I’m not sure this is even the right place to post but you ladies have been a source of comfort before
many may remember my posts and advice I’ve given over the years
Where to start….well after welcoming beautiful IVF twins last year after many miscarriages, losing both tubes to ectopics and then 5 rounds of IVF my marriage has imploded as my (soon to be ex) husband has walked out saying that he doesn’t love our (my!) twins the way he loves our eldest because they were conceived via IVF (they are his by the way we did NOT use a donor)
I’m lost to be honest. I know so many couple who had children via IVF and never heard of this before?
I’ve suggested this could be a form for post natal depression but he is adamant it isn’t?
Either way our marriage of 10 hears (together nearly 20 is over)
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Ivfgotadream
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Hi Ivfgotadream I'm so sorry you're dealing with this situation. I really feel for you!
I don't have experience of your specific situation, but my husband and I have certainly had some pretty severe ups and downs in the past, and I'd say ive dealt with a couple of break downs on my husband's part too.
It sounds like this is all very sudden and out of the blue. For your husband to suddenly come out with this makes me think something else is going on, like you say maybe depression or maybe he's felt under pressure or anxious and it's suddenly all come to the surface (I've had this with my husband before but with a different scenario).
thanks for your reply, I keep thinking if he was a woman who said he felt no bond towards her children and didn’t feel like they were theirs then everyone would say it sounds like PND? But he refuses to consider this is the issue.
He isn’t prepared to explore therapy or help in any way.
I’ve suspected for a while that he felt differently towards the twins and it’s heartbreaking
I just thought after everything we’ve gone through this would now be our time to finally be happy and it’s fallen apart x
Yes, it does sound very like PND. That's so frustrating that he refuses to consider this as a possibility and won't explore therapy. Has he even properly spoken to you about it? Is this out of character for him? I only ask because out of character behaviour could signal an issue like depression etc.
It must be a heartbreaking situation for you and utterly unfair given everything you've been through. X
He had depression before years ago and I do think this is all part of wider mental health issues. But he’s refusing to speak to a doctor.
He’s basically said he doesn’t love them the same way as our eldest and can’t get past that they were IVF conceived - bit bloody late after the fact.
It’s not like we had one round of IVF and it worked first time - we did 5 egg collections and 4 transfers before the twins stuck and he never once said he wasn’t fully on Board with each round?
It's so difficult that he refuses to see anyone about it. I wonder if he has any close relatives or friends that may be able to try and subtely broach the subject with him once things have settled down a bit?
It is very late after the fact to come to this conclusion! X
Oh my goodness honey, im so sorry! Ive never heard of this due to IVF either. I must say as a twin Mum that having two vs one is bloody hard work.....as Im sure you know ten times over not to mention the financial impact. Do you think he is maybe just struggling and finding it difficult to appreciate the twins whereas he had time to bond and apprecite having just the one baby? Maybe space will give him clarity but that doesnt help you. My heart goes out to you.xxx
I think the twins have perhaps knocked his confidence a bit as a parent definitely - but I don’t even know if he’s really tried as it’s clear looking back now he detached himself from us even during pregnancy and he admits as much. That he felt like I’d got what i always wanted and he was no longer needed in a way? I’ve found having twins quite easy or maybe I’ve just naturally taken to it and he has struggled which if he has feelings of resentment and lack of connnection to them it’s going to make him struggle with them even more?
Financially wise I’m the main earner by a long way so they haven’t had a financial impact on him at all
Oh sweets, I’m so so sorry. This must be awful to be going through.
I agree that this sounds like an issue like depression or resentment or just feeling left out, rather than him not actually loving the twins. Unfortunately, it sounds like he’s made up his mind for now and needs some space. As a roundabout way of getting him some help, could you suggest that even if he’s going to leave, you two will need to co-parent your eldest and you’d like to go to couples’ therapy to make sure you’re setting yourselves up to do that effectively? Going to couples’ therapy to sort out the dynamics of co-parenting might make him feel less on the defensive (as opposed to him having to go to a therapist because he’s “broken”). The reason for his leaving will, inevitably, come up at some point and maybe something might click for him once he’s talking to a therapist.
What a shitty situation for you. 💔 I’m sending you a huge huge hug xx
Thankyou! I suggested couples counselling etc but he has refused. He left one day out of the blue about 6 weeks ago and moved out fully 2 weeks later. He is adamant that he won’t come back.
