CKD diet and nutrients? Which do you take?

[alice_lirey]

Hi guys! Who is at the stage of predialysis, please tell me how many times a week do you eat meat?

And do you take ketosteril or ketoanalogs of amino acids?

what about sorbents?

[Bassetmommer NKF Ambassador]

Not sure what you mean by predialysis but if you mean stage 4 or 5..the answer to meat for me was NONE. Especially red meat. NO pork, lamb or veal and no beef. NO sausage or other processed meats. At stage 5 I did reincorporate some chicken but maybe once or twice a week and not much.

[alice_lirey in reply to Bassetmommer]

thank you for reply! And did you take any ketoanalogs?

[Bassetmommer NKF Ambassador in reply to alice_lirey]

nope, I did not take any supplements like that. Amino acids and such

[Badger2024 in reply to Bassetmommer]

I’m super new to this. Not formally diagnosed yet but somewhere in stage 3. My doctor still thinks it’s just about managing blood pressure. She even thinks salt is fine if your blood pressure is. So I’m learning everything here. She’s happy to refer me to a nephrologist and renal dietician but doesn’t think it’s necessary. Luckily in Australia we can pretty much just ask to see a specialist. So I noticed that you refer to pork as red meat. I thought that it was white meat. Ham is obviously out and processed pork but is a little lean pork in a salt-free stir fry okay once a week? I’m mainly plant based now with fish once or twice a week.

Sorry Alice to bombard your thread here. I don’t take any supplements yet as I’m still just learning. I was taking vitamin D daily and magnesium at night for restless legs but have stopped those too for now as I don’t know if they’re okay

[userotc in reply to Badger2024]

Re vit D, I believe its an overwhelming Yes and we believe mum has benefitted from that both for her stage 3 CKD and elsewhere eg immune system. See also 1st link below.

For magnesium/other nutrients, I think there's more ifs & buts (2nd, 3rd links) which may be more person or case-specific, as healthcare generally is. Mum has had good support from a qualified Nutritional Therapist - doctors are nutrition untrained/unqualified.

kidney.org/news/kidneyCare/...

kidneycoach.com/nutrients/m...

kidney.org/blog/ask-doctor/...

[Bassetmommer NKF Ambassador in reply to Badger2024]

Check with your doctor. Vit D is important, and you probably should keep taking it. I take a low dose of magnesium for years.

[jodaer in reply to Bassetmommer]

Agree about the Vit D but be very careful. It can accumulate in your system and eventually kill you if you're taking it and don't need it.

[Bassetmommer NKF Ambassador in reply to jodaer]

Yes and just like any other product like a vitamin or mineral, you should have labs drawn regularly to make sure you do not become toxic or low.

[userotc in reply to Bassetmommer]

Coincidentally just read Dr Axe article below. Would your personal experience tally with this comment from that (Ive read similar comments from leading kidney organisations)?

"In the early stages of chronic kidney disease, you may need to limit the amount of protein you eat. If you need to start dialysis treatments, you may have to eat more protein than before". draxe.com/nutrition/renal-d...

[purifire7777]

Okay, is Stage 3-a part of predialysis? I hope not. I don't eat any dead animals, since 1996.

[Bassetmommer NKF Ambassador in reply to purifire7777]

There is no such term such a pre-dialysis. It is stages.

[alice_lirey in reply to Bassetmommer]

I mean, BEFORE dialysis and WHILE you have different diet, sooo…

[Hily in reply to purifire7777]

I don't know anybody who eats non dead animals!

[NWRobin]

Hi Alice,

I am a 78 yr old senior who had my right kidney removed September 2022 because of a cancerous large tumor. Then my cancer came back in my liver and lungs in the spring of 2023. I immediately started on an anti cancer diet and before I got on medication I was free of the lung cancer. It was suggested that I should not have dairy or meat. The guidelines for seniors for meat consumption is only 8 kilograms of meat a day. I believe we all eat way too much meat. I live in Canada and all meat in Canada is hormone and antibiotic free. You may not be a senior, but I believe the less meat consumption the better. I don't eat meat every day. Making it a treat can be a good idea. Good luck and the best to you!

