Meniscus damage in both knees…within 15-16 months …...anyone else?

[Wendy39]

Hello

I’ve posted about my left knee previously, as I ended up in A&E earlier this year. It was a form of bursitis I concluded at the time, most likely pes anserine and fluid had leaked, the inflammation could be seen, was extremely painful and hot to touch. None of the doctors I saw worked it out.

Anyway, I did get an MRI done eventually, privately. It showed deep tissue damage and inflammation of the pes anserine, fluid and also OA which I knew I had, a particularly bad varicose vein and also damage to my meniscus.

I considered the meniscus issue to be an incidental finding and told my insurance company that I had no locking, clicking or grinding…..the bursitis was definitely the problem at that time.

Well, Sod’s Law, weeks later, my knee is worse not better. The bursitis has mainly settled but I have an increasingly stiff knee which locks and is extremely stiff, I cannot kneel on it at all, it’s agony.

My right knee meniscus tore last year, walking in sensible trainers down a flat road. It was a complex, displaced bucket handle tear that needed key hole surgery.

Now my left one, the meniscus is described as “degenerative inferior surface tear of the posterior horn of the medial meniscus extending into the body. The torn inferior surface has displaced to the edge of the medial tibial condyle and deep to the remnant of the body of the meniscus which is partly extruded from the joint. The meniscal root attachment of the posterior horn is intact. “

Due to worsening symptoms, pain and difficulty getting comfortable to sleep, I think I now need to see the orthopaedic surgeon who I saw last year. See what he recommends. I made a good and speedy recovery last year, just wish I wasn’t possibly facing this again.

Meniscus are connective tissue and he did explain last year my meniscus would be over stretched when I walk due to hypermobility in my legs…..so I guess it was inevitable that this one tore with literally wear and tear, aged 48.

But interested to know if anyone else out there has this meniscus issue?

Thank you!

Wendy

PS first cardiology appointment was postponed and now seeing him next Tuesday. Will be glad to see him and know what’s happening there too.

[Wendy39]

Helpful diagram

Anatomy of the knee

[4373 in reply to Wendy39]

Both of my knees (meniscus) were severely torn while skiing at age 15. Fortunately I didn't have surgery. I am now 80, going to a PT to strengthen the muscle around the knee. I had a MRI within the last twelve months proving the extreme tears. Long Covid seems to have aggravated the situation?

[Wendy39 in reply to 4373]

Thanks for your response.

My children have 2 friends who’ve meniscus injuries at 17-18 years old but from sporting accidents. That’s common. Football, rugby and twisting the knee etc.

But there is no injury involved in either of mine. It’s directly linked to connective tissue disease and hypermobile legs, that over straighten, so wear and tear on knee is much more than it should be for my age.

It’s good to know that you’ve coped.

Have you never experienced stiffness or an inability to kneel on both knees?

Best wishes

Wendy

[Dottie11 in reply to Wendy39]

i still wear knee support from time to time re joint and walking longer periods. But not often. But I am past sixty now.

[Cwmtaf in reply to Wendy39]

Wendy - this diagram is brilliant. My knees have been dodgy and unpredi table for years. I am building up quite a selection of knee braces. Very helpful to read your posts. So sorry you are going through this though.Best wishes

[Wendy39 in reply to Cwmtaf]

Glad it helped. It's so frustrating. There's been a couple of jobs I've tried to do this week and realised I can't because I can't bend down or kneel on that knee! I am stubborn and independant, so very annoyed having to ask other people to help or do it for me! I'm guessing by your name, you are also in Wales.

[Cwmtaf in reply to Wendy39]

You are correct I am in sunny Wales ☺️ I love to see the sun but as we all do need to avoid it 😞 I do hope you are having a better day today.

[Wendy39 in reply to Cwmtaf]

It has been very sunny few days, well into weeks now. I used to love summer and I still prefer it to our long, wet winters, but the heat takes it’s toll and I am photosensitive. I’d be happy if it was 18/19 max and dry. Still having issues with my knee, but accepting it and trying to stay active. Hope you’re doing OK too.

[MEGS53]

hi Wendy

I have EDS, not lupus, and I’m hypermobile.

