ANA Curiousity question?

Hi! Friends,

You know how they say there is a small percent of the population that are healthy but have positive ANA tests, or there ANA is always that way, or whatever it is they say about that...

MY question is...those healthy individuals that are positive, what does their test look like? Does it have a pattern? Does it have a reading 1:80 or something? Im curious...

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  • This may help a bit: ......... An ANA test is considered positive if fluorescence is seen at a titre of 1:40/1:80. Higher titres are more clinically significant as low positives (≤1:160) are found in up to 20% of healthy individuals, especially the elderly. Only around 5% of the healthy population have ANA titres of 1:160 or higher.[7][49]

  • So....it gives off a glow at a certain dilution, and those 1:40 and 1:80 are low readings...> going up to 1:160, could be found in 20% of population low positive/still healthy person.....

    Past that 1:160> and up, is only found in 5 % of healthy people ...

    I bet if it has a "pattern" etc, then its more likely to be something too, and not the 5 % healthy population....

    Maybe the 20 percent and 5% have a fluorescent to their test, but no pattern like mixed pattern, speckle..i forget the others that mean something....

    Sorry, my pea brain has to break things down....mstr, that was a good piece of info..thank you.

  • The fluorescence arranges itself in a pattern, be that homogenous (I.e. No particular pattern), speckled, etc. There is always a pattern, even if that is "homogenous" and regardless of whether SLE is present or the person is healthy.

    My question has always been - how do they know that those people are healthy. Unless they've monitored the same people for many years, how do they know that the positive ANA they found isn't a very early sign of autoimmunity. But I'm conscious that nowadays there is a huge database of raw data worldwide, who knows, the "healthy" assessment may have been based on data spanning across many decades.

  • Egadddssss...

    Maybe their pattern is just homogenous and fluorescent...and 1:40 up to1:160...with no symptoms. But why would they be visiting the gp then, they have no symptoms to be worrying about...

    Mine was 1:320 ,homogenous, but finely speckled...I didnt have lots of joint pain, but some lite stuff, and odd other things happening.,.plus my thyroid was acting up more than usual. (Rhumey says, that's not the lupus ,the thyroid stuff), and also menopause at the time...so much things can be cross over stuff...

    But my reading way up there, I gotta have something I guess...

    I too wonder about that Purpletop,...and its also interesting.

  • Good way of thinking purpletop x

  • Thankyou I try lol. I saw an even better example before where it broke it down even more. At 1/320 and 1/640 like mine has been it boils down to about 1percent of a healthy population.....which reduces it down even more!

  • Well ...#1 that helps me accept it more too, mine is 1/320..

    But like purple top was saying...My question has always been - how do they know that those people are healthy(with the +ANA and up to 1/160 readings)the 20% and 5% of the population people. Unless they've monitored the same people for many years, how do they know that the positive ANA they found isn't a very early sign of autoimmunity. But I'm conscious that nowadays there is a huge database of raw data worldwide, who knows, the "healthy" assessment may have been based on data spanning across many decades...I added some in her quote too.. I wish there was more on all that, its interesting...My brain always has to know, and pick it apart....good for the fog too!!! :)

  • Me too. The only thing I find is then I find relevant questions to ask...which really the rheumatologists will not have the time to answer in our pretty tight timescales that we see them for. Also, I think it very much puts us as being a 'patient' and we can so easily lose our questionable spirit and our own identity if we question at all...I wonder if professionals are 'threatened' by an enquiring mind? It's frustrating as many of us will naturally want to enquire. I think time is the factor here.

  • I know the Rhumey has an ego...He has been pretty nice to me, which is a surprise....I snuck a few questions in there, and as long as they seemed intelligent questions he did answer them. I find that happens if I can get there to an uber early appointment....That doesn't happen often, cause I live far and have to take ferries etc..This one time though I was offered a ride, and got there early...I saw a difference in the rhumey....Im gonna try and find books on the subject...medical research type...

  • Great, love to hear how you get on.

  • ok...it might take me a while, but see what I can come up with...

  • I have written to professionals etc., and no one answers on that subject...Im going to keep digging, but I found this today in my research, but I think it sounds not right...My reading was finely speckled and homogenous, and he said ,yup Lupus, the Doc.....anywho here it is an exerpt:Patterns also give doctors a clue as to the type of illness to look for while evaluating a patient. For instance, the disease Scleroderma shows in nucleolar pattern. "If a person does not have any autoimmune disease, it is defined in speckled pattern." An ANA blood test is used in patients who might be suffering from Sjogren's and etc...(speckled pattern if positive and one of the healthy 5 percent)??? hmmm

    here is the page link:http://athena.targetwoman.com/thyroiditis

  • some how I gave that 3 recommends, but its good info...

