Needing hope!

[MorvN]

Hi everyone.This is my first post.I stumbled across this app trying to gain a better understanding of why my 4.5yr old daughter still soils and wets herself.She has the odd day where she can be continent but today I’m at my wits’ end.She will typically pee or soil herself in the same room as me, instead of going to the toilet.I then ask her if she has had an accident and she lies (knowing I’m then going to check her pants!).I struggle with chronic depression and this problem is breaking me.We have tried everything: Laxido sachets (which she only sips -never drinks a full cup), reward charts, stickers, toys, praise, losing patience, talking to her; nothing seems to work.I feel like such a failure because my daughter will be starting school in a couple of months, and I don’t want her to soil herself at school. About six or so months ago, I suggested Encopresis to the GP and she was put on Laxido.I just found them so disinterested and unhelpful.Next stage might be a child psychologist? I just don’t know how much of this problem is down to a medical issue and how much is possible attention-seeking/baby behaviour.She says she can feel when she is going in her pants but doesn’t know why she does it! Anyone else tearing their hair out over a similar problem? Her potential manipulation with this has had a negative impact on our mother-daughter relationship.It’s so upsetting.😩

[Chocolate-chicken]

I am tearing my hair out with an identical issue... But my daughter is now 5 1/2 and about to finish in reception. School have been utterly amazing but there has been absolutely no improvement over the last year. I found that despite asking various professionals for help since she was 3, no drs took me seriously until just before my daughter started school. We have seen the school nurse, and a continence nurse, she has had scans and blood tests, and we are now waiting to see a pediatrician. The senco at school has been incredible and got hold of the NICE guidelines for child continence issues and it does seem that drs need to follow certain steps before eventually referring anyone... So my suggestion is to go back to the drs, list everything you have tried, and demand to be referred for further help.

Every day is incredibly draining and every few seconds I find myself alternating from sympathetic and patient to broken and furious, so i completely empathise. I find reading this forum really helps on particularly hard days, if for nothing else, just to know I'm not alone in this!!

Sending hugs.... We all understand xxx

[MorvN in reply to Chocolate-chicken]

Thank you so much for your kind reply.I can’t tell you how much it means to know it’s not just us! I’m so sorry your daughter has this problem too and that you are struggling.I will get her back to the GP and see what else they can suggest.Also, I’ll inform her teacher of her problem so she can help my girl when she has accidents and keep things as private as possible.

After crying buckets and thinking I’m the worst mum in the world, I just have to do better tomorrow and work on my patience.

Thanks again, Chocolate-Chicken.Hang in there.xxx

[jane-anna]

It sounds like your daughter needs a disimpaction to clear out then try and get the feeling back. Then you have to get the maintenance dose right afterwards. We see a consultant who advised this and although not there yet I feel a lot more in control and things have improved. Although she says she can feel it she probably can’t and although it’s really hard you have to try not to be angry and just support her. School have been so supportive for us so don’t worry about that just speak to them before she starts x

[Jo31]

I’ve been in your situation too you’re not alone, my daughter started with constipation and soiling at about 1 year and it gradually got worse, she was put on movicol, lactose & sodium picosulphate doses at different times. I went through all the traumas of just doing it in her nickers when she wasn’t constipated I panicked for starting pre-school then nursery, then reception last September!! Nothing changed we had regular hospital visits and in the end after 4 years a different doctor realised how impact she was and sent her straight to surgery for a vacuum 😩 although pain free for her they did find that the years of constipation had expanded her bowell in one area so this would constintantly fill with poo with medicines or not. After being completely emptied she’s on small dosages of sodium pico and lactose daily but all is working “normally”. With regular toilet visits we were told her bowell will go back to normal too. Something that helped work for us was putting her money box in the toilet and rewarded her on each visit then each week take her shopping for what ever she wanted “within in reason obviously” ... don’t give up and if anything don’t be afraid to get a second opinion ... Good luck xx

[MorvN in reply to Jo31]

Jo31, thank you for the advice.Your strategy of ‘earning’ pocket money by going to the toilet is one we haven’t tried - so we will give that a shot.My biggest challenge is getting my girl to drink her Laxido meds as I have to push fluids all day with her.Sounds like she does just need a ‘clear out’ with lots of Laxido then a regular toileting regime.

Best of luck with your daughter’s recovery and training.Sounds promising.xx

[Jo31 in reply to MorvN]

Your welcome maybe ask your doctor to give her lactose or sodium picosulphate as that’s just medicine in 5ml syringe a lot easier than forcing the fluids into them I’ve been there too x

[Frustratedmum1]

Hi ya. Hang in there. I have been where you are and there is hope. My son's behaviour was exactly what you are describing and it is unbearable but it is due to them being compacted. When we got the bulk of my son's poo to move it was like turning a switch in relation to his behaviour and for the first-time he was showing some signs of having sensation.

