Digestion?

[lownskater52]

Hey everybody,

32 yrs old Vegan with some poor digestion issues with b12d (159) for 10 years or so Been supplementing 3.5 months heavily. Started with injections every other day for 3 weeks and I've been getting 2+ a week plus oral supplements.

My digestion has gotten progressively worse for the past 10 years to the point I'm at now where I'm frequently bloated and digest for poorly (evidenced by loose, semi-undigested stools). Has anybody's digestion/bloating gotten better with supplementation and if so how long did it take to start coming back.

I'm worried that my b12 supplementation program isn't working as my last blood test at 2.5 months showed I'm still anemic and my digestion still sucks. I'm also having some slight tingling in my feet occasionally that's been coming in recently. Also worried it could be something more serious like POEMS mentioned in my other post I just created.

I really appreciate the feedback.

[pvanderaa]

Have you tried going gluten and dairy free? I developed intolerance to these about the same time that my B12D was diagnosed.

Maybe your stomach juices are too alkaline. How do you react to putting a salsa on your meals? Orange or tomato juice after a meal can also help digestion if you don’t make enough acid your self .

Heartburn symptoms are pretty much the same for both too acidic and too alkaline.

Have you been tested for heliobacter pylori infection?

I’m pretty sure I’ve had nerve damage to my vagus nerve so my symptoms are ravenous hunger after getting B12 as the repair of the nerve damage is confusing my brain.

[lownskater52 in reply to pvanderaa]

Hey Pvanderaa. Yeah I've been gluten and dairy free for many years. I'm convinced that I'm achlorhydric (no stomach acid). I think I'm going to start taking a betaine hcl/digestive enzyme supplement to see if that helps.

[pvanderaa in reply to lownskater52]

I add a couple of tablespoons of salsa to every savory dish I eat. I think it really helps settle my stomach.

[Gambit62 Administrator]

Being vegan doesn't rule out the possibility of PA and your stomach issues make this or another absorption problem sound likely. oral supplementation doesn't work for everyone with B12 absorption problems and unless the absorption problem is treatable (eg h pylori infection) you probably need to start thinking about injections. Suggest that you try to talk it through with your GP.

It may also be worth remembering that anxiety is also a symptom of B12 deficiency.

[lownskater52 in reply to Gambit62]

Hey Gambit. That's for writing. I'm definitely stuck with some anxiety right now. Im 3.5 months into b12 supplementation (oral daily and injections twice a week) and am still anemic which worries me greatly. Iron levels are fine. Not sure where else to turn.

[Gambit62 Administrator in reply to lownskater52]

is the anaemia macrocytic (larger, rounder red blood cells) or another type of anaemia?

Macrocytic anaemia due to B12 deficiency it should have cleared by now - if it hasn't it implies that there is something else going on - could be functional deficiency (test for MMA), could be folate deficiency (also causes macrocytic anaemia).

You really do need to talk things through with your doctor.

[lownskater52 in reply to Gambit62]

My past check was a month ago and it wasnt technically macrocytic but somewhat on the high end. MCV: 94.1 and MCH at 31.5. It has been macrocytic before. My doctor thinks it might be iatrogenic anemia caused by ordering myself too many blood tests which is why I've waited a month etest myself again. I did have my MMA tested about 3 months ago after a couple weeks of b12 injections and it was great at 88 (87-318 N). Folate last tested was well above low too.

My doctor isn't worried, say it can take 6 months for the anemia to go away but I trust you guys more. I think I'm in trouble here.

[Gambit62 Administrator in reply to lownskater52]

whilst iatrogenic anaemia does sound like a load of psycho-babble, it is the case that not everyone's cells are the same and some people will naturally have cells that are outside normal ranges and it may be that you are one of them.

There aren't any medical professionals on this forum so we don't have all the answers. We may understand elements of B12 deficiency better than the average GP but there are a lot of other things that could be going on.

It can take several months for symptoms to quieten down and you are, I think still in that phase. I know it is difficult but I really do think you need to go with your GP.

