NDT and Levo combination

[Duckgainz]

Hello, I would like a little discussion. I drink Levo because of Hasimoto. I'm a big man and I need a large amount for my labs to be ok (I'm 120 kg lifting weights).

When I drink 200 mcg of levotyroxin my results are ok, but T4 is over the limit. I would like to take some NDT so I don't have to take so much levo.

Because of t3 in ndt. Pure t3 is not available to me, only ndt and Levo .

Would it be best to take ndt in the morning and Levo in the afternoon?

Or it is possible to take them together in the morning?. In that case, would they block each other in absorption?

Since I work at a construction site and it is difficult for me to be consistent in the afternoon, so that I am on empty stomac every day at the same time, or that it does not come into collision with some other supplements that I drink, such as Selenium, D3, etc...

Thanks in advance.

[Buddy195 Administrator]

Welcome to the forum Duckgainz…I think this is your first post.

Are you in the UK?

So we can offer better advice, can you share blood test results (with ranges in brackets) for:

TSH

FT3

FT4

Plus any antibody and key vitamin tests (ferritin, folate, vitamins D and B12)

Please do add ranges, as these can vary between laboratories.

If your GP is unable to complete all the above (eg if TSH is within range, some surgeries may not be able to access FT4 and FT3 tests), you could look to do this privately, as many forum members do, for a better picture of your thyroid health:

UK link:

thyroiduk.org/help-and-supp...

What adverse symptoms are you currently experiencing?

[Duckgainz in reply to Buddy195]

Hy Buddy, Im from little country od Croatia.Our coast is beautiful, but the standard of living is low 😃. But it is improving little by little.

My TSH on levothyroxine (between 150-175-200 mcg)

Tsh: 2.2 (0.5-4.78)

Ft4: 24 (11.5-22.7)

Ft3 : 6.38 (3.5-6.5)

Ant-TPO bigger than 1300 ( not readable, too big)

Ant-tg in range smaller than 1.3 range is smaller than 4.5 too small for Reading.

I regulate the dose myself So that it will be sometime

Tsh: 5.1 (0.5-4.78

Ft4: 19.9 (11.5-22.7)

Ft3: 5.37 (3.5-6.5)

thats from the Last time on Levo

My vitamin D was low two years ago, which is strange because I've been supplementing with it for years, before I knew what Hashimoto's was.

Vit B is ok.

The point is that I would not want to take large doses of levothyroxine for the rest of my life. Because I read one study that long-term high doses can lead to some undesirable conditions (I read that in one place and watched a video on YouTube, I don't want to incite panic, but I can give a link, A study does not necessarily mean that it is certainly so in reality, just one study

) and it doesn't make sense for me to take only t4 if I can get to ndt.

So I got a prescription for ndt, the only problem is that I have to travel to another city and pay a lot for the prescription and pay for the ndt to be mailed to me. I like levothyroxine because it's long release and lasts all day while ndt is more short acting as far as I understand, so would like to combine.

The problem was that the doctor prescribed too low a dose, so I have my last blood test, which is the first after I switched to ndt. Dose is 3xhalf a Grain a day (3x18.75 , t4, 4.6t3)

The results were very bad

Tsh 45 (0.55-4.77)

Ft4 10.49 (11.5-22.7)

Ft3 3.63 (3.5-6.5)

I believe he wants me to lift doze gradually, but he was obviously wrong. Now I'm waiting to hear him on the phone for the future doze, but I've already added Levothyroxine because I don't want to be with these numbers.

The thing is, I feel good. I train hard all the time, I take my strength training seriously, with numbers like this I lifted 200 kg the other day.

I don't have any special problems, even when I was diagnosed with Hasimoto's two years ago, my tsh was 100( one hundred) I worked 8-10 hours and trained, only then I gained Weight and had my feet swollen so I went for the checkup, but I was Hypo for who knows how long. Im kind of a meathead 🙂, I think that my mindset and muscle helped me then and now .

I supllement magnesium, zinc , sometimes creatinw from my teenager days

Now I added d3, Selenium, l carinitine, and some Cooper BC of zinc

I eat gluten free 90%

Cut back on dairy

Soy we dont eat Here. Try to eat no seed oils

For all my life I had OCD so I have some Anxiety can be worse when my numbers are bad, but not drastically

I have no problems at the moment, I have been on that dose of ndt for 2 months, so during that period my numbers dropped.

I apologize for the bad spelling, I hope I'm a little clearer now.

[Buddy195 Administrator in reply to Duckgainz]

What time of day was your blood tests?

Did you take your thyroid medication before or after the blood test?

The vast majority of people with hypothyroidism do well on Levothyroxine. The medication can safely be used for life.

I will alert SlowDragon re vitamins, as she is very knowledgeable in this area. Please be careful with selenium and take no more than 100ug per day (as supplements over 400ug daily can be toxic). I have taken 200ug selenium in the past (but this was for thyroid eye disease and I’ve now reduced).

