Fasting

[JWJD]

Has anyone tried fasting? There is new evidence that suggests intermittent fasting works to kill bad cells and stimulates new cells. It has been shown to reduce inflammation. I'm considering trying it and am interested in your experiences.

[gwillistexas]

No. I would be so sick. I have a crazy appetite & have to eat. Good luck with thst😊

[overnighthearingloss]

I have read similar things and there is a video 50 fat and nearly dead. It's about a guy who just juices and turns his life around.

But food choices influence the bacteria in your gut. These bacteria get used to you eating the foods you have always eaten.

If you change this even for a better diet, the gut bacteria will complain. You will possibly get withdrawal symptoms.

You see similar in the video.

He came out the other side and with improved health. But it's as well to be aware of possible side effects before you start down the road. I am not attempting to dissuade you. But it's best to be aware.

[butterflyEi]

I do not think I could fast, my tummy is sensitive to changes and I would dread the acid problems I would have let alone distrupting the bowel.

[overnighthearingloss]

Sorry the video I was referring to was Fat, Sick, and nearly Dead by Joe Cross. The reason I offered warnings is that the liver detoxifies the body. In pbc it is not working at full strength.

I too like the idea of fasting, but have reasoned that it is probably better to take things in stages and clean up the diet first. That way you will at least hopefully be starting with beneficial gut bacteria that hopefully will not cause such extreme die off reactions.

I do believe that the body given the right inputs will try to heal itself.

There is a constant cell division and repair in our bodies and healthier cells are more likely to grow with the right level of nutrients. Different parts of the body renew at different rates but you can see it happening every day in the way that hair and nails grow. Liver cells regrow as well.

What has to be tested is just how much repair is possible of faulty cells. But without the correct nutrition we will never have an answer.

[mrspeffer]

Greetings...I'm very familiar with several different types of fasts and detox programs. I have used the Master Cleanse, the longest for me was 10 days, and to my surprise, after the first day I felt somewhat energized. There are several keys to starting and stopping a fast for the best results. The BIG one that I used was Dr. Shulze. He's a Naturopathic doctor who studied under the renowned Dr. Christopher. Both of these gentleman hd clinics that were actually healing people, so they were shut down by the FDA. Dr. Schulze has a program(among many others) that is challenging. It is called the Incurable Disease Detox. It is a 30 day juice fast mixed with all sorts of herbal teas, different tinctures, flush drinks, dry brushing, hot/cold showers and the famous detox bath. I must say there were days I wanted to stop, but i kept going with my support team. The experience was life changing on many different levels.

There is a clinic in No. California called TRUE NORTH. They are the pioneers on water fasting and juice fasting. I'm probably going to go there for about 6 weeks . They feel that the combination or the water only fasting will reset the body and reverse many diseases. Although PBC may not be reversed, it can be slowed down significantly.

More recently, there have been juice stores popping up with detox programs. They have 3-6 juices per day programs. BEWARE...most are NOT ORGANIC. That means that all the pesticides, and other nasties that seep into the water table are then ingested by the consumer wanting to if the body of the same! Suga juice company makes bottled organic, BPA free bottle juices that you can use in a pinch.

With any fast, you need to be in a good place to rest...not going to work, etc. The body needs time to heal. They always recommend a raw vegetable/fruit diet at least 3-5 days prior, and breaking fast with juices/broths for a few days(1/2 as many as you fasted) before you introduce fruits/veggies, then more solid foods after that.

Ok..that's my rant for the day..Best of luck on your journey

[JWJD in reply to mrspeffer]

Did you see improved liver function levels as a result of the Master Cleanse?

[mrspeffer in reply to JWJD]

Yes. Anytime I fast before tests, I see a decrease in numbers, especially Alkaline Phos.

[gwillistexas in reply to mrspeffer]

My dr doesn’t require fasting for my hepatic lab. Does yours?

[JWJD in reply to gwillistexas]

No, I'm not required to fast before tests. I was just wondering if anyone has has seen test results improve over time through intermittent fasting.

[Hidden in reply to JWJD]

I read and I don’t know the credentials of the site, but it was supported by intercept. It’s called Rethink pbc. That Alp can rise after eating if your blood type O or B due to influx of intestinal alp. I had read before that having the test done on empty stomach can make a difference so I always have mine done before breakfast.

[kandiepat in reply to JWJD]

The reason it took so long to diagnose me was I kept going on the Dr.Sandra Cabot liver diet. everytime I went on that diet, my enzymes went back to normal. I didn't know I had PBC at that time but it proves to me that diet has a lot to do with our condition! I wish I was that enthusiastic now but I just take the URSO and keep going. Kandiepat

[mrspeffer in reply to kandiepat]