My medial meniscus in the left knee had almost completely disintegrated and I needed a partial knee replacement about 2y ago to correct it. The op wasn’t totally successful and I still need to use a walking stick. My right knee is now starting to join the fun and I might need an op on this knee in the not to distant future 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

My surgeon is reluctant to intervene because I react badly to GA and being ‘poked and prodded’ in general 😬😬😬

Hope this is helpful

[Wendy39 in reply to MEGS53]

Hello MEGS53

I typed a lovely long reponse to you yesterday and it disappeared!!!

Thank you for your response, it's really helpful.

I had a hip operation in 2013 and have had investigations on both hips since. I have been told that I'll need both replaced in due course, as wear and tear is so bad for my age. I have had bursitis in the left side and had 2 steroid jabs in that.

So now having issues with bith knees is more than a little daunting. Thinking I hope I don't need 2 new hips and 2 new knees! I'm 48 at the moment. So scary thought.

I have read that there is evidence now that Osteoarthritis also has an element of inflammation. So having lupus and OA, it definitely is a double whammy for the joints.

Luckily I have recovered OK from GA on these 2 ops so far, left hip and right knee. The last anaesthetist agreed to give me a "light GA" and I came around quickly with no sickness etc. I also had a jab of antibiotic and steroid in the knee, to pre-empt infection etc. Worked well.

However, with the benefit of hindsight, both operations kicked off flares for me, so having an op, whether it's the anaesthetic or just the shock to the body, I have reacted and the flares have been months. I had my knee surgery in March last year and by our holiday in July, I felt like my legs were on fire - my hips, knees, plantar fasciitis for the first time - walking was extremely painful and made it hard for me to keep up with my family.

But, whichever way I think about it, I think I need a doctor's opinion on what happening in the left one now.

These connective tissue diseases and hypermobility bring everyone such a mixed bag and we've all got a different combination of symptoms, but it is helpful to know that others here have similar problems.

Best wishes

Wendy

[MEGS53 in reply to Wendy39]

I defo agree that CTDs , whatever’ the origin, cause domino effect health issues. Our poor joints, muscles, tendons etc etc really do suffer 😬 I also have OA and planar fasciitis.

No wonder the Drs have difficulty diagnosing us when we’re such a mixed bag. A bit like liquorice allsorts 🤣🤣🤣

Take care 🤗🤗🤗

[Mctd]

Oh, this is so interesting!!! I had a meniscus tear 7 years ago, but wasn't diagnosed with UCTD until last year, after at least 8 years of issues. It never occurred to me that this could all be related, I now have started having trouble with my left knee and neck. I know this us of no help to you, but thanks for tge information, I will discuss this with my consultant next time I see him.

[Wendy39 in reply to Mctd]

Hello Mctd

I'm glad my post has helped.

I found the diagrams by Googling, as I wanted to visualise what was happening to my knees.

When I Googled it also said mensicus are connective tissue, so must be part and parcel of our diagnosis.

Don't forget this stuff is so specialised, we often know more than the doctors and we understand our own bodies.

Best wishes

Wendy

[Dottie11]

Thank you for the update , interesting. The struggle with having Lupus etc is everything is put down to that by doctors when in fact needs further investigation. Maybe the Bursistis was masking the poor function of joint, or protect it ? One for the Consultant. As you know I had three ops by thirties and much liagament repair. Hope they can get this fixed and all will settle. Good luck.

[Wendy39 in reply to Dottie11]

Thank you Dottie11. I just get frustrated by inability to get things done! We have a small attic space, in the eaves of our dormer bungalow and I crawl in, to put things away and get things out. Christmas decs and suitcases etc. But I cannot do this now. My knee wont bend enough and I cannot kneel! So I need someone else to put stuff away now. I know the kids will do it for me, but I wish I could do it myself!!!! x

[misty14]

I am so sorry wendy your facing an op for meniscus tear on your other knee. These illnesses have a wierd way of affecting both sides with the same problem, almost like evening both sides out!!. Your hypermobility will have played a BIG part in causing this!. Its the last thing you wanted to face so i hope you don't wait too longfor it!!. Glad the first one was such a success as it must be very painful.