[Duckgainz in reply to Buddy195]

The test was in the morning on an empty stomach, I took the last dose the morning before. I took the dose after taking blood. I know that Levo is safe, but I don't know if these large doses of mine are ok. I was a little worried about that video of that study, and I would also like to try ndt to reduce the dose of Levo, less t4. Thanks for the discussion

[Hypopotamus]

As Buddy says, post some results. But I take levo together with my NDT with no issues.

[Duckgainz in reply to Hypopotamus]

Thanks for the answer, I wrote the results above. I would also like to drink them together, can you describe to me how you drink them, take them

[Hypopotamus in reply to Duckgainz]

I take tablets.

[Duckgainz in reply to Hypopotamus]

I get it, 🤣I thought I'd ask how you determined the ratio?

[PixieElv]

I find it hard to have clear 2 hour window of no food or caffeine during the day so I take my NDT and Levo in the morning. Both on an empty stomach about an hour before breakfast. I have no problem absorbing it, but my T4 is over range, so am working on tweaking my Levo down a bit

[Duckgainz in reply to PixieElv]

I also have such a problem because of work and training, especially because of the other supplements I take. I would take a smaller dose of Levo with ndt, that's my plan.

How many Levo and ndt do you take?

Normally I take 175 mcg Lev before. Thanks for the reply

[PixieElv in reply to Duckgainz]

NDT was a game changer for me. Gentler than T3 but still really powerful.

There’s a conversion chart on here somewhere detailing how by how much you need to reduce your Levo if you start taking NDT. That was helpful to me

[Duckgainz in reply to PixieElv]

I think I will end up taking 2 grains of ndta+ Levo as long as it takes for the results to be good (approx. 100 mcg)

[Sunflower64]

What is important is your free T3. It shows if your body is converting enough T4 to T3. If it does, slightly lowering your levo dose will lower FT4 levels. You should not add T3 only to lower FT4.

Do you have any remaining hypo symptoms? If your T3 levels are suboptimal for you, that is usually the case.

[Duckgainz in reply to Sunflower64]

Hello sunflower, I would like to reduce the doses of Levo that I take, I am quite young in my thirties and I wouldn't want to drink close to 200 mcg of Levo all my life, so I would like to add ndt so that I can lower the dose of Levo . Above on Buddy's post I wrote the numbers for t3 they are ok, the thing is that when it's low I can funcion normally more or less, even though I know it's not good.

Maybe I feel that my OCD is a little worse, but nothing drastic

[Happyfairy09]

Morning Duck, I take levo and NDT first thing, I drink boiled water or fruit tea caffeine free until at least 30mins to an hour after morning dose, I tried to split twice a day but it doesn't work for me, it's judging the timings to take my high strength vit d 4 hrs in between - I generally eat an or 2 after my dose ... But that's me and my routine

[Duckgainz in reply to Happyfairy09]

Thanks for the answer, that's exactly how I would like to take it, but I wasn't sure. Normally, I wait an hour and a half to eat after a dose of Levo. How do you feel on the current dose, how did you work out the levo to ndt ratio?

[Happyfairy09 in reply to Duckgainz]

I'm just out at the moment, I will answer more in depth when home, but generally I go by how I feel and how much I react too to much dosage generally. Post your ft3 ft4 and tsh, not read any other post unsure if you have, do you take and vits ?

[Duckgainz in reply to Happyfairy09]

No problem, I wrote the blood findings .above on Buddy's answer . If you can read it on Buddy's post. The shortd version : on Levo, the numbers are ok for me, but I would like to include ndt because I drink huge doses of levo. And doktor have gave me a too small dose, so bas numbers now. High tsh

[Duckgainz]

First, I would like to thank everyone for their kind words, so I would reply to everyone separately if it is not a problem. I hope not Im new to this.

[Brightness14]

Which NDT are you taking. I have no thyroid and take Thyroid s NDT. This one is slow acting and from Thailand.

You could take your Levo just before bed and then the NDT first thing in the morning.

[Duckgainz in reply to Brightness14]

Thank you for your reply. I take ndt produced by a pharmacy in Croatia on prescription. Good idea for Levo midnight , ndt morning. Will ndt leave the body during the day by evening?

[Brightness14]

Yes I would think so I take it am and pm but yours will have gone by then. I make sure not to take anything food or drink close to the Levo/NDT.

[Duckgainz in reply to Brightness14]

Yes, I like to take together the , The simplest its the least planning BC of Work, maybe some day Split it. Split it in am and pm probablly the best

[Brightness14]

Yes try it and see, good luck.

[SlowDragon Administrator]

So at moment you need higher dose NDT

Typically dose is increased in 1/4 grain

Your results suggest you are going to need several dose increases over coming months

Vitamin levels may drop a bit when hypo and TSH is very high

If you find NDT too expensive you could consider going back on levothyroxine and adding small dose Liothyronine (T3) - available in Greece, if not in Croatia

[Duckgainz in reply to SlowDragon]

Thanks, but I think it's cheaper for me to get Croatian ndt than t3 from Greece. Yes, I will raise the dose, it will take some time, I guess two months, to get used to it, I just have to get the Levo ratio and ndt.

[Duckgainz]

What do you think about the statement that 1 Grain of ndta (60 mcg- approx. 38 t4, 9t3) is Like 75-100 mcg of levothyroxine?