Am I entitled to DLA with having anx... - Mental Health Sup...
Am I entitled to DLA with having anxiety and depression?
I don't eat and my health now has been affected my cpn said he will fill in forms with me. Has anyone got DLA for depression and anxiety?
i work for dwp the answer to that you can not claim dla for depression dla stands for disabled living allowance you are not disabled
It wasn't until the other week that my ESA form which was passed on to Shaw Trust who help people like myself into work over an up to 2yr period, that I found out that I am actually classed as DISABLED. Now, I cannot claim for DLA but i can claim for Personal Independence Payments.
As an "employee" of the DWP and what this site represents, surely you could of stated this to the question asked, rather than being so blunt.
I'd love to give you my kind regards but i do not think you deserve them. Take caution not to fall off that extremely high horse you appear to of rode in on.
Good answer
That's what people who work for DWP come across. No empathy and think everyone is a scrounged. But people in glass houses. Maybe one day you will be in the same predicament.
With that attitude I hope he does end up on the disabled so he can see what we suffer seem as he thinks he’s so high and mighty and not prepared to help anyone that as asked him for help.
He needs firing from that job as his temperament is all wrong you are supposed to have good relations with people on a score of 1 to 10 1 being the lowest 10 being the highest I would say he’s minus 1as he as no relations with the people full stop
Well said x
Can I just add in here hat I use to work full time and due to depression and anxiety (Which left me suicidal and also housebound) can I fact challenge someone to the breaking point, for you to sit behind a keyboard or mobile phone and Confess that you work for the DWP with that attitude is a disgrace! You are judging someone who is only looking for advice and shaming them for that! DWP is a joke if they employ people like yourself! Regardless of how small you mental health is it should never be a laughing matter so I ask you kindly to get off your high horse and use your break before you type!
Actually, people with depression and anxiety can claim DLA. It comes down to what causes your depression/anxiety. E.G If alcohol abuse causes it following a binge.
This is simply not true and irresponsible advice. I have been claiming DLA for depression and anxiety for the last few years, so the answer is yes you can. Also severe clinical depression as a chronic illness DOES mean that you are disabled.
This is good to know as i am dealing with clinical depression severe anxiety. The problem is that nobody takes our problem seriou at all. They think we can just snap out of it, if i had a quarter for every times i heard that one. It makes me so angry when people tell me that!!!!
I agree I have the same with PTSD and BPSD with Anxiety, but no one understands till they go through it I guess, like we don't feel bad enough for being ill etc in the first place kmt
How long do you have to have the condition before you can make a claim and how much is the benefit if you are granted ? I need all the help I can get as not getting better quickly and have bills to pay
if you claimed DLA before 2013 you will get DLA until 6 May 2018 then you will get a letter off the DWP tell you to make a new claim for PIP ..DLA stopt in 2013 ..Its now ESA iv triad to claim for Depression and was told it was stopt in 2013. and DLA his stopt in 2018 its pip I triad for pip and got O points and I just lost my wife 3 month ago and my sister 4 months ago am 64 coming up in jan 2018 am on ESA for Depression. I live in a 2 bedroom house because theirs only me iv got to pay full bedroom TAX and I can not work am a lorry driver and have work 37 years until I lost my wife and sister . I can only walk slowly not even a 500 yards and I still cannot get DLA or PIP hope this help you to understand what DLA for it Means what it say
What a horrible reply. having a mental health issue is dis abling
That is a disgusting response, especially if you work for DWP. you have always been able to claim DLA for this albeit a hard process. PIP has now made this a little easier.
That ignorant patronising Victorian reply is why you people are so difficult to deal with
Think you need to understand what your talking about before you reply, depression IS a disability. SMH
Depression is a disability idiot
you are 100% right mate Depression his not a Disability. people out their who are claiming for Depression and getting DLA. they are all in for a big big Shock on the 6 of May 2018. it all changes from DLA to PIP and it time it did . iv work 37 years and I cannot get DLA iv lost my wife die of cancer am on Depression now and am 63 DLA stop in 2013 I tried for PIP I got O points ...My GP said I am in a stage of Depression . but because I can cook for my self and walk on my owe am not Disability even tho I walk slowly am not Disability ...thank you for reading sorry about any speling
Did you appeal ??? Re apply and get some professional help filling out the forms !!! Good luck and sorry to hear about the tough time you're going through. Keep smiling ...even if it's forced in the beginning....the day will hopefully come when that starts to change. Best Wishes. Dee
thank you Dee. I give in at times just wish I could drive a lorry again id be out looking for work. but who going to give me work... no one I walk slow and I always thinking about past wife sister . thank again dee bless you always
My belief was that if you suffer from depression and anxiety then you are covered by the equality act due to being classed as disabled.