He said he loves them but not the same as our eldest and looking back now there were all sorts of red flags that he was treating them differently - which has continued since he has been gone. Like buying our eldest things but not the twins.
I’m not sure I could even have him back now since he has made his feelings towards them very clear but yet won’t get help for it
Oh gosh I’m so sorry you must be so stressed and lost! I agree with others that it sounds like PND. I spoke to a midwife not long ago as I’m scared I’ll get PND as I already suffer with depression and she went into more detail about what it is and what to look out for and she did say it can affect fathers too so to look out for the signs in partners too. Perhaps your partner is reluctant to try therapy as he thinks PND only affects mums? I hope you can work it out 💕
I am so sorry you are in this position.
This sounds like post natal depression to me too. I don’t think it’s unusual with IVF babies after all the fight to get them? But obviously we associate it more with Mums.
I don’t know your husband but sounds to me classic man logic of just shutting everyone off and walking away from the situation because it’s easier than talking about feelings and facing mental health issues.
Without going behind his back is there anyone you can ask to try and talk to him on your behalf? Or worst case a letter? Almost reassuring him that this is normal and fixable and doesn’t need to be forever? Seems like a rather dramatic reaction to a solvable solution? Unless you feel there are deeper rooted problems and he’s just using this as an excuse?
(Caveat obviously I don’t know him or you so apologies if not appropriate)
In the space of 2 weeks he walked out then moved out fully. He said there is no going back. He loves them just not the same. He feels like their sperm donor not their father and just doesn’t feel the same bond.
To be honest I should have seen the warning signs a long time ago - he does treat them differently - he’s never bought them anything and yet will take all 3 to the toy shop and only for our eldest
He won’t speak to anyone. In fact he said it’s to stay a secret between only him and i but I have confided in close family because I’m so upset and heartbroken for the twins. I’d rather he had had an affair and didn’t love me then not love our children
This is a really awful situation just as all your dreams came true, I feel so sorry for you. You've been through so much, sounds like you lost your husband along the way though, which is heartbreaking.
It does sound like he feels lost and that it happened during the ivf process. Men are hard to reach when in a state. My husband suffers depression, being honest it can be very frustrating to live with, when im tired and overwhelmed myself- but I just accepted I needed to be the one to dig him and our marriage out of the holes he fell and dragged our marriage into.
There is 2 versions of him, the "unwell him" and the "my husband" him. When he's the unwell him I drop expectations and go to compassion - I try think of it as if be had a broken leg I wouldn't expect him to run.
Anyway, I think to save your marriage and family unit I think it would work to think of him as you are he has PND. But like a lot of women he cant see it, doesn't want or not ready to face it. So he needs huge amount of compassion and understanding to help him.
I wonder has he felt he is no longer a husband to you? He was barely required, like all men, in the ivf process- it is all about us and our bodies, we need huge emotional support through it. And then the pregnancy and birth, all about us. And the newborn stage, the babys really just need us. You say you took to twins without much fuss, but he is overwhelmed. You earn way more money than him, so you don't need him that way. You don't mention sex, but I wonder if that's not happening he probably struggles with that too on all kind levels, feeling unneeded and unwanted.
I think some men do feel left out and not needed during the whole baby stages. So if he is like that, and you seem an exceptionally strong capable woman, he could be feeling completely alienated from you, that he is letting you down, he has nothing to offer as he just cant measure up and is spiralling down all kind of negative thinking about himself.
I know my husband's depression wreaks havoc in his brain by convincing him he's useless everyday, so it takes little then to tip him over to believing that when he is unwell. I have learned to understand this over 20years, hes not giving me a hard time, hes having a hard time. And Im the one needs help him,while taking on full responsibility of everything else.
Its so tough going at times. I feel lonely sometimes when hes his unwell self.
Its tempting at times to tell him to rest and that I'll get on with it all, I also am main earner, but I have learned what is better is to let him know how I rely on him, how valuable he is and how needed he is. He has learned to tell himself these things when his depression is trying to drag him down.
Maybe some of my stuff is relatable for you. I have found talking to other wives whose husband are depressed has helped me gain a better understanding of him, myself and what I can do to help us both and our little family. Mens psychology is so different to ours, especially around parenthood and their perceived roles.
