primary tumor

[muttonman]

I am BRAC2 positive with a G9 and mets to lungs. Started ADT March 23, two cycles of chemo last fall, currently on Nubeqa and Orgavix. Last PSA was .1. The nodules and lymph nodes are gone and I was turned down for radiation to the prostate. My diet is beyond clean, never thought I could do it, but I eat most raw vegatables, berries, nuts and beans. Fish if it's fresh. Nice to you all

[Tall_Allen]

You sound like a good candidate for PARP inhibitor when your current regimen fails.

[muttonman in reply to Tall_Allen]

PARP Ihibitors are nothing to look forward to. I'm on a site with women who have Ovarian cancer and it's rough

[Tall_Allen in reply to muttonman]

The old ones are very toxic, but hopefully, you'll be able to access the second-generation PARP inhibitors being tested now. They are very specific for PARP1 and are comparatively less toxic.

[mrscruffy in reply to muttonman]

Currently on Lynparza, once the correct dosage is determined it is a walk in the park for me

[Seasid in reply to mrscruffy]

How was the correct dosage determined?

[mrscruffy in reply to Seasid]

full dose is 600mg, after 3 months PSA dropped and no new Metastases, then tested white and red blood cells. They were low so dropped to 450mg, PSA still low and blood cells coming back. In September I am going to ask about going to 300mg. Not taking full doses is making my meds go way further. I assume I will have to pay eventually and it is expensive.

[Ian99 in reply to mrscruffy]

Glad to hear a walk in the park is possible. I am only 6 weeks in and the fatigue is overwhelming. Plus distorted taste and constipation. Are you on a reduced dosage? Am currently on 4x150mg a day but don’t want to give up.

[mrscruffy in reply to Ian99]

Have never had fatigue or distorted sense of taste but have experienced constipation but I have had that issue for a few years now. Doctor has me on fiber gummies and Miralax daily. The one that got was loss of breath from anemia. MO lowered dose to 3X150mg per day. Didn't effect efficacy of drug but helped with blood cell count. Going to ask MO if I can go to 2X150mg a day and see what happens. Over all I feel great on a daily basis. I can honestly say none of my treatments have kept me home in bed. Feeling lucky

[Ian99 in reply to mrscruffy]

Thanks for your thoughts. It’s still a bit early for me but I’ll discuss a reduced dosage with the MO. Am also interested in doing a PARP1 trial as this seems to be more targeted and less toxic. Keep going, you seem to be handling it well.

[mrscruffy in reply to Ian99]

Thanks, we got to keep on chugging along. Good luck to you moving forward

[Seasid]

Your could try 500 mg per day Silymarin natural PARP inhibitor exclusively from the seeds of the plant therefore no phytoestrogens.

[muttonman in reply to Seasid]

what is wrong with phytoestrogens?

[Seasid in reply to muttonman]

The prostate cancer could have also estrogen receptors parallel to the androgen receptors. That's why.

[Seasid in reply to Seasid]

See my post about it. I included the ChatGPT share about it cancer having estrogens receptors.

[Seasid in reply to muttonman]

Prostate cancer is primarily driven by androgens, which bind to androgen receptors (ARs) on prostate cancer cells, promoting their growth. However, estrogen receptors (ERs) can also be present in prostate tissues, including cancerous tissues. Phytoestrogens from milk thistle can interact with these estrogen receptors.

Here’s how phytoestrogens might affect prostate cancer:

1. **Estrogen Receptor Binding**: Phytoestrogens can bind to estrogen receptors in prostate tissue. Although prostate cancer is mainly driven by androgens, some cancer cells can express both androgen and estrogen receptors. Binding of phytoestrogens to estrogen receptors could potentially influence the behavior of these cells.

2. **Cross-Talk Between Receptors**: There is some evidence that estrogen receptor signaling can interact with androgen receptor signaling. This cross-talk could modulate the behavior of prostate cancer cells in complex ways, potentially impacting growth and progression.

3. **Balance of Hormonal Environment**: The overall hormonal environment, including levels of androgens and estrogens, can influence prostate cancer dynamics. By introducing phytoestrogens, the balance of hormonal signaling can shift, potentially affecting cancer progression.

Thus, even though prostate cancer primarily involves androgen receptors, the presence of estrogen receptors and the complex interplay between different hormonal pathways mean that substances like phytoestrogens in milk thistle could still impact the cancer’s behavior.

[Seasid in reply to Seasid]

Silymarin is primarily extracted from the seeds of the milk thistle plant and is known for its potential liver-protective properties. Concerns about estrogenic effects are generally associated with other parts of the plant, not the seeds. Therefore, using silymarin supplements specifically derived from milk thistle seeds should minimize the risk of estrogenic activity.

However, it's essential to consider the following:

1. **Source and Purity**: Ensure the silymarin supplement is derived exclusively from milk thistle seeds and check for third-party testing to confirm its purity.

2. **Consultation**: Discuss with your healthcare provider before starting any new supplement, especially if you have prostate cancer. They can provide personalized advice based on your medical history and current treatments.

3. **Dosage**: Follow recommended dosages and instructions provided by the manufacturer or your healthcare provider.

These steps can help ensure you're minimizing any potential risks while using silymarin.

[Lawrencee in reply to Seasid]

Seasid, could it be assumed that a BRCA ( BReastCAncer gene) mutation 1 or 2, could predispose a man's estrogenic disposition perhaps? Your Thoughts

[muttonman in reply to Lawrencee]

I eat flaxseed and tofu, plus I drink soy milk. All of these foods are thought to be good for prostate cancer.