[chicablue]

As of stage 5, no meat

[2023CKD]

I’m just trying to figure this all out. I’m fairly newly diagnosed at stage 3A.

What I found helpful is to find books on kidney friendly foods and diets. Use the National Kidney Association guidelines for minerals and protein The amount of protein varies depending on what stage you are in and perhaps other factors

Because animal protein is difficult for the kidneys to process it is recommended that you switch to non animal protein.

I’m still learning so I don’t understand if eggs and dairy protein is included.

Lean unprocessed meats with low salt and nitrates found in processed meats are best. There are definitely recommended serving sizes if you do eat them. It surprised me that even fish and seafood protein are to be limited.

Some types of proteins are to be avoided.

As far as books on kidney diets and kidney friendly foods and supplements I’ve discovered it’s a case of buyer beware, some may help and others may actually harm your kidneys

There are books with food lists specific to England and US.

Also there are books that are not written by doctors.

Several have been noted as inaccurate and others written by people who may be trying to monetize their recommendations by selling diet supplements pills and who have no medical background.

Most reputable ones seem to focus on changing diet, exercise and lifestyle habits. Think eating whole unprocessed foods. Look at labels and choose no salt varieties and season with spices and herbs some of these are beneficial to kidney health

Look for credentials on the book’s author. Chose one written preferably by a reputable kidney specialist. Look for fact based data that confirms studies based on research. Google the author to validate the information the best tat you can. Read the reviews carefully keep in mind many offer incentives for reviews look for patterns and legitimate negative feedback

While there may be supplements that may help slow the progression, the best way to prevent further damage and perhaps reverse or stabilize progression is to manage your diet. There is no magic pill.

There are a few supplements recommended based on research by some kidney doctors in their books that you can buy over the counter

Eat a lot of antioxidant rich foods as they may help reverse the damage depending on your condition

I’ve found many of the kidney friendly foods are things that I enjoy eating anyway. I’ve also found that the things I need to avoid are things I can live without or significantly minimize.

Also, buyer beware! Many of the kidney cookbooks may not be based on current research or be appropriate for the stage of the disease that you are in.

There are guidelines for each stage but ask your doctor for their advice.

The National kidney Association is a good resource. They also have a very basic app that is food at tracking daily intake of protein, potassium, sodium and phosphate in your diet. Most labels show protein, sodium and potassium. The kidney food lists have phosphate. And the other minerals in foods so you can build up your food list. The database is limited.

As the disease progresses you also have to limit water intake as too much water puts a strain on the kidneys which are tasked to manage your water intake,

It’s a lot to digest. I try to do a little research and do small manageable changes to my diet and exercise every day so it’s not so overwhelming.

It is the best way to change habits.

If I feel overwhelmed I take a day off or change from reading about the disease to looking for recipes with kidney friendly ingredients that sound easy and delicious my husband is eating what he enjoys. I have hit a home run on several kidney friendly recipes.

Increasing my quality of life is worth it to me. My latest tests showed a slight improvement in my GFR after a few weeks of changes. It may be insignificant but it gives me hope.

I’ve discovered a key point… the primary goal is not keeping out of dialysis, it is knowing that the biggest risk from Kidney disease is the negative impact it has on the heart. One of the kidney’s job is to filter the toxins out of the bloodstream. If left in the blood the toxins negatively impact your heart health .

As a result kidney disease patients have a higher risk of dieing from complications related to cardiovascular heart diseases then dialysis The majority of patients never make it to dialysis.

Good luck to all.

I’m still reading and learning. I am hopeful that my efforts will pay off longterm. Hopefully yours will as well.

[Badger2024 in reply to 2023CKD]

Thanks so much for this information