So glad you sited Dr. Cabot. I'm all for lower enzymes. Not going to remove our condition, but slow the hell down.I am allergic to URSO..it's supha based, so i had to find my own road to improvement. Ever try Livaplex by Standard Process? I recently had a fast rise in LFT's. Alk Phos went up 200 points, so of course I was writing my will. Well, an old friend/Dr. contacted an Ayurvedic doctor and they suggested I take Livaplex and milk thistle, eat vegan., which i do anyway, and soak in a tub with epsom salts daily for 20 minutes to draw out impurities. Number went down to my normal highs within 3 weeks. So I am a believer and continue to use those supplements daily. Ever look at Dr. Budwig's Cancer diet? It's something I'm unfortunately having to visit right now...but I have hope and know all is as it is suppose to be. She has you mix cottage cheese with flax seed and flaxseed oil. Recipe online. Nice preventative and curative(I pray). Peace out

[Sun65 in reply to mrspeffer]

That’s great. Do you eat a lot of carbs

[mrspeffer in reply to Sun65]

Not really....I do eat them in the form of veggies, but stay away from grains as they bother me causing digestive and arthritic issues. FYI...glad you found this post, but I had to close this account. New user name is mrspeffer2. Be well

[Jlruggie in reply to mrspeffer]

That’s great!!!

[Angelina_Vay74 in reply to mrspeffer]

Thank you so much for sharing this information. I was diagnosed with PBC. I'm raw vegan for almost a year and vegan for two tears. I started to practice detox programs with fasting and colonics when I turned raw vegan.

When I read about PBC, the conventional medicine prohibits fasting for this condition. Have you done fasting after you were diagnosed? For how many days? My latest one was 4 month ago for two weeks on herbs.

I will definitely call True North clinic in Sacramento, heard about it from a different source as well.

Why you think PBC can not be reversed? I know that they claim it by the books in traditional medical world. But what about people who tried naturopathic methods to detox and repair their liver?

[mrspeffer in reply to Angelina_Vay74]

Hi...Our livers are not the main probkem...it's our haywire auto immune system. Even with cleanse, True North told me Maybe on curing. I'm in my 22nd year since diagnosed. I really try to not listen to weste n medicine hype. There is also a place in Sedona that does water and juice fasts. More $$ than True North but groovy location

[angelina_vay in reply to mrspeffer]

I fully agree with you, Western medicine kills us...Our bodies are able to heal itself.I consulted European naturopathic doctor and he told me that he successfully treated patients with detoxification/fasting for cirrhosis. An autoimmune response is reversible according to him. He suggested 1-day water fast every week, and three-day water fast every month with colonics.

As soon as you educate yourself on how to do it, you don't need to spend big $$$ on the procedures. You can do it at home.

How do you feel now? How are you managing the progression? IS it still in stage one?

[mrspeffer]

No, my lab tests are non fasting..

[mrspeffer in reply to mrspeffer]

I usually cleanse/fast a few times yearly.

[gwillistexas in reply to mrspeffer]

Mine too except for CMP

[mrspeffer]

Me too...where do you live ? I live in Arizona

[gwillistexas in reply to mrspeffer]

Texas

[mrspeffer in reply to gwillistexas]

We are looking at Texas as an option to live. Where in Texas are you? Texas seems to be a place we would fit in

[iagra]

When you say "fasting", what exactly do you mean by it? How many hours? Days?

I'm just curious. I'm for a balanced diet, with good nutrion and small meals, whenever possible. But, I'm always interested in other ideas and opinions.

Thanks!

[mrspeffer in reply to iagra]

True fasting is with water only. The fasting we've been discussing is really more of a cleanse. Fruit and vegetable juices, and of course water too. No solid foods. When doing a juicing fast, i drink about 16 0z of freshed pressed, organic veg/fruits every 2 hours for the total of 6 servings. The last one is a "fat" drink made with a small amount of nut milk and protein powder blended with fruit. Linda of a really weak smoothie. The other cleanse was the Master Cleanse. Full recipe is online. But is it lemon with water and maple syrup with cayenne. that is unlimited drinking throughout the day...usually about 60 oz.. When I fast/cleanse, I always aim for 3-5 days or longer. I stayed on juice fasting for 30 days before.

Water fasting is recommended under medical supervision, although, you can postpone meals with 1/2 day water fasting at home. Hope that helps

[iagra in reply to mrspeffer]

Thanks very much! Very informative.

[mrspeffer in reply to mrspeffer]

My pleasure

[Jlruggie]

I’ve never been able to fast but it would work I’d try it

[Jlruggie]

I’ve never been able to fast. If it works I’d try it. Yoga, vegetarianism quest, daily yoga, 40 oz daily water and avoiding alcohol work so far.

[mrspeffer in reply to Jlruggie]

Sounds like what you are doing is great. I too am vegetarian, strive for vegan/raw, no alcohol, refined sugars, etc. I practice yoga, actually been a teacher for many years. You might consider increasing your water intake. Recent studies show that humans need to drink 67% of their weight. So, that means if you are 120 lbs, you need minimum 80 oz. daily. I have found a great electrolyte call Skratch that is a nice addition once daily to 20 oz water. I really feel better with it, plus it"s relatively inexpensive.

What style yoga do you like the best? I favor Iyengar and Kundalini, but enjoy all styles. Clears my head and makes me feel sooo much better...very alive...you know what I mean.

