10yo needs help managing impulse control

[PerfectlyQuirky]

hi - our 10 year old kiddo (grade 4) struggled in the public school system with her response to being bullied. We moved her to private school for this school year and we were told a few weeks ago she’s not a fit for the school.

here’s a bit of background (I’m trying to include relevant information)

- she has an autoimmune disease with delayed gross motor skills and medical trauma

- ADHD went undiagnosed due to the above and has been treated as generalized anxiety disorder

- she fat

- she struggled with impulse control in the following situations:

— any time she perceived injustice or unfairness for herself or others

— when repeated requests to leave her alone are not granted

— when she doesn’t understand why she needs to do something (the why is very important)

- she’s gifted academically

- one of her superpowers is language - she can outdebate adults but struggled to acknowledge cues from her peers (if she meant something as a joke, then it was a joke and does not show empathy to how her peers respond.

At her private school she made three wonderful friendships and this changed her world. She loved going to school for the first time. However, her fatness and disability makes her an easy target. She can manage bullying to a certain point. In her words “mama, it’s like they can my buttons until the 8th button, but when they push the eighth button, suddenly I’m in the principals office and I don’t understand what happened”.

The incident that led to her being expelled was explained to us like this:

a group of kids circled her in the playground singing a song at her about fat kids. Kiddo asks them to leave her alone and they go away. They come back a few minutes later and tell her friends to be careful or they will catch her fat disease. She explains to them how obesity works and that you can’t catch it. They leave and return a few mins later and start (literally) poking her with sticks. She picks up a rock and tells them she will smash it over their heads if they don’t stop.

And that was the line for the school that she crossed.

We are currently homeschooling her for the rest of the school year but we have absolutely zero idea what school looks like for her going forward.

I had hoped an ADHD diagnosis would help with accommodations but our meeting with the public board this week underscored that the expectations will be the same with or without a diagnosis and a threat of violence will be treated accordingly.

How do I protect her here? I am terrified that as she gets older she opens herself up to really life limiting consequences.

She’s been in therapy since she was 3. We just started FoQuest but it’s challenging to know if it’s helping because we don’t see these behaviours at home.

And I want to be clear - our experience is that the education system (both private and public) is not going to change, so I need to help her meet the expectations while in school.

ANY help and guidance hugely appreciated.

[Onthemove1971]

We are excited you have joined the group. Parenting a child with ADHD is a challenge. When your child has additional issues they struggle with it can be complex and overwhelming ( our son also has additional issues).You are correct our children have to " conform" to the system if we are going to have them educate them.

Children with ADHD benefit from: therapy, medication and an educational plan ( 504 plan or IEP). Some also include parenting classes.

Most children benefit from accommodations: seating, assignment turn in, extra time on tests, etc...

The 504 plan is a federal document and schools are required to follow.

Have you thought about things like: medication, educational plan ( sometimes done by special education, or other).

If your child struggles with her weight, her medical doctor should help you to teach her about her weight.

We are happy you have joined us in the group.

[Aloysia]

So the actual physical violence of several kids poking her with sticks was ok but the threat of physical violence (i.e. the threat of her defending herself) if they didn't stop assaulting her was not ok? Please be the squeaky wheel and ensure that the other kids are expelled for their physical violence if that has not happened already. You can file a police report if the school refuses to do anything. Otherwise these kids will find another target and continue with this type of despicable behavior.

I do not have additional suggestions other than to find another school. Look for other public schools, other private schools, charter schools (a type of public school), online schools, etc. Worst case, keep her in one of the many home schooling programs until middle school starts.

I would also suggest counseling with a specific emphasis on how she can react to de-escalate in a way that won't get her expelled or suspended. For example, immediately walking over to a teacher, finding a safe space like the library or office, etc.

I also wonder if martial arts might be something to pursue as well. First, because it will give her a boost of self-confidence. Second, because they will teach her to de-escalate. Third, because she will learn self-defense skills in case she ever needs them in later life.

Best wishes!

[PerfectlyQuirky in reply to Aloysia]

Martial arts is a GREAT idea. I immediately started googling for classes. Thank you!

I can’t take on the fight with the private school. I just don’t have it in me. It was the same challenge in the public system and the way they managed it was to make her a helper - which means she was isolated from her peers for 6 months and we “trained” her to ignore the in class bullying. She was a shell of the kid we knew and started self harming.

The last straw in the public system was when the group of girls bullying her spread a rumour that our kiddo had punched one of them in the eye. We learned about this when her only friend told her she couldn’t play with her anymore. We live in a small village and she was at a village school. Everyone - and I mean everyone - knew about this and there are still parents in the neighbourhood who believe it.

The school and the parents of the children involved know it was a lie but the parents would not consent to any social work intervention or mediation, and the school decided it was up to us to correct the lie. No one apologies to our kiddo or even acknowledged to her what had happened.

The parents we did talk to explained it like this “we thought that they had pushed your kiddo so hard that she lost control”.

She didn’t. She hadn’t interacted with these kids outside of the classroom for 7 months.