I'm waiting for another op on my foot but its the same foot unlike yours. A nerve complication after first op. I do have a propensity to nerve problems in different places so maybe thats what has happened to you in a way!?. Hope i'm making sense!.

I'm also sorry your cardio appt was postponed and is next week now. Appt's are being delayed sadly all the time. Its specially hard when we've been waiting so long!. Ive just had my gastric surgeon's appt delayed by 9 days which isn't much but is a long time as i'm still in agony with biliary pain!!. Ive been counting the days and now it seems so far ahead again!!. Its all very stressful for us isnt it?.

Good luck for your cardio appt , keep us posted how you get on and take care with your knee. Hope all your family are doing well. Xx💕🤞💕

[Wendy39 in reply to misty14]

Thank you so much Misty! Always lovely to hear from you.

I am sorry that your issues are ongoing too. I was saying to someone the other day, lupus isn't officially a progressive illness, however as it's chronic and nothing ever gets better, the number of issues just grows, it should be called a progressive illness.

I really hope that the second op can help with the nerve issues and that the gastro appt helps too. All we want is answers and some options.

I'll defintely let you know how the cardio goes. I had an ECG at the GPs and the nurse had to get a GP to sign me off as safe to leave.......she told me it's normal procedure, but it's not - she folded the paper very quickly so I couldn't see. I have got a copy of it now, to take with me to cardio appt, I have an abnormal ECG and an issue with my T wave - apparently cuased by bundle branch block, so I defiitely need advice and I am definitely not symptom free as the NHS cardiologist presummed without ever seeing me.

I really miss keeping up with everyone here, but so busy. Children are good - middle one was 18 on Wednesday and is in the middle of his A levels and eldest is home from his first year in uni, so all 5 of us back together and I'm loving that.

Take care of yourself.

Wendy xx

[misty14 in reply to Wendy39]

Thank you wendy for your lovely message. I do agree with you about lupus being progressive as an illness and yes it should be categorised as such. I guess its progress now that its regarded as rare and difficult to treat. Its only progressive for some, in others it can be a mild illness. Its wierd how it can vary so much so its hard to pigeonhole.

Ive just been listening to your specialist Dr K talking at the Cardiff Info Day. He would be wonderful to consult as i just loved how he talked about lupus and all its difficulties!. Its awful you have to see him privately. Did you manage to go to the Info Day?.

So sorry at your abnormal ECG, what a worry knowing something's wrong and you can't get to see the Cardio quickly!!. I hope he puts your mind to rest and it isnt too serious. 🤞

Good luck with A levels and Uni exams and glad everyone will be home on hols soon. Look forward to your update. Xx💕🤞💕🤞💕🤞💕

[MrsMarigold]

Wendy I relate to your post but it’s my ankles. In 2016 I tore tendon and was in a boot for months and Pt. It will never be the same as everyone knows with an ankle injury. Still have to ice and wear compression sleeves. A month ago I simply got up from sitting in my chair and the other ankle went snap! On the bottom of my foot.

I’ve seen the orthopedic Dr. And had X-rays. I am in PT. It is incredibly painful. I have to go through PT before insurance will pay for MRI. I’m using a cane. The Achilles tendon is likely partially or totally torn. So putting me through PT is agonizing. And I think not good medicine. I’m going to call to see if I can get my MRI moved up. Here’s the take away for me. Orthopedic doctor said I have virtually no fat, no cushion on the bottom of my feet. This is happening in my hands as well. Lupus is eating my connective tissues. If it’s not snacking on them it’s crystallizing the joints enough to where they don’t extend properly. I’m sorry this is happening to your knees. My feet and ankles relate!!!I hope today is a better day for you. MrsMarigold

[Wendy39 in reply to MrsMarigold]

Hello MrsMarigold

I am so sorry to hear about your ongoing ankle injuries. Achilles are terrible! My stepfather completely tore his years ago, his welly got stuck in mud and as he tried to pull it out, it went and he heard it and felt it. He was told they don't fix themselves with complete tear, so he needed an op, they overlap the ends and stitch them together basically, I think. He was out of action for a while.

I have never heard the explanation of lupus eating the connective tissue but it makes sense to me, it is a connective tissue disease....

So thank you for taking the time to respond, very interesting.

Best wishes

Wendy