So is someone unable to work due to mental health not entitled to help of support financially from the government
😐hmm you sound like a dwp worker- get your facts straight
have you ever suffered with mental health issues? Miss high horse???!!!! It may not Be a physical disability but depression and other mental health issues cripple the mind, make you unable to leave you bed let alone your house. Maybe research the subject before you comment next time love Yh
Idiot!!!!
And that's why they employ you. Depression is a debilitating illness that affects every area of your life. Surely you get training and have to be well informed, because it appears you are not. I hope it never happens to you and yours because I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy, let alone an ignorant little bureaucrat.
Unlike!
Severe anxiety and depression are every bit as disabling as physical ill health. If you truly do work for dwp then clearly you need to educate yourself a little better and overcome your obvious prejudice and ignorance regarding this important matter. Shame on you for such a poor response.
It is a disability. Certified and you can absolutely get dla for it thousands of people do. It is a recognised disability. What a ridiculous and misleading answer.
Totally wrong information- you should be sacked
You have no idea what it’s like to live with debilitating condition or how it effects you not just you but your family and life in general . Every days a battle going to work , getting up , washing ,coping ... living. .. read up on it educate yourself .. I sincerely hope it never happens to you !!!
You need retraining and there is 2 components to dla and it is not all about people in wheelchairs and physical disability. Don't give advice on here when you don't know.
100% right on this one
Wow...reaching in such a no if's no but's self-righteous way reaching a decision based on very little information that you presented as an actual FACT is hardly professional ( and you were answering in a professional capacity ) !!!
Just because you work for the DWP ( Do they still send you on courses on " how NOT to pay people " in the hope they don't appeal ( and just go away ) where the initial decision is more often than not overturned )! Doesn't mean you are qualified to pass that statement on as fact !!! I would be interested to know which dept. of the DWP you work in tbh.
Luckily the poster didn't take your comment as you had presented it and with the help and support available to them is likely to receive some extra help !! Which I am sure the outcome of which ( haha...no I am not at all...but I DO hope ) will be decided on an individual basis
I sincerely hope that neither you or anyone close to you succumbs to the often ( not always but DEFINITELY sometimes ) totally debilitating symptoms that can be caused by such mental health conditions because it doesn't differentiate between class, color, sexuality, religious beliefs or even your employment status !!!!!!!!
I am contacting DWP to inform them of your incorrect advice on this forum.
A mental health condition makes you no less disabled them someone with a physical health impairment.
Skyfallone you are 100% right on this. iv told a lot of people you cannot get PIP for depression . you did one time if you was on the sick with DEPRESSION it went to DLA after 6 month, theirs no such thing as DLA now it change over to PIP and you got to be really ill to get PIP.
What crap severe depression is a mental disabillity so yes that person can anyone who works for dwp would know that
Im kate i got really bad anxiety depression and fibro and i was turned down for pip i dont think thats fair or right i know people on less then me and they get it why not me i think its disgusting
You would have to explain how this condition is severely affecting your ability to function normally ie mention if you are so depressed you leave the cooker on by mistake,you need help to clean house as depression makes you unable to do this.
I only got help when i
mentioned: i'd left gas on unlit
all my saucepans burnt as left on
unable to go to shop on my own etc
Needed help to clean house etc
It is only when you enable the disability people to see how depression severely impacts your everyday life that you can claim
I didn't get it. and I'm 63 I got ESA I lost my wife with cancer 3 months ago I cannot drive a lorry am that streest I lost my sister all in 4 months my GP told me am in the first stage of Depression iv work 37 years and will not get my pension until am 65 yro am on ESA now . I tried for pip and was told it go.s by points I got O points.. even tho I walk slowly DLA mean what it says. am 64 in jan 2018 .DLA stop in 2013 if you on DLA before 2013 youl get it until 6 May 2018 then the DWP will send a letter for you to make a new claim for PIP . this all I know about the DLA it his what it says thank you good luck ...
