PMRGCAuk

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My Story with pmr/GCA - Ragnar (Sweden)

Domstad profile image
25 Replies

Not very often a person writes about a successful tapering, so I decided to post my story. When PMRpro describes the DSNS method of tapering prednisone, she writes about a Swedish gentleman who found out a tapering method, which PMRpro et al developed further into the DSNS method. That Swedish gentleman is me – Ragnar.

After a week´s trip to Athens the first week in April 2005 (at the age of 67), I felt very strange and had a dry cough. After two weeks I went to the doctor. After blood work, he couldn´t tell what was wrong but made a plan where he step by step eliminated possible diseases. After some months without a real diagnose, I was sent to the medicine department of a main hospital. I had some new blood work, and then they told me that I had better have a biopsy in a temple. The problem was that I had two trips abroad coming up. I got an appointment after the first one and a biopsy showed that I had what they had expected. I was told I had pmr but they didn´t tell me I also had GCA, so I heard about that later.

I was put on 20 mg Prednisone (which is too low as a starting dose for GCA – but the subsidizing doctor didn´t see in the papers that I had GCA, I think. The next day I flew to the USA to participate in a class reunion after 50 years from graduation as an exchange student in a small town in Minnesota. My wife covered my white bandaid in the temple with skin-coloured surgical tape, so it shouldn´t show so much, especially not on the class picture. After about a week´s trip, while travelling in California by rented car, my wife used the scissors of a Swiss army knife to cut the strings that they had sewn at the biopsy. She dipped the scissors in gin from a miniature bottle we had got on the Atlantic flight – to sterilize it. Due to the cortisone, I felt great/high and on the national day of the USA, 4th of July, we walked downtown without problems. The brochure said the motel was in midtown, near downtown. I think we had to walk 20 blocks and then back – but I felt great even if my wife got tired despite being in better condition than I – the dose of pred helped me.

I reduced the pred by 2.5 mg every 3-4 weeks until I reached 10 mg. Then I reduced by 1 mg every month until I reached 5 mg. I tried to reduce during a whole year, but every time I had to go back to 5 mg due to fatigue. I thought it was no idea to go around being tired all the time when I didn´t have to. 5 mg is a fairly low dose. Unlike most persons with pmr, I had fairly little pain. When I had slight pain, it could be anywhere in legs or arms. After a year, I thought I would test a new regime that I had found out. After postng it, other pmr/GCA patients called it the Ragnar method. I took the lower dose 1 day, the old dose 2 days and repeated this once more. After about a week I took the step and lowered the dose each day. By doing this, my body reacted positively and I could start going down below 5 mg but only about 0.5 mg at a time. I had 2.5 mg tablets and cut them by hand in four parts, so it really was 0.6 mg at a time. If there was a problem, I just continued 1 day low dose, 2 days old dose for another week or so.

After 3 ½ years – in the middle of December 2008 – I got down to 0 and I haven´t had any problems after that – now it is 11 ½ years after coming off pred. I did some travelling shortly after coming off pred – we were for instance a week in Scotland (Glasgow, Edinburgh and a short trip to the Highlands). I just took it easy when we walked and when we visited a museum I just sat down to have a rest while my wife did it more thoroughly. Taking care of a friend´s dog keeps me busy and also makes me walk a bit more than I would otherwise do.

I had reduced my weight about 6 kg before I had the diagnose and some time after I was up to the same weight as before, which I of course was sad about. I had a moon face for some time, but for a man it probably isn´t as bad as for a woman. My advice is not to try to reduce too fast, especially not below 5 mg when every 1 mg (preferrably 0,5 mg) reduction is a very high reduction in percentage. My belief is that it is better to feel well and take the disadvantages a bit longer, especially when reaching doses of 5 mg and under. I am of course grateful that I haven´t been in pain so badly as most of fellow pmr-sufferers have.

Now, in 2020 I weigh 12 kg less than before I started tapering in 2005. Some years ago, I used the 5:2 method and later I kept the weight and even reduced by eating the right things – fish, chicken etc and at the age of 82 I am glad about my weight.

Lesson: Don´t go too fast. Then you may get a flare and the time it takes may be longer than when you taper a lower amount.

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Domstad profile image
Domstad
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25 Replies
Yellowbluebell profile image
Yellowbluebell

Thank youx YBb

DorsetLady profile image
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer

I did slightly amend your plan to suit me, and managed to get to zero with NO flares.....been in remission from GCA for 3.5years.

And the mantra on here is certainly....slowly all the way.....pity some in the medical profession don’t agree!

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toDorsetLady

Glad that you also belong to Club Zero that I started many years ago!

DorsetLady profile image
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer in reply toDomstad

Thank you - my journey on (or rather off) Pred was remarkably easy compared to many.

Unfortunately all my issues were pre diagnosis - including sight loss in right eye - but it is what it is - and we are very good at adapting.

Wishing you continued good health.

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toDorsetLady

Sorry about your eye. I understand that in the UK those who think they may have GCA can go right through and do not have to wait in a queue

DorsetLady profile image
DorsetLadyPMRGCAuk volunteer in reply toDomstad

Supposedly - it should be treated as an emergency but not sure always works.

