PSA and Testosterone

[Vp7174]

Hi all -

I am a brand new member here, so forgive me if this question was asked.

You can check my bio for my full story. My immediate question is pertaining to my testosterone levels and my PSA. Long story short - I had a RP done in August. Subsequent to that I had an initial Post Surgery PSA of .20 (about 7 weeks post RP), then a month later it was .27, then as of yesterday which was another month later, the PSA result is at .28. I’m not on any medical treatment at the moment aside from the 4 things I’ve implemented over the last month which include drinking a lot of high PH water with fresh lemon, moderate resistance weight training, Reishi Mushroom supplements, and a 14 hour fast daily. When my PSA was at .27 my Testosterone was 900, as of yesterday’s result, my Testosterone was 1246 (PSA .28). The root of the question is why would the PSA go up 1/100th of a point, yet T level went up 346. I am of the understanding that the intent of medical castration is to reduce T levels so low that it will reduce PSA … I’d expect if my T is so high, I’d assume that my cancer cells would be on a Testosterone feeding frenzy, but instead, PSA has almost stabilized since the last. Any opinions would be great, as I am constantly trying to educate myself every day.

[Tall_Allen]

It's called "saturation" of the androgen receptors. For most men, all your androgen receptors are fully saturated with testosterone when your serum level is about 150. A sopping wet sponge doesn't get any wetter no matter how much water you pour over it.

BTW- lemon lowers the pH of your expensive water.

[Vp7174 in reply to Tall_Allen]

Thanks for sharing that info.

[awb1 in reply to Tall_Allen]

I've considered exactly what you wrote here, in the context of "saturation". Why do proponents of BAT cycle supra testosterone (1500+) to very low testosterone. Isn't there a contradiction between your 150 and their 1500 to achieve "saturation"?

[Tall_Allen in reply to awb1]

In theory at least, BAT researchers thought that huge levels of testosterone, when cycled with ADT, can in some ways repair an androgen receptor that has become castration resistant - it is a different phenomenon from saturation.

[gsun]

Getting an RP is not medical castration.

[addicted2cycling in reply to gsun]

wgsun wrote --- " Getting an RP is not medical castration."

London441 wrote -- " What 'medical castration' are you referring to? "

Always thought that if the original plumbing is still in place and functioning as intended AND the boys are still in town, *T* would hopefully be at age appropriate levels. 😀

[gsun in reply to addicted2cycling]

As I know it, medical castration is removing the boys. chemical castration is drugs. But, perhaps it can cover both.

[London441]

What ‘medical castration’ are you referring to?

[runtrails]

I'm somewhat a newbie myself so I will probaly get corrected here. But 6 or 7 weeks post surgery is too soon to confirm BCR as dead cells continue to show PSA. 3 months would be first PSA. Value to use. I don't see a treatment in your bio that would indicate castration for T reduction like physical castration (orchiectomy) or hormone therapy. Though some prostate cells produce androgens your testicals are the primary source of T production with some in the Adrenals. Androgen (like testosterone) supression would come from front line treatments such LHRH agonists like Lupron (what I get) or Eligard or from LHRH antagonists such as Firmagon and Orgovyx.

[dadzone43]

The <SEARCH> at the top can give you tons of information from this forum.

[Vp7174]

To clarify, I have not been medically castrated, or chemically castrated. I had my first PSA 7 weeks following my surgery, then a month later, then another month after that. I have had a detectable PSA on all 3 checks so far, and it has steadily increased, clearly indicating I still have residual disease somewhere. (if there is another possible explanation, please share). My question was pertaining to my Testosterone level, and with it being so high after my 3rd check, why would my PSA only rise 1/100th (.27 to .28 in 30 days). I was expecting that a high T level, would effect PSA in a linear fashion, but I was wrong. @Tall_Allen did a great job explaining the Saturation point of testosterone levels, as is pertains to PSA consumption. Hope this helps to clarify the root of my original post.

[NecessarilySo]

My own unprofessional opinion, (I am not a doctor), is that the RP was either premature and/or unnecessary, (PSA 4 is normal for your age), and there is probably some residual prostate material unremoved, which is probably not malignant.

As for the above normal testosterone reading, check these causes:

mylabbox.com/high-testoster...

Adrenal Disorders

Disorders that involve the adrenal glands, small organs above the kidneys, can cause the body to produce too much testosterone. Congenital adrenal hyperplasia is a condition that some people are born with and that can be passed down genetically. People who suffer from this disorder can’t produce other hormones therefore leading to too much testosterone in the body.

Cancer

The AACC, American Association for Clinical Chemistry, explains that various types of cancers can create abnormal levels of testosterone in the body. Tumors that appear on organs that help regulate hormones in they body such as adrenal glands and ovaries/testicles may cause the body to produce high levels of testosterone.

Early-Onset Puberty

Hitting puberty earlier than normal is a big sign in having too much testosterone. Puberty is a stage when young males develop pubic, underarm, and facial hair and experiences growth in their genitals and a deepening of the voice. Puberty is considered early if it happens before a boy is nine years old.

Drug Use

Using illegal or illicit steroids for non-medical uses can cause high testosterone levels in the body.