I triad to claim DLA for Depression. Iv just lost two Brother in the same year and one of my brothers son. I was put on ESA and was told to claim PIP I got O points am now on ESA for one year. But I still affto go to the Job Centre Plus when they send for me some time it only a phone call off the Job Centre. I was told I do not affto look for work for one year But the job Centre told me they still can put me on a training Couse .I just don't under stand this at all.. I do know you cannot Claim DLA for Depression at all it stop in 2013..but those who are on DLA before 2013 will be put on PIP if they score 8 points or more and some people will be put on UC and will aft to wait 5 to 6 weeks before they get any pay off UC ...
I live in northern ireland
I got the low rate carer allowance when I was unwell, as my wife was caring for me all the time. Poor sod 
and also got low rate mobility, as I was agoraphobic, so needed someone with me all the time to try and get out. couldnt use public transport, well I still cant but I'm working on that now.
Each one is now £21 week. there are higher rates, if you are really disabled too. i.e. cant do certain things and need help.
If you do need help ask for it, not sure about Northern Ireland although it is part of the UK at the moment, so it should be the same
Although saying that haven't they just stopped it, I think there's a new thing called PIP
ah yes here's a link
gov.uk/government/policies/...
B
xxx
My doctor, consultants and I have provided documentation, depression, pain (due to a medical condition) and also provided photographs of the damage to falling over, dropping pans of boiling water, kettle - pouring to make a cup of tea - missed and poured over my hands. Need help to physically get up because of the pain etc. Housebound.
I do not qualify for DLA. So on top of my depression and medical illness and all the medical evidence, was advised do not cook, you can crawl so you don't need mobility DLA.
That's my situation but hey there are some who slip through and get it.
Not so long ago, a 30 year old, cannot read or write, wears pads (for incontinence), wheelchair, mental age of 3 years old, needs to be spoonfed, cannot walk or use her hands or arms was made to go to ATOS for a medical and was deemed fit for work? To clarify:
30 year old - mental age of 3
Nappies
Illterate -
Wheelchair placed in the wheelchair as she cannot use hands or arms
Cannot dress or feed herself - FIT FOR WORK? What exactly can this lady do for work?
i had my forms completed for me by an Advisor
GP backed my application for a Blue Badge so that my brother could occasionally take me out.
Hi no-one,
I heard and there was leaked letters to prove it, that the dole people were giving easter eggs out to the staff members that got someone off of DLA, it didn't matter if they were ill or not. Soldiers with limbs blown off and trauma, they didnt care.
Saying that, you can go to a tribunal about ATOS, and try and get your claim sorted.
ATOS are not interested in peoples health or ill health, its a money thing.
God help them
B
xxx
Yes I read about the ATOS and Job Centres being given Easter Eggs as rewards for each person/applicant turned down etc...
Thankfully I never did attend ATOS and don't attend the Job Centre. So neither affected me. Just can't get the DLA so housebound with meals being delivered etc and the depression certainly doesn't help my situation.
As they say - a cutthroat society now.
Depression is a problem, my idea is let it come, be kind to it, carry on and ocassionally, it disperses.
but that I just cant be bothered, no energy, day can be a trial.
I'm out of the house now, and it is nice, just to feel the sun on my skin, or rain or wind.
Can you get a helper to take you out or are you agoraphobic?
Yes cutthroat society, everyone only caring about themselves, shame really, I was taught a society's strength is measured on its humanity.
Then they spend 10 million on Mrs Thatchpieces funeral, I'm all for a good send off but
looked good on the tele mind.
all the best
B
xxx
I am surprised you didn't qualify for DLA no-one. Its all changing to PIP now but under the old DLA you qualified for lower rate care if you were not able to go shopping and buy ingredients for a main meal then stand at the oven to cook it. Thats what I got mine on so I am surprised that you didn't. Maybe you will fare better under PIP? But will anyone - I don't know.
HI with all the medication I'm on and a psychiatrist nope I was told you do not qualify even with anxiety and depression. I use a Voluntary Emergency Service Transport (VEST) run by volunteers they take me out once a week for 3 hours. It's a small mini-bus that comes directly to my door and they help me into the bus and off the bus. It gives me a change of environment for 3 hours a week. They drop me off by a bench in town. They then collect me and return me home. I don't go out alone as I can't face it being bumped into etc. My terminally ill mother goes with me. What I'll do after she's gone into the hospice (already booked her hospice) I've no idea, become a hermit I suppose. Thank you though for your reply.