My symptoms started in 2010 and finally diagnosed in 2012 - hopefully things have moved on since then. My then GP certainly won’t miss it again!

jinasc profile image
jinasc

Hi Captain Bob,

Happy to see you on the Good Ship PMR&GCA (UK) this time and not Canadian PMR GCA, which is long gone. I was christened by you as 'the Donkey' girl. We had fun as well as gaining knowledge. I am still having fun.

I loved your visit to the UK and you made a big effort to come to a support meeting. Since then we often talk about you.

Stay well, safe and happy.

xxx

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply tojinasc

I don´t remember how it all started but I remember several from the crew! Too bad that the Canadian forum was closed. Glad to hear from you

HeronNS profile image
HeronNS

We can certainly use a story with a happy ending today. Thank you!

Btw thanks to the slow method you invented (and PMRpro tweaked and I adapted to my own needs) I am now tapering from .5 mg to zero, each step twice, will take three months, d.v. 😎😄

(Jean, diagnosed June 2015.)

Highlandtiger profile image
Highlandtiger

It is lovely to read this. I’ve heard your name mentioned by the 'old handers' on many occasions and I’ve been following both DorsetLady and PMRpro 's tapering plans at different stages which they based on yours. As Hidden said you are a legend in your own lifetime! Thank you.

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toHighlandtiger

Good luck when continuing!

Lochy profile image
Lochy

Wonderful story. Gives me hope. X

Evercurious profile image
Evercurious

Thank you so much for telling us your success story, and inventing the DSNS method of tapering! Lovely to hear positive outcomes.

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toEvercurious

I invented what was called Ragnar´s method and EileenH et al developed it and spread out the taper much longer than I started with.

Lonsdalelass profile image
Lonsdalelass

Thank you so much for this.

bunnymom profile image
bunnymom

How nice to read something hopeful. Thanks for taking the time to post. Glad you are well and enjoying life. ☀️

Pirnilla profile image
Pirnilla

I have also used your method and have successfully reached the point where I am doing two days of 0 and one day 0.6! Now I am a bit scared to let go of this last little bit of Pred but I will eventually. I am feeling just fine.

It is so strange that the doctors here in Sweden doesn't know your method. It's more common in other countries. I hope that we will soon have it as a routine even here.

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toPirnilla

I am glad that you are doing well. In your case I would stay at least one month extra. The dose is so low that it don't harm you.

Many years ago I wrote the rheumatic association in Sweden (I may say the wrong organisation after so many years) but did not get any answer.

PMRpro profile image
PMRproAmbassador in reply toPirnilla

It is only because of me disseminating it on the forums I frequent and the rheumy with whom I'm a patient research partner. And despite the English skills of all the Swedes I know there are very few who have landed here.

Pirnilla profile image
Pirnilla in reply toPMRpro

I guess that’s due to the fast that most PMR persons are older and yes, people in Sweden study english from 9 years ord now. It started in the early 80s but the elderly now is not often so highly skilled in english. But the doctors should easily be able to read in english!

I have recommended this site and our scandinavian facebook site to my reumy.

yogabonnie profile image
yogabonnie

thank you for this! It is so encouraging. Much of my family is in Stockholm. Stay safe there. Stay home. I have a question regarding Covid in Sweden. Why in a country where you cannot cross the yellow line until your bag is there do they let everyone go to restaurants and gatherings of less than 500? I dont understand the lax attitude. And I am afraid as my grandson in immunocompromised. Thanks. Hope this is all right to put on the site.

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toyogabonnie

Hi yougabonnie!

From to-day the authorities in Sweden have decided that the restaurants cannot serve at a bardesk. Just at outspred tables. All activities such as meetings for seniors (around 70 persons usually) and other meetings in groups have been cancelled for me and one of the health-care activities is postponed until June 8. I think Sweden has an unusually low number of contaminated persons. What I mean to say is that in Sweden, we are fairly well taken care of by rules from the authorities. All persons 70 + are supposed to stay home - like me and my wife - and we can get help to do shopping etc and deliver to the house. We live close to a park and I take a 30 minutes´ walk alone every day without meeting people closer than 2 meters/yards and my wife takes a 1 hour walk in an area for golfing and outdoor activities - also without getting close to somebody. Take care!

yogabonnie profile image
yogabonnie

tack! Jag tror att min dotter har viruset men hon är okey. Hon hostar och kan inte lukta någonting! Jag tror att de kommer att bli många med en mild version av sjukdomen. Också var i Minnesota bodde du ? Jag bor i St. Paul.. Ta hand om dig själv ( for the moderators this is supposed to say. thanks I think that my daughter has the virus but she is okay. she coughs and can not smell anything. It think that there will be many with mild illness. Also where in Minnesota did you live I live in St. Paul ) thank you so much!!

Domstad profile image
Domstad in reply toyogabonnie

I stayed the school year 1954-55 In Glencoe, M N 50 miles West of Twin Cities

Pon12 profile image
Pon12

I have just started on my pmr journey and felt quite down about it until I read your post please keep the positive posts coming as I am determined to take control of it and find ways of lessening the pain without resulting to taking large doses of steroids which bring their own problems. Any advice gratefully received

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