[Seasid in reply to muttonman]

I really don't know but if your cancer has estrogen receptors than even BAT will not help you without an add on to that like carboplatin what my oncologist is doing now parallel to BAT.

[Seasid in reply to Lawrencee]

Yes, Purple+Bike said something like that but I can't recall exactly now what was it exactly. I just know that he stopped his treatment with estrogens because he has a BRCA mutation. I am not a doctor but you are welcome to ask the AI and then check with your doctor because unfortunately we can't fully rely on AI. I don't rely on anybody but myself. Of cause we have to ask the doctors but we have to be satisfied with the answer. It is not easy but possible if you do your research and ask for opinion etc.

[muttonman in reply to Seasid]

I can't find anything on phytoestrogens and BRCA2. I eat two tablespoons of freshly ground flaxseed and a cup of soy milk everyday. I have tofu on average of 3 times a week. Estrogen and Phytoestrogen are confused for the same thing. Thoughts?

[Seasid in reply to muttonman]

Could you please ask your doctor about your questions or maybe ChatGPT for the first iteration and later your doctor. I myself would not be concerned too much with eating healthy.

[Seasid in reply to Lawrencee]

Q. could it be assumed that a BRCA ( BReastCAncer gene) mutation 1 or 2, could predispose a man's estrogenic disposition perhaps?

A. A BRCA1 or BRCA2 mutation in men can indeed have significant implications for cancer risk, particularly for breast, prostate, and pancreatic cancers. However, the relationship between BRCA mutations and estrogenic disposition is less direct.

Men with BRCA1 or BRCA2 mutations are at higher risk for breast cancer, which is influenced by estrogen levels. This might suggest some link to hormonal regulation, but the mutation itself does not inherently cause increased estrogen levels or a predisposition to higher estrogenic activity.

For prostate cancer, BRCA mutations can lead to more aggressive forms of the disease, but this is more related to the gene's role in DNA repair mechanisms rather than a direct influence on estrogen levels.

Overall, while BRCA mutations can influence cancer risks that are hormonally driven, they do not necessarily predispose men to increased estrogenic activity by themselves. The relationship is more complex and involves interactions with other genetic, environmental, and hormonal factors.

Q. In a hormone sensitive metastatic prostate cancer setting with BRCA mutations would a treatment with high doses of estrogens have some dangers in comparison to the ADT treatment?

A. In a hormone-sensitive metastatic prostate cancer setting, especially with BRCA mutations, the use of high-dose estrogens as a treatment carries potential risks and considerations when compared to androgen deprivation therapy (ADT).

1. **Mechanism and Risks of Estrogen Therapy**:

- **Estrogen therapy** can suppress testosterone levels and has been used historically for prostate cancer treatment. However, high-dose estrogen can have significant cardiovascular side effects, such as increased risks of thromboembolic events, heart attacks, and strokes.

- In the context of BRCA mutations, there might be additional concerns due to the potential interplay between estrogens and DNA repair mechanisms affected by these mutations, though specific data on this interaction in prostate cancer is limited.

2. **Mechanism and Risks of ADT**:

- **ADT** reduces androgen levels, which prostate cancer cells typically rely on for growth. ADT is a well-established and commonly used treatment for hormone-sensitive metastatic prostate cancer.

- While ADT also has side effects, including bone density loss, cardiovascular risks, metabolic changes, and impact on quality of life, these are relatively well-characterized and managed in clinical practice.

3. **BRCA Mutations Consideration**:

- **BRCA mutations** may make prostate cancer more aggressive and possibly influence the response to different treatments, including hormone therapies. There is evidence suggesting that BRCA-mutated prostate cancers might respond differently to various treatments, and they might benefit from additional therapies such as PARP inhibitors.

- Estrogen therapy's influence on BRCA-mutated prostate cancer is not well studied, and caution would be warranted due to the potential for adverse interactions with the mutation’s pathways.

4. **Clinical Evidence and Guidelines**:

- Current clinical guidelines predominantly recommend ADT for hormone-sensitive metastatic prostate cancer, sometimes in combination with other treatments (e.g., chemotherapy, second-generation androgen receptor inhibitors).

- High-dose estrogen therapy is not commonly used due to its side effect profile and the availability of other effective treatments.

Given the complexities and potential risks, especially with the presence of BRCA mutations, it is crucial to have a thorough discussion with an oncologist to understand the best treatment options tailored to the specific clinical scenario. The oncologist may consider genetic counseling and possibly incorporating targeted therapies that address the specific genetic profile of the cancer.

[j-o-h-n]

Greetings,

Would you be kind enough to add to your bio for your benefit as well as ours. Thank you!

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n

[muttonman in reply to j-o-h-n]

I have fallen twice in one month😜 but still feel gratitude towards a tough situation to be in.

[j-o-h-n]

Been there, done that and have the bumps to prove it........Make sure when falling you protect your head. One of my friends suggested I wear a bicycle helmet at all times......... I asked him if I need one while I'm sleeping..... He replied only if my wife has a tendency to push me off the bed....(He happens to be a smart ass like me)....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n

 

[muttonman in reply to j-o-h-n]

Humor is good

[j-o-h-n in reply to muttonman]

Yes it is............ it keeps me going.........

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n