[JWJD]

I have an overlapping condition – AIH + PBC. I was diagnosed last year and am currently on Urso, Imuran and Prednisone. Since modern medicine can tell us little about why we have this condition, my approach is to self-experiment. I initially tried eliminating gluten, dairy, soy, corn, eggs, alcohol and everything artificial. However, I did not see any impact on my #’s. I am currently experimenting with AIP (Autoimmune Protocol), as made famous by Sarah Ballantyne. My diet is typically a ton of vegetables, meat/fish, some fruit and healthy fats. My doctor has been adjusting my meds, so it’s difficult to decipher which effects are drug induced and which are not. Nevertheless, my #’s are at a relatively good level – 163 AlkPhos, 29 AST, 31 ALT (at diagnosis they were 480AlkPhos,78 AST, 128 ALT). I have had periods where my meds have been steady and I’ve not followed my diet, only to see my #’s rise. Therefore, I suspect there is something inflammatory that I have eliminated with the AIP. The downside is AIP is very strict and tough to follow; however, I’m very motivated to get off these drugs (especially the Prednisone and Imuran) or at least reduce the quantity. Lately, I have been reading about fasting and some of the studies conducted by Valter Longo. He has conducted mice and human studies that have shown positive results with MS patients. I plan to do 24hours fast/week and see what happens. If all else fails, vegan is next on my list to try. I enjoy meat, so I’m hoping it doesn’t come to that.

[mrspeffer in reply to JWJD]

WOW! Your plate is full! I have found diet to be key for me. I'm basically vegan, but every once in a while I think I'm "normal" and try some poultry or fish. Then I remember why I usually don't eat that. My system has problem digesting them, even with enzymes. Well, of course, there is an inflammation factor with all animal products. The only food items I can ingest from animal with ease is raw goat cheese. It's hard to find quality vegan food at restaurants, so I usually eat home. Sounds like you might be familiar with the JJ Virgin anti-inflammation diet. She has 7 deadly foods, and i'm amazed how upon elimination of them all, I felt so much better, and my #'s reduced. Here's the list of foods...

Peanuts, Soy, Sugar, Dairy, Corn, Eggs, Gluten....Thank goodness for gluten free oatmeal!

[JWJD in reply to mrspeffer]

I find that if I have a few cheat days, my energy plummets and I feel like crap. I think everyone is a little different and needs to figure out want works for each.

[positivethoughts03 in reply to JWJD]

Hi JWJD - I enjoyed reading your past post and hoping to ask you a question. 2 months ago I was dx with Overlap Syndrome AIH&PBC and like you on URSO Imuran and Prednisone. I am not liking the feeling of all these meds taking over my body but obviously have no choice. My question is have you been able to eliminate the Prednisone and/or Imuran? I'm so curios because as I stated I would give anything to be off the prednisone especially. It really makes me feel a bit "crazy" and I don't like it.

When you're free, please respond as to your current situation. Thanks so much and be well!! Positive thoughts xo

[JWJD in reply to positivethoughts03]

Hello! Yes, I don't like my meds either, but I know they're necessary. I'm currently at 2.5 mg of Prednisone. My AST and ALT are normal, but my Alk Phos is high. I have not been very diligent with my diet this year. I'm working to get back on track, as I feel so much better when I eat well. It's just very difficult to eat well all the time. I need to find a little balance. I really want to get completely off the Prednisone and eventually the Imuran.

Best wishes

[mrspeffer]

Me too

[Gilz1702]

There is a book called diet myths which also talks about the benefits of fasting with autoimmune conditions. I follow the 16 hour fasting diet. Eat in between 12pm and 8pm. Basically I skip breakfast ( I do drink tea though in the morning ). I definitely feel better for it and it controls my weight which I now feel easily increases.

[Mrsfancypants]

I fast about twice a week, but fast 16 hours and feed for 8( under 500 calls ) It makes me feel so much better and alert Have a look at Dr. Fung ( fasting guru ) on you tube I’m still learning

[Awechitect]

Yes, I am 42, male, have been on (OMAD) one meal a day, eliminated dairy, carbs, sugars from diet, approximately 22 hour fast, for four months now. Eating 70 GM of protein (whole eggs10 or chicken3/4th)and 6 cucumbers with skin daily

Talking apple cider vinegar, himalian pink salt, vitamin d, calcium, vitamin k, vitamin e, fish oil supplements along with bile acids,

Been working out in gym while 21 hour fasting, I take two tea spoon black coffee to pump adrenaline before working out, lost 18 kg fat gained 3 kg muscle,

I eat after gym workout,

The results are phenomenal:

Reduced tryglysrides 60percent

Reversed pre diabetes40 percent

Reversed liver/kidney function markers300 percent

Just starting to reverse other auto emune markers. My estimate is another 6 months and I will have eleminated 95 Percent of all visceral as well as abdominal fat and inflammation through ketosis and autophagy, and hoping to be cured.(Inshallah)

If any one needs assistance with intermittent fasting especially OMAD email me

[e-mail]

[Sun65 in reply to Awechitect]

That’s great your doing all that. I need to figure out my diet as well. Was diagnosed 1 yr ago. I believe I got this disease3 yrs ago. How do you take your meds and supplements on an empty stomach. Does it hurt you?