I can tell myself stories - in the public school the parents of the other kids are big donors and on the school council and friends with many of the teaching staff. In private the parents of the kids are big donors with siblings and lawyer jobs.

When I have pointed out the duplicity, the unfairness, the ways they have let my child down, *i* and the issue.

We cannot change the education system, what we can do is everything possible to help our kiddo meet expectations, absorb the pain without losing her spark and build strength until she ages out and can go on to change the world.

[Imakecutebabies]

Um, I think many neurotypical kids would also have had a similar response in that situation. Why weren't any staff members stopping the kids from poking her with sticks? Are the bullies also in trouble?

She definitely needs the "go get an adult" response to get built into her toolbox. I agree with Aloysia above.

[PerfectlyQuirky in reply to Imakecutebabies]

Thank you. It is so nuanced it’s hard to really explain the situations. She absolutely would go and get an adult at the first moment she felt uncomfortable. But in both private and public it would be handled like she was overreacting OR the group of other children would say they didn’t do anything and back each other up. (The go to response to us parents would be “it’s a he said she said so really nothing we can do about it).

And I think it’s further complicated for a few reasons:

1) she is taller and fatter than everyone else. When she is scared she looks angry. The other kids cry when held accountable. Our kiddo rarely cries.

2) she can and does out debate teachers. Some teachers love this about her but most do not appreciate it. She cannot conform to the group if she believes it is wrong or there is injustice. Example, teacher calls out kid A for talking. Our kiddo also hears kid b and c talking. Our kiddo would let the teacher know kid b and c were also talking. If teacher didn’t address c and b the same as A, our kiddo would explain the unfairness to the teacher.

She explained the difference between equality and equality to the principal during an assembly when she was 6.

I do t know if this helps and I want to clear that we know she is not an angel. We know that she should not have picked up that rock. We wish she would just pick her battles with teaching staff. But she is 10 and we are curious about the triggers so while we see the negative behaviours, we understand them and coach her. Teaching staff, in our experience, seem to only focus on the action for our kiddo and not what caused it.

[Imakecutebabies in reply to PerfectlyQuirky]

I hear you and I understand. The school system is letting my son down as well. Everything is always his fault, even if he has no recollection of it even happening; he's the liar if others have a different story; I am a terrible parent, and if I push back, I am an even more terrible parent because I am supporting my child's misbehavior instead of correcting it. Sorry I can't be more helpful.

[Mamamichl]

Thank you for sharing. I work in special education, and I can say there’s a lot to unpack here.

Do you have an IEP for her? Kids can have an IEP even if they are gifted, since they struggle socially at times, and would still need accommodations. If she doesn’t qualify, she can definitely get a 504, but this is only in public schools, not private or charter ones. Although it doesn’t help bullying usually, some schools are more open to kids with differing abilities than others. I think its even on rate my school website.

You can also take her to public online schools too (connections academy is a big one in the US). The interactions are a little more structured, so they will be supervised more. They also have events that help the kids get out of the house and do things physically more than typical schools. Also, to supplement physical activity, you can join her up for a less competitive extracurricular (martial arts, swimming, yoga, etc). This stuff can help with confidence.

Also, there are ADHD meds that have a side effect that suppresses appetite. I don’t usually request it, but sometimes this side effect can be a benefit. Anxiety meds may be able to help with this too. Definitely talk to your doc about it before making a decision. Talk to the counselor about pragmatic skills and other more specific skills related to emotional regulation and social skills (DBT?)

If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

[PerfectlyQuirky in reply to Mamamichl]

Thank you. I should have mentioned we are in Canada so online is t an option (I don’t think? I’ll look into this but also, trying to figure out homeschooling and work isn’t easy). She had an IEP in the public system which gave her access to the enrichment program and some accommodations around executive function. - nothing behavioural.

We just started her on FoQuest and have noticed the amount she is eating has decreased. Her fatness is part genetics, part high dose steroid for her JIA, part dopamine chasing. She’s an active kid (she’s a talented swimmer and we have a year round pool, horse riding, biking, tree climbing) what she lacks is the normal kids just playing kinda exercise.

Right now I am creating a daily school plan for her covering the major topics and we have a tutor twice a week. We are looking at our finances to see if one of us could stop working to home school her. But I am struggling with “why does this have to be so bloody hard” question and “why are we doing all the accommodating”.

Our kid is smart and funny and engaging and curious, and she doesn’t deserve what’s happened and is happening to her. I need to grieve that I think this summer.

Thank you for listening.

[Mamamichl in reply to PerfectlyQuirky]

I totally get the struggle. My cousins had a lot of bullying from their weight, and some of my closest friends. I also was bullied because of my adhd symptoms.

I’m so glad she’s active. It really is hard when someone can’t control their weight due to medications. I presume you already talked to the doc about alternatives. You really are a good mom, and I can see you are trying so hard.

Have you talked to her counselor about kids social groups that may not judge on her personality or weight? Maybe ask around in your city about other parents in a similar situation.