Absolutely thrilled with my mono tE2 ADT therapy after 35 months! I repeat..."The ONLY side effect is little boobies" and of course my sex life has been 'on hold' for quite some time, but what the heck, I'm looking forward to completing/celebrating my 78th orbit in just a few weeks! Thanks to the many ladyboys here in Thailand (who introduced me to the gel), and my mentor Richard Wassersug, I believe that my PCa is currently sleeping and often forget that I even have cancer.
Test results as of: 2/16/2021:
PSA---- 0.003
T-------- 13
E2-------220
ALP-----84 (was in the 120s before I started applying the gel)
I wish that I could convince my many comrades who are tolerating and suffering from the nasty side effects of exorbitantly priced Lupron injections that tE2 should be given a try? My cost of the gel is about $200/year, and 'no' doctor visits!
After a robotic RP (16 years ago) and lymph node excision (3½ years ago) my PSA continued to rise until I began using Oestrogel almost three years ago. When my accomplished, senior urologist at Loyola wanted to put me on Lupron and I refused, he then suggested that perhaps I could find DES in Southeast Asia since it 'was' a very effective ADT hormone prior to 1985 when it was replaced by Leuproelin injections. To the best of my knowledge DES (diethylstilbestrol), which was an 'oral' estrogen is no longer available due to the increased risk of cardio events.
That's my story and I'm sticking to it! Feel free to contact me...Ron
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E2-Guy
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"To the best of my knowledge DES (diethylstilbestrol), which was an 'oral' estrogen is no longer available due to the increased risk of cardio events. "
Sure! 'Oestrogel' is a brand name of a transdermal estradiol (tE2) clear gel that is produced by Besins in France generally used by postmenopausal females to replace declining E2 levels. Instead of ingesting oral hormone replacement supplements (such as the old DES) which can increase cardio events since they pass through the liver, transdermal hormones are absorbed through the skin and enter the bloodstream directly thus avoiding what is known as 'first-pass hepatic metabolism'.
E2 is present in both women and men (men obviously having much lower levels) and has numerous functions; maintaining bone density being a major factor. Osteoporosis is quite common in postmenopausal women, hence the need for E2 supplements.
Using tE2 as an alternative to traditional LHRHa (luteinizing hormone releasing hormone agonists) such as Lupron and Zoladex has been shown to be equally effective without many of the nasty side effects. A previous post of mine titled ‘The Patch Trial’ details the effectiveness of tE2.
Simply stated, the action of tE2 is that where by which flooding the bloodstream with E2 sends signals to the hypothalamus/pituitary glands (negative feedback loop regulation) to tell the testicles to slow down or stop the production of T. Since some T is aromatized into E2, these signals are telling the gonads, "Hey guys, you are the ones responsible for this excess E2, therefore it's time to curtail your T production!" This action produces the same results as chopping off the little boys!
I apply an amount of the gel (equal to about two toothbrush doses) to my inner thighs and lower abdomen after awakening and before bedtime.
A quote from PubMed:
“The effectiveness of LHRH agonists has been demonstrated in the United States in several randomized, controlled clinical trials. Daily administration of leuprolide produced equivalent results compared with diethylstilbestrol (DES). More recently, in two separate, randomized studies, the long-acting LHRH agonist Zoladex (ICI Pharma, Wilmington, Delaware) produced the same objective response rate as DES or bilateral orchiectomy. The equivalent response rates obtained with LHRH agonists indicate that these drugs can now be considered a reasonable treatment option for patients with metastatic prostatic cancer.”
DES (oral estrogen) was a very effective form of ADT until it was replaced in 1985 by Leuprolide (Lupron), and tE2 is just as effective without the CV risks.
I don't believe that it is even available in the US. Gee I wonder why? Richard Wassersug buys it in Canada; however, for about 4x as much as I pay in Thailand.. That being said, just think about the millions, perhaps billions of dollars of revenue that would be lost if a man could treat himself with a hormone that costs $200/year? My thinking is that the AMA and US pharmaceutical companies have lobbied to prevent it from being sold in he US.
Thank you for the update. I have been using patches and following the PATCH protocols since August of last year and have had success in controlling a G9 N1MO. I had extreme difficulty with hot flushes using Lupron as salvage ADT - sleep deprivation due to hourly episodes day and night. I do have gynecomastia - a small price to pay at 76. It was your comments here plus those of Dr Wassersug and his book that convinced me to attempt this therapy and I add my appreciation to others here.
In clarification of my two statements regarding the only side effect being "little boobies" and my sex life being "on hold" I submit the following: I have lost the hair under my arms; however, the hair on my head is as dense as a 'rainforest' and my Thai gf (35 years my junior) maintains that I probably "wore the little guy out" long before I met her 16 years ago!