  • So, I have 1:80, I am considered healthy? That's what the rheumy told me...If I can exercise daily, I am not sick. Interesting. Because it still doesn't explain the headaches and extreme dizziness I have had the past three days. Or the memory problems... I would love to be healthy. I guess I am just getting old. That's what my sister keeps telling me. It's age related, she says to me. I have two scarred kidneys too. Constant sore throats...slightly hypothyroid...ok! Awesome! Still curious what my bloodwork is going to say. Seeing rheumy in a couple of weeks. Oh, I also have hip pain and knots on my forefingers. I guess all age related. Just chalk it up to getting old. I am 51. I never thought I would feel this way at this age. I thought I would start to feel some problems in my 70s. Not now.

  • Natura...I work out, but I think the plaquinil mighta helped me get energy back, or it just came back...I'll never know, cause he slapped me on plaquinil so fast....I have real bad concentrating problems..is it the lupus, menopause, or my thyroid doing that....I'll never know ;(

    But as my Mom would say, "Keep moving"...and that's what Im doing...and have fun too!

  • Dgleds...your mom is right...keep moving....I am in menopause, and I was so dizzy the past couple of days....so difficult...and I am trying to get a job to help with finances . I don't know how I will work. Some days I am fine. Some days I am not. If I put that in an application, will I not get a interview? I know it's illegal, but easily explained with a lie if not given a chance. Trying to figure out how I can have my own business. Glad you are able to keep moving!

  • Is your thyroid hypo slow? If its fast the hyper way, you might get dizzy from that...But I bet your stressing out, and I think can get dizzy from that too...Yes I need some work too....I thought about going to the job center and just explaining my situation, see what they suggest. This one lady told me she found a place that are so good to her, they totally understand her health problems...If you want to start a business, and you can do crafts, or sell vintage clothing and items, or supplies etc..>

    You can open a shop on Etsy for free, but you have to have a visa debit card (not a visa bank card)....and when you list a thing its 20 cents, and have paypal for if you sell, to collect your money....Its pretty cool...www.etsy.com You get your own shop on there.

  • I am considered slightly hypo, slow. I am researching iron now. Hashimotos, which is what my sister has and I am being tested for, can possibly cause high iron, which causes mood swings, depression, osteo, joint pain. I wonder if that is what is causing my headaches and dizziness. Calling doc today.

    .....interesting about etsy. I was also thinking of going to employment center to tell them my situation and see if they can find a very low stress job for me. My girls need a ride home from school everyday (no bus) which is part of my stress. I am not sure I can work full time and take care of the home, cook and clean. Some days I just want to cry.

  • Yes I always made sure I picked my daughter up too from school...I was cleaning homes back then, and keeping an eye on my older Mom...it was like a mad house!!! rush everywhere!!! It got a bit worse later on as my Mom became ill....Its too much..I had no partner either...I know there are others probably doing even more...Stress is so bad...Take care Natura....

  • Likewise Natura....the unhealthy bit happened so quickly. I thought I would be as healthy as my mum is at 71!

  • different kind of stresses around now a days....Although in ma and pas time there was WW2 in UK...she was a radar operator, and he was in India as a front gunner on a Liberator...

  • Wow Dgleds...I am always amazed at how strong men and women were in WW II...especially in the UK where your country got a beating....you were on the home front...in America we were participating and helping, but not actually getting attacked. My father was in WW II stationed in Italy fixing plane radios. He did not see action thank good ness, he had a bad ankle..........I think food was better then though. We have moved away from whole foods...I also grew up pretty poor and was eating no frills food. Cheese tasted like plastic...heard they put saw dust in bread for fiber...wonder how healthy that is....plastic by products in our milk shakes i hear in mcdonalds. Not sure if that one is true....keep going is all we can do...I hope you have a good day!

  • TRue crappy food

  • For a bit I started to lose range of motion in my hips..i thought I been sittin too much....but it seemed different. I got down on the floor, and bit by bit my leg sissors (sp) exercise, got bigger and better as the weeks went on.. At one point I couldn't get down into the bath tub, it was like a strange stiffness....weird for me, because I like to move it! Around that time I wasn't going out so much, and I felt bummed out from things that happened (life stuff),...and the old menopause not far...I certainly have the recepie for lupus. Its hard to know...so many things cross over. But lupus suppose to happen around hormone times, stress, and 5% hereditary....(Ha ha but not menopause they say)...Menopause is hormones going up and down...not just dying off....I got lupus right smack at menopause time!

  • Dgleds...menopause seemed to be when I got my symptoms too. I am still trying to find myself, the new me....because I still like adventure and having fun...not willing to give it all up. Had to stop yoga because of head stuff. Thought pressure on my head wasn't a good idea. Plus my hips got bad and I wasn't getting stronger or better doing it every day. It just wore me out.

  • If you do have lupus...the plaquinil will help....ive talked rhumetologist down to very low dose...no steroids...It takes plaquinil a while to work, especially at low dose...I started out high, then tapered...

  • I am seeing rheumy at end of next week. Not sure....he doesn't think I have it even though I have a lot of symptoms. But very low ANA. Will see...you feel better too!

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