My advice would be get refered to a paeditrian as soon as possible and if you don't hear anything ask for them to bring the appointment earlier and cry, break down in front of the doctors and say you can't cope. This is what i had to do.

I would but your child on the toilet 20 mins after every meal because it does help. This is when i sometimes get something out of my son. The one thing im learning with movicol is sometimes you think they are too wet and you reduce the dose but it was overflow and you should increase. I Quite often if they are having wee accidents it can be an indicator they are quite blocked up.

The one thing i didn't do when my son was really bad I didn't do anything for myself. Constipation engulfed my life. I find now i have to exercise on a regular basis so it destresses me and I have 25 mins of a day where it does not enter my head. I was getting that low I was on the verge of becoming depressed. Please look after yourself because we are on an emotional rollercoaster ride. Good luck. Please let me know how you are getting on. I will say if it wasn't for this forum I would feel extremely alone. So thank you.

[Helen36]

Hello - I saw your post and just had to reply. My little girl has had bad constipation since weaning that impacted her bowel that is now enlarged and presses on her bladder to cause wetting. Tonnes of soiling too and after disimpactions, Movicol galore, overactive bladder meds and Senna, we are finally making progress. She’s 5 now so started school last sept with all this going on.

I wanted to reply just to say we all find this so, so, hard as a parent. There’s nothing you’ve done wrong and it’s not your daughter’s fault. I am sure your history of depression makes this all even tougher, but believe me, this tests all of us to the core, so don’t feel alone. The first thing to start telling yourself is that she won’t be doing this on purpose. This is really hard to believe because all the behaviours that go with this tell you the opposite! We all struggle with lies, denial, anger etc. This is the condition, not your relationship or your daughter. Depersonalise it and talk about her naughty bladder and naughty poo that is doing this. Explain it’s not telling her what she needs to know to tell her when to go. Reward her for honesty and helping deal with it by drinking and taking her medicine etc. Don’t reward not having accidents but by all means celebrate success. All the advice you’ve had above is fab, just DEMAND specialist help. A good continence team or paediatrician will be just as interested in supporting you as helping the child. The Eric helpline is great too and the website has some fab you tube videos and resources to look at.

And finally, don’t panic about school. Most reception kids are still having accidents and those who are won’t be isolated socially. There are three in my daughter’s class who regularly wet and soil and all are very popular. Most schools are fab if you talk to them and will work with you. And if they’re not, tell us lot and we’ll help you sort them out! Xxx

[AndrewT]

Dear MorvN,

I am not entirely unsympathetic, to your feelings, but one question....Why are you SO worried about a child's Toileting? She is a YOUNG child, children have Accidents, and, from the sound of your description, it is just 'Happening' to her. Can I be Blunt here? If YOU had a Problem, say your bladder just emptied itself periodically, how would you feel if Someone kept referring to it? This is what you are doing to your Daughter- you say that YOU are 'at the end of your tether' now imagine how your poor Daughter feels.

All that said a visit, to the Doctor/Hospital to Rule Out any physical problems might be worth a try. Equally DO have her Tested for allergies/ food intolerances- imagine if All This is because she can't digest milk, for example.

In the mean time please just 'Get off Her Back', give her a nappy for Pete's sake! Sorry to be apparently telling YOU off, when you have asked about your Daughter, but....Maybe a bit more Patience, YOU are the Adult after all. (By the way most, if not all schools, will accept children who still use nappies, just speak to them nearer the time.)

Can you let us know how she 'gets on' please?

Andrew

[MorvN in reply to AndrewT]

With respect, Andrew, you do not know my child at all - I do.Also, if you do not have a child with similar issues, you are not qualified to judge and offer your opinion.You come across as a troll otherwise.I can assure you, my daughter has all the support and love she needs.

[AndrewT in reply to MorvN]

Dear MorvN,

I'm sorry, I have offended you, which wasn't my intention. Maybe, and reading back my own 'Post' probably, I DID lay it on a Bit Thick. I didn't intend, even if it seemed that way, to be telling what to do- and yes you DO clearly know your own Daughter best.

Once again, sorry. I Don't actually know what 'Troll' is- Is it someone who Hurts people? If so I am NOT one deliberately, maybe Someone who is a bit 'Trigger Happy'.

Once again, sorry that I offended you.

AndrewT