So all I have to do, is go to Thailand and have a young Thai lady (no ladyboys) rub that tE2 cream on my inner thighs, close my eyes and pray for a happy ending.
That's not what I heard from your fellow hockey players..They say you're very assertive in the shower with your high dic oops sticking and trying to score with a fuc oops puck...
Note: the word assertive when your in the shower with the guys...
I absolutely love it here...our average temp most of the year is in the low 80s. Could count the number of sunless days in 16 years on one hand. We have two rainy seasons consisting of brief showers followed by sunshine. November through March are incredibly beautiful. I spent 46 years in the Chicago area and wouldn't go back if someone gave me Elon Musk's money!
Not all of Thailand's weather is like where I live. I live in a high rise (38th floor) on the gulf beach about 75 miles south of Bangkok. Always a breeze and no bugs.
Since ‘XPO1’ (don’t know his given name) and ‘j-o-h-n’ have escalated this forum to a ‘hole’ new level of entertainment which I think is great, especially during this Covid-crap that has ravaged much of the world, political unrest in America, nasty weather in upper latitude regions, and depressing posts from some of our warriors, I thought that a bit more humor might elicit a smile or two from some of our members!
My recent “tE2 35 month update” included a ladyboy photo, and being kinda feminized myself (I’m not a full-blown tranny ‘yet’, but I’ve acquired some of the characteristics), I decided to share something that a buddy of mine (known as ‘Blade Imel’ on YouTube) conned me into helping him with.
Shortly after he moved to Thailand I took him to a ladyboy bar (Thailand is famous for M-F transgenders) where he had great time. Ever since that night he has developed this addiction for ladyboys. He later noticed that numerous people have been making a living by just posting ladyboy videos on YouTube so he decided to give it a try and elected me as his cameraman and ‘editor in chief’. We have posted over 30 videos so far (some a bit risqué), so if you are offended by this type of content, no one is forcing you to watch them! Unfortunately we haven’t made a dime yet and most likely never will; however, we are having fun. I seriously doubt that Mercedes or Netflix will ever be interested in sponsoring two old farts and a bunch of male Thai whores; probably not even a condom company or a penis enhancement med peddler!
Oh sh*t...I'm not sure if I'm ready for him yet! My gf spends a lot of time taking care of our cacti while I'm out goofing off with the guys and ladyboys!
Congratulations on the excellent response and durability of E2 only ADT. Tamoxifen can prevent (10 mg) or reduce (20) the boobies as I’m sure you must be aware. Thanks for leading the way on this. And yes stay away from DES.
Thank you Paul for your kind message! Regarding Tamoxifen, I'm still somewhat reluctant to take it since I don't think that the jury has decided if it impacts the efficacy of E2. Richard Wassersug and I have discussed this subject at great lengths and he is not convinced that taking it along with E2 is a good idea. If I knew that a 'temporary' regimen would reduce the size of mine, I would give it a try; however, my boobs have reached a plateau and the sensitivity has diminished considerably. Here in Thailand where our temperature averages 80° I seldom wear a shirt in my condo and none of my friends ever comment about them.
Hope you're doing well after all that you have been through!
Amazing results, you must be over the moon. I had prostate cancer diagnosed in March 2020 (Stage 4 Gleason 9). Have recently completed 6 cycles of chemo. My PSA , which was originally 76, dropped to 1.6 in December 2020. I don't have medical insurance so have been undergoing treatment at the public hospital.
Currently on ADT injections (Enantone 11.25mg) every 3 months. Saw your posts on Besin's Oestrogel usage and very impressed with the outcome you’ve achieved using it. Seriously considering giving Oestrogel a try. Would very much appreciate your thoughts on the following possible scenarios:
1. Continue on ADT until it’s no longer effective before trying Oestrogel;
2. Use Oestrogel at the same time as ADT; or
3. Stop ADT now and move onto Oestrogel;
Current plan outlined by doctor is to stay on ADT and at some time in the future come of it and possibly start on Abiraterone.
I assume from your comment that Enantone is your only form of therapy that you are currently using. If that is the case, Oestrogel should offer the same results as the LHRHa injections without most of the common side effects. Cost and SEs of LHRHa drugs were primary factors in my decision to begin using tE2 gel. I imagine that Oestrogel is available in Hong Hong since most pharmacies in Thailand have it in stock. Perhaps Tall_Allen (the PCa guru) can give you far more valid advise than what my 'two cents' are worth!
I forgot to mention that (from what I have been reading/hearing) most of the men that are having success with tE2 had either a radical or some form of radiation conducted on their prostate.
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Update on Bat protocol after 14 months
