Help with trying to close the gap between FT4/3

[Noelnoel]

I’ve been tweaking Metavive dose and type (bovine and porcine) to try to raise FT4. It’s now at 40% and I’m happy with that because it’s risen from 12% but my FT3 is now 100%, which I don’t want - although I don’t feel over medicated at the moment

Test was done as per protocol and I’d been on this particular dose for about 7 weeks. I also stopped all supplements for a week prior, although I know it’s biotin that can skew results

Ideally I’d like FT3 at around 70% and FT4 at 50-60 but I’m not sure what to do next. I can only tolerate tiny increases which I have to hold for a couple of weeks before further increases, otherwise I quickly feel overmedicated and rather than ride it out until things settle, I prefer to go at a snail’s pace

The reason for wanting to close the gap is to try to reach a better balance to see if I can start shifting some weight. All core nutrients are excellent, temp has risen from 35 something to 36.8, resting pulse from 50s to high 60s, sleeping better and my mood is good

Any insight or suggestions would be welcome from those with experience/some knowledge of Metavive or even if you’re not familiar with i

Photo of FT3 lab report to follow

Thanks all

[Noelnoel]

FT3 lab report

Colour of lab report

[greygoose]

I doubt you're going to be able to do that with Metavive, because you can have no idea of the amount of T4 and T3 you're actually taking.

But, in any case, what's to say that that is what your body actually needs? T4 is basically a storage hormone that doesn't do very much until it is converted into the active hormone, T3. Could be that your body needs more T3 than T4, if you are a poor converter, for example, or if you have some degree of thyroid hormone resistance.

The reason for wanting to close the gap is to try to reach a better balance to see if I can start shifting some weight.

I very much doubt if losing weight has anything to do with balancing the two hormones.

I can only tolerate tiny increases which I have to hold for a couple of weeks before further increases

You shouldn't be increasing in less time than that, anyway. That's not a snail's pace, that's normal.

[Noelnoel in reply to greygoose]

Hello greygoose, thank you for your useful comments, some of which made me think

I doubt you're going to be able to do that with Metavive, because you can have no idea of the amount of T4 and T3 you're actually taking

I’ve been taking it long enough to understand how I react to each strength and by testing regularly, I can gauge and predict with a modicum of accuracy. It’s not foolproof but it’s served as reasonably reliable

But, in any case, what's to say that that is what your body actually needs?

Many people report needing both hormones high. I don’t think I’m one of those because at my current 40% I feel ok but I won’t rest until I’ve experienced it higher (50-60%) and then I’ll see for myself what it does or doesn’t do