Mental health is so hard to live with, it can screw everything up. I over the years I have learned to get on top of it, my mental health is robust thank god so I have learned I can get him and our family through it. He has had to find a way to accept that he cant always be the man he wants to be and feels I deserve. I can manage on a lot less from him than he originally thought though, so he now knows hes not letting me down when hes sick. The dynamic in our relationship has had to shift a bit so he can let himself rely on me a bit more than he'd probably like.
Its so hard. I feel for you. Depression wreaks everything and when its not your own depression its hard to wait for them to be ready to figure it out.
My mantra now is when he is pushing me away to actually lean in to him more, let him know I see he is not himself but that I know he'll come back to me, in meantime I'll steer the ship, I gently let him know I miss him and its a bit tricky to manage without him. I worry if he thinks I can take it all in my stride that hes not needed. I used to make it seem I could cope to reduce his worry, but actually it does him better to realise how needed he is.
Huge post, sorry, hopefully hasn't bored you. I couldn't scroll by as I could so relate to you, and its a tough lonely spot.
Could you sit with him, take everything off table tell him you miss who he was and just ask him to explain to you where his head is at, and try figure it from there together?
Hi Honeynut. Not my post but I just wanted to say that a lot of what you said has really resonated with me, so thank you for giving @ivfgotadream such a thoughtful and considered reply. My husband will never admit to being depressed and finds it almost impossible to talk about his feelings, but has been able to write them down for me recently and when he did, I was so shocked to see how he feels he lets us down and isn’t good enough. He’s an amazing husband and dad most of the time, but i hadn’t realised the impact I was having in trying to be so independent and show I was coping with things when actually I wasn’t - but I did it to try and shield him from worry and stress. I’m going to take your lead and remind him more often how needed he is. Thank you x
Aww thank you for saying that, it really is awful how many live this way, and don't know what to do.
I finally learned that the antedote to shame, which it sounds like your husband is drowning in, is compassion.
I dont always feel it tbh, I want to shake him and scream at how unfair it is. But I can act with compassion even if I don't feel it. Fake it til you make it ☺️
Thankyou for such a lovely reply and yes I agree with a lot of what you say - although you have much more compassion when it comes to depression in your husband than I do with mine! My mental health has always been very robust - I’m a put my big girl pants on sort of woman and carry on. (Although I’ve needed to because of his “struggles”)
I think I did lose him during the IVF process. Although I did 5 rounds in 18 months so it wasn’t overly drawn out. He said he wanted to do it every time - to give me the family I always wanted (and thought he wanted too!) but that deep down he never expected (hoped it wouldn’t) it to work especially with twins which was very hard to hear. He was totally disengaged during pregnancy but he wasn’t overly attached with our eldest so I didn’t see much difference at the time.
I do absolutely think that once the twins arrived he has felt surplus to requirements - you are right I don’t need him physically emotionally or financially - I only ever really needed him to have babies and now I also have that. And yes sex just hasn’t happened - both working full time plus 3 kids who don’t sleep through the night or are in our bed. And actually in the 6 weeks he has been gone I think I need him even less if that was possible? Ive has to step up overnight to be a single parent to 3 young children - Im not sure I can forgive him? Or want to?
He won’t talk to me as In his mind the decision is made. He said he was feeling resentful of the twins as it was like looking after other peoples children when he had annual leave to be with them? (We have term time only childcare) and I’m not sure how I / we come back from that?
The worst part is my boy twin is much happier with him gone - much less anxious and I think subconsciously he was becoming aware of his differently he was treated so now I feel like I also need to protect them from him and his very clear favouritism?
Do I miss him? I miss who he was? He feels like a stranger now? And I’m so angry - angry that he’s taken away the happiness I finally thought we had after so much loss, angry at his selfishness for not even wanting to try and angry that our future is forever changed
aww lovely I’m so sorry that you are in this situation, you deserve a break and lots of happiness, and I’m sorry that your husband is missing out on those parenthood feelings and experiences too!
It defo sounds like something he has to work through but I guess he’s going to need to accept that it’s not a rational way he is thinking and that he needs support to reframe his thoughts (for whatever reason, depression PND etc) and you sound so lovely to be trying to help him when you she so much on your plate already and he’s trying to walk out on you! I honestly have nothing but admiration for you. I would say though to remember about yourself and your own mental health and enjoyment of these beautiful babies you worked so hard to create 🤗 IVF can defo take its toll on people and relationships in many different ways and I really hope he will speak with somebody very soon. Sending you all love 💕
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