Red blood cells live on average for 100 days - some will live longer so I would expect the signs of anaemia to have started to disappear by 3 months and it sounds as if your measures are returning to normal just that there are still some cells that haven't yet died and been replaced.

[wedgewood]

Irrespective of if you have Pernicious Anaemia ( which brought awful gut issues for me , including bloating , burping, poor digestion and stomach pains ) you might find it helpful to take probiotics , which help to encourage your good gut bacteria . I’m in the UK , and I suspect you are in the US , so I don’t know if you can get the probiotic that I bought here , called Symprove , which helped me enormously . I took it for 3 months , and the difference it made was huge . Maybe you have something similar?

I don’t take it anymore , but find that probiotic foods like organic sauerkraut , real yoghurt , kimchi etc are helpful . Whatever , if you do take a probiotic , and it doesn’t work for you , you will have done no harm .

Our gut bacteria or flora is very important for our general health . There are lots of books about it , authored by excellent doctors . Best wishes .

[lownskater52 in reply to wedgewood]

Hey wedgewood. Thanks for writing me I really appreciate it more than you know. I am indeed in the states. I'm going to take your advice. I just ordered some betaine hcl and digestive enzymes. I really hope they help as I'm convinced I'm achlorhydric. Why did you stop taking it? Is your digestion back to normal? Do you think it resolved because you resolved your PA b12d? Thank you.

[wedgewood in reply to lownskater52]

Well I can only know that my good gut bacteria has improved no end . I do now put more thought into what I eat. I try to have a portion of REAL yoghurt ( not those fancy fruit-flavoured jobs ) I occasionally do take a probiotic capsule if my gut feels a bit “dodgy “ I try to eat food that hadn’t been processed or otherwise “messed with .”

Yes the lack of stomach acid leads to.a lot of ill health .

I can’t imagine that the B12 injections alone can have resulted in my gut’s improvement . The Achlorhydria will always be there . Google “ diet for Achlorhydria “ and you will find some useful suggestions . . I do drink acidic drinks like orange juice to which I add a teaspoon of powdered vItamin C .

The betaine Hcl will help before large meals especially ones with meat . I do take a multi-vitamin and mineral tablet daily .

There is a test you can take to find out if you lack stomach acid . I can’t get it here in UK , but I’m sure that you can in USA . There is the simple bicarbonate of soda test of course , but doctors will scoff at that !

I wish you all the very best in your battle for good health 👍👍👍

[lownskater52 in reply to wedgewood]

Thank you kindly for the words of wisdom my friend.

[Hidden]

I suffer from microscopic colitis which causes absorption issues. I find if I don't eat clean I get terrible pain. I've been taking kefir on an empty stomach and that really seems to have helped .... Tesco Polish section is the most cost effective way to try it. Hope you find some relief.

[Hanneke12]

Probiotics, liquirice root, lime juice in water, olive oil, dried apricots, and keeping a food diary to see what foods trigger your digestion problems and which ones help...that's what is helping me. It's a long process, but no, B12 injections don't just heal everything. If your stomach is inflamed, you need to be gentle with it and cradle it back to health... Still, I eat one 'off' thing -for me it's onion or wheat (not all gluten) or cream (not all dairy)-, and I am back at square one. But at least I know more and more. Good luck...!

[Hanneke12 in reply to Hanneke12]

Ps. I also have more symptoms than just the B12 seems to solve. You keep trying to 'solve' the riddle. But it could be so many things... Thyroidism/ISTH, Lyme's disease, IBS/SIBO, a genetic thing, a not yet found auto-immune thing, or the rest category fibromyalgia... However, knowing I have anxiety and knowing that a sort of obsessive search is part of the list of symptoms, allows some perspective I find, and allows me to relax along the way as well. Just 'being' with it, seeing it as part of this weird experience we call life, gives me much needed time to breathe.

[lownskater52 in reply to Hanneke12]

Thank you Hanneke12. I really need to work on controlling my anxiety. I'm just scared that I'm broken in a way that cant be fixed. I've been heavily supplementing b12 (injections twice a week and oral daily) and am still anemic (iron levels are fine). Dont know what else to do...