You must have answered yes to that question on the form instead of no. Answering no to that question was an automatic qualifier to lower rate dla for care.
No - the Advisor - went through it very thoroughly and I've a copy here, and it's perfectly clear that I do not go out alone, their comment was - it is your choice! They sent me the entire pack back so I can see every single answer that was given. All the correct boxes were ticked. Even the medical notes from the Psychiatrist, GP comments, Pain Clinic etc so was able to see what specialists actually wrote too. Can't fault them - they wrote the right things.
Hi I suffer with bad anxiety and depression the depression I've had for years but the anxiety only few months and it's getting worse to the point that I have started having panic attacks when traveling i keep hearing noises at night scared that someone gonna get in my house can't clean where I'm so depressed would I qualify
Bless you.
you can reply to this and you cannot dress your self of feed your self.. but reply ..ord
Hi Annie I get DLA - lower rate for care only for depression. Depression is covered under the DLA Act but anxiety by istelf isn't. But the system is now changing. DLA is being phased out and replaced by PIP. So you will have to claim that now. You can read about PIP on the govt. website - Direct.gov.uk. Basically instead of the illness itself being covered PIP is now about the effect the illness has on you.
Hope this clarifies things for you.
Hi Annie
I live in Belfast & was turned down too.
Good luck.
Jackie xx
More chance of flying to the moon. Seriously get some help. Stop asking get for handouts and pull yourself together. And yes I have had anxiety and depression and I self harm... grow a backbone! !!!!
Thanks for advice and your stories
I'm going to apply prob take a few months for reply but will let u no how I get on
Xx
yes I have, help with getting around and feelings of needing to be safe. I sleep walk while asleep, and feel safer if someone is with me, often staying indoors for weeks at a time.
the case of the woman with the mental age of three , was PROVEN to be fake! someone trying to help the disabled cause thought by using a picture found on the net and claiming to be the carer put it on the net ! it was made up! yes in some circumstances you can get DLA (PIP now) but be warned you have to jump through hoops to get it! if you are agrophobic! with no Physical ailments I cant see you getting mobility though! I am physically disabled and as good as housebound , I can go out but only in a car and then only with people I trust ! I can not go visiting folk even family(not that I Particulary want to) but to the Point yes its possible to get DLA for for severe anxiety and Chronic depression! if you have any difficulties look in the phone book or the net for "Welfare rights" or there is "Black Triangle" an organisation who are fighting for the Disabled to be treated fairly ! and they also give fair straight to the point advice!! hope that helps!!
Forgot to say apparently I have post traumatic stress disorder! whatever that is! I call it depression!
I get it at the high rate , and I am suffering depression , I think its all about how you word things on your form , If i can advise I will
Hope you sort it x
Could you advise me please
Hi
I have just been told, i have PTSD, i would love some advice.
Think you will find that anxiety is worse than depression.
Ii have suffered with Anxiety, Health Anxiety and depression for 10 years and never claimed anything other than being on income support, i have been on medication for nearly 3 years and i am currently in therapy, i have good days and bad days and sometimes i have really bad days where i can't get out of bed for days, have locked myself in the bathroom for days at a time, been taken by my wife to the hospital with suicidal feelings and had a crisis team out to calm me down, can't go out without my wife as i feel too nervous, i stupidly tried to walk the 4-5 miles to my therapy appointment a few weeks ago because our car was broken again, i got about a mile up the road and had to call my son to come and pick me up because i just felt dizzy and disorientated, since the council tax changes and benefit cap we are struggling and my wife and mother said it's about time i claimed something but i don't know if i should claim esa or pip or both, i don't have a clue, i sent off a claim form for esa a few weeks ago, my doctor didn't hesitate to give me a doctors note, i sent the form off and then i got a call from the dwp asking if i wanted to bother with the claim as it will involve assessments etc and would be the same amount as income support anyway, so i said ok then i wont bother.
Hi, I don't know if you could get a benefit checkup andrew71mids? You don't say if you have support worker or CPN but sometimes they may be able to help send you to the right place or they have people come and visit some of the day centres/ mental health units. As well you may be able to get advice from your local council/ neighbourhood office or CAB or look on the directgov website. DLA has been replaced by PIP called personal independence payment; it will depend how much support you need to do day to day things. If you are not sure where to go then I would try your local CAB. I hope this helps. Gemma
How do i get a claim for to fill in for dla for anxiety depression
Why don't you apply for a job and fight your problems? ?
Mikeluwe are e fighting our problems everyday with GADand depression,, applying and starting so many jobs onlyhaving to leave due to panic attacks, fear of failure, and all the other symptoms that come with it!
You think applying for a job gets rid of those illnesses? First of all these days one cannot just get a job, there has to be cv's and certificates,and many many hours writing, emailing, and ringing round. If you don't have depression before looking for a job you will when you start to.
Also how can you think getting a join will solve depression and anxiety, having these illnesses , means they're with you whatever you do in life. And can also cost you your job out you're not able to function fully(loss of concentration, obsessive intrusive thoughts, dizziness,foggy head, memory loss, sensory issues, forgetting things the list goes on).
Check out direct.gov benefits
I suffer from high blood pressure, dermatitis, depression, joint pain asmatha plus my liver function is high. Would like advice if i would be entitled to dla? I'm on esa for depression.
under the welfare reform its called pip now if you dont have mobility issue you will not qualify for pip but you may get care if you cant care for yourself
esa is a different what group are you in?
You claim to be the DWP person and yet you can barely string a coherent sentence together and your grammar is appalling. It makes me queasy to think someone like you actually has the power to decide whether someone is entitled to benefits. Your come across as borderline illiterate. How on earth did you get employment with the DWP? Did you bribe someone or is your dad in charge of the department? Just wondering!
Stop giving incorrect information.
Are you sure you work for DWP? If so, you need up to date training.
I will contact DWP on your behalf and ask that you receive this as you're not helping people with your incorrect advice.
If you wouldn't qualify for pip if having anxiety or depression, why does it ask about meeting strangers,managing to be in crowds,and feeling anxious in these situations? If a pounding tightening chest,sweating, feeling dizzy and nauseous ,clammy,eyes going black round edges aren't physical manifestations of a mental illness like depression and anxiety,what are they? Especially when people around can see something is definately wrong with the person. Sometimes trembling to shaking violently too, unable to physically put one step in front of another, are they not physical and related to our mental illnesses? I feel that unless you've walked in those shoes, you'll have completely no idea
Hi i suffer wiv anxiety an depression an has caused me to have devere panick attacks where i cant breathe properly an hav also had thoughts of suicidal thoughts due to loosin my dad an nan to cancer
The eligibility criteria for applying for DLA especially for adults are mentioned below:
-If you have difficulties while walking:
-Can only walk for a short distance.
-You become sick when you walk.
-If you require assistance to look after yourself:
-If you are unable to do daily work such as using toilets, dressing, eating etc.
-If you are unable to prepare food for yourself.
It clearly shows that anxiety and depression case are not eligible for DLA. If you are not satisfied with the reply you can call DLA Customer Service on the number mentioned here qwiknumbers.com/dla-contact...
When anxious one can become sick when walking. Dizzy.vomiting.staggering.trembling. falling over. Etc.
Also being depressed often stops people eating, cooking, washing and being motivated to do normal day to day things.
Also anxiety and depression can lead to being too fearful to go out oon ones own and needing someone to be with you.
It also says in the questions, if you need help but don't receive it, then you still qualify as needing it.
And if after doing something and it causes feelings of severe anxiety, exhaustion, or dizziness then that counts as not leading a normal life.where in those questions does it state if you suffer with these things you don't qualify for pip
People can get panic attacks whilst walking though, get agrophobia. I was on it for a few years as I couldn't function at all after a massive breakdown. Found out since that it was actually a physical hormone condition causing it. Anything that restricts you from doing daily things is a disability. My brother has schizophrenia and he is sectioned all the time. He can walk but can't concentrate because of voices. He avoids places. That's a serious mental illness which is a disability! I think they just hit people who are low because they are easy targets.
My partner has be told by his gp that he has manic depresion he was put on esa but went to the health check and got taken of.can he clam for dla also my daughter has a stay on hospital just to keep an eye on her 2 years ago so to has depression shes 17 cam o clamw for her as a parent please someone help me with the answers.
I suffer from panic disorder, depression and ptds. I have been recently told to apply PIP and ESA as I am getting deciplinery warnings due to sick leaves. My question is I always wanted to foster kids and I m not sure whether I would be accepted as a foster parent while claiming PIP, ESA?
Can anyone tell me how to make a claim for DLA and how long you have to have been suffering with exteme anxiety and depression disorder please before a claim can be made.
Check out direct.gov benefits
I have just been awarded standard rate for care pip . Even though i have several different reasons for having to claim it i attended a face to face assessment which was hell as i panic attacks ,especially in busy new places and severe depression and medications im having to take daily i recieved my letter today telling me the points i recieved and they haven't mentioned anything about none of the above so don't no if its because u cant get pip for they things or if the examiner has failed to include my panic atracks,medication and depression nor anything about my asthma ..even though im so grateful to get awarded £55.65 a week i feel cheated and annoyed as no i definately gave clear details at my medical and feel for other's worse of that have been less fortunate ,im scared to appeal incase i end up with nothing not sure what to do!
I would appeal. I've been told that they always try to give people as little as possible and hope they don't appeal, lots of people who appeal get more. There's nothing to lose. Just appeal
I have been havimg treatment for a long time after finding my mother unconcious early 1 morning. She had suffrred a burst ulcer & had been bleeding for some time i rung 999 & carried out mouth to mouth & chest presdinh which was instructed to me by the caller at the ambulance servicr.
My mother passed away a few hours later at the hospital & i cant remember much at all after being told she was gone. I was referred by my local gp to a mrntal health centre to be assessed & since then have been having treatment for PTSD.
I have tried many prescribed meds ranging from mirtazapine to sertraline but none have any sort of change to me.
I am cirrently recieving Eye movrment disensitivation retrain but nothing seems to help me stop having these tv sort of pictires that apoear at sny time & somrtimes just 1 or 2 or extreme ones wherr i relivr the whole thing over again.
it is a very frightening & stressing being stuck in a living nightmare & would not wish my worst my enemy to experience somr of my problems as they seem to get worse & more realistic at any given time. does anyone know what im going through cos i feel so alone with this problem please repky to me if you understand any of this PKEASE.
The person that answered that mental health is not a disability needs retraining. Of course it is but it's not physical but a disability that affects the mind. It can affect going out, sleeping, interaction with other people, making decisions, the list goes on. G work as a dwp worker with your tiny mind and maybe one day it will affect you, I do hope you aren't a decision maker , god help us all.
most people on here are on DLA for Depression. it all stops in 2018 those who been on DLA before 2013 will get it until 6 May 2018 then they will get a letter off the DWP tell them to make a new claim for PIP You cannot claim PIP for Depression 70% of people out their are on Depression and still going to work. so people who are claiming DLA for Depression make the most of it...you are all in for a BIG BIG shock on the 6 May 2018 . tho some of you will get ESA and that it . Still got to go too the Job Centre when ask to do so by the DWP or money will be stop. the DWP know who fake and those who are not.. the DWP are claiming down on all this PIP..DLA ..and ESA hope this as help people thank you
Sorry but you are making a complete fool of yourself .
If in fact you do work for DLA ,I feel this highly unlikely but lets humour you !
We now live in the magnificent world of technology which has now allowed many people access to the internet ,
Now let's start the lesson:
There is now a tool on computers ,laptops and smartphones that àllow you to dictate a emàil without having to use hands .It's a wonderful thing reàlly it is!
Now here's the best one its amazing that even a paraplegic person can use
It's all in the eye ,that's right all you need is a eye and it's just like a I pad and it identifies where the eye focuses on particular letter on keyboard and then offers a predictive text and if that identifies the required word then it is used allowing the user to respond to forums like this for example
If that all fails then a person who is unable to use hands and dress ,a carer or a friend etc could help with this task
We are now in the 21st century which now allows people with disabilities access to the community and equal rights .
Unfortunately the benefit system is antiquated and so is your attitude in actual fact you are actually displaying a act of discrimination to people with disabilities which is not acceptable.
I will say no more on this other then Karma has a terrible habit of biting one on its arse
Is this depression? ! I am scared....
Can't work due to my anxiety and depression.
Depression and Anxiety (Im new here)
