Night Thoughts

[Beach18]

Due to heart issues that began 2 years after RALP in 2015, I decided to hold on therapy and didn’t start ADT until my PSA hit 22, started having pain and a bone scan showed extensive bone mets. On Firmagon for 2 months and PSA 1, testosterone 21 and no pain now.

Had CT and MRI and spine remains full of cancer. Uro wants me to start Taxotere ASAP and I still worry about cardiac risk. Thinking about waiting to see if ADT stops working before starting chemo to protect heart as long as possible - suggestions from the community?

[Hidden]

I agree with your Uro to start Chemotherapy as soon as possible. That's what I did and it worked well, getting my PSA down to 0.19 and eliminating my pain.

The CHAARTED and STAMPEDE trials showed an OS benefit for doing early chemotherapy along with ADT, especially for men with extensive mets.

Docetaxel chemotherapy is well tolerated for most so it's nothing to be afraid of. Good luck with your treatment decisions.

[Beach18 in reply to Hidden]

Appreciate it

[Beach18]

Thank you

[Hidden]

We all can expect cardiovascular conditions to worsen with adt . After RT and 4yrs adt my veins are so small that they’re hard to find. I used to have prominent veins in arms .. That can’t be good? I hope that you find a solution to both issues ...personally I’d hit it as hard as you can tolerate..

[Hidden]

I had 6 rounds of Taxotere beginning August 2017 due to doubling PSA every 4-6 weeks. Yes it brought my PSA down to 4 and it’s risen back to 107 last blood test. However be prepared for potential side effects of peripheral neuropathy (mine in both feet and finger tips), potential lymphoma, (mine in both legs but treatmentable) and loss of finger and toe nails. I was told after treatment that Taxotere is one of the hardest on your body. For me, I will not do chemo again, and just recently told my oncologist such. Yes, I want to live longer but chemo is no respecter of our cells, it’s a carpet bomb. I too have bone mets, mostly in my spine. Gregg57, what were your side effects? Not many talk about the downside to chemo or other drugs, and I only would hope they would.

My prayers and thoughts are for you. God bless all with this terrible disease.

[Beach18 in reply to Hidden]

That’s exactly how I see it. We’re in desperate need of treatment, but the risk/benefit is not always the consideration- it’s all about destroying the cancer cells - but at what risk to the host?

How do you evaluate if a treatment’s side effects are worth it? - it really is like a bomb instead of a bullet.

If you make it about quality of life and not just about how many extra months you can get, if surgery resulted in partial incontinence and obvious other issues, and ADT results in cardiac risk, fatigue, brain fog, hot flashes, insomnia and personality changes -

all of which are manageable and every day is truly a blessing -

it seems like chemo, which like everything else has no guarantee, will certainly be the worst thing yet.

I know there’s research and a potential cure or at least better therapies in the pipeline but my bottom line,

And that’s for me- not anyone else -

Will chemo be worth it

And this community always provides the input and advice I need

Thanks

[Stegosaurus37]

I, also, have told my oncologist I won't do another round of chemo. Although I tolerated taxotere much better than many others, it still turned me into a zombie and 7 months after ending chemo, I still haven't recovered completely. Never quit fighting, but never forget why you are fighting. Everything has a cost and you have to decide for yourself whether it's worth the price.

Your brothers are with you all the way; we respect your choice and support you in it.

[Beach18 in reply to Stegosaurus37]

That’s my attitude exactly - thanks

[Hidden]

Can you elaborate on your heart issues? Can they truly be connected to your RALP surgery? I've had atrial fibrillation for many years prior to developing prostate cancer. I take prescription meds and supplements to manage it. I had no a-fib episodes while on ADT. I was concerned about how it might affect my heart. It wasn't a problem. Do you have a cardiologist and is he talking to your urologist? Are you exercising to maintain your cardiovascular fitness level?

[Beach18 in reply to Hidden]

Heart issues are not related to prostate cancer or RALP - the problem is that both ADT and Chemo can cause problems with your heart and these bad effects can be worse for those with pre existing heart disease

[Hidden in reply to Beach18]

You haven't described your pre existing heart disease. Hope it's not serious or disabling. My condition is well managed now but it wasn't a few years ago. It's not fun having a bum ticker. I don't give it much thought these days.

[Hidden]

Curious about naturopathic treatments for CVD. already on serrapeptase and nattokinase, as well as statin, metformin, aspirin.

[Hidden]

Atheroscleroses, narrowed arteries with high risk features and positive remodelling.

My fear is that with ADT the unstable plaque could rupture. And I know Natto dissove fibrin, but is this not dangerous for the fibrous cap of the atheroma?

Interested in keeping them more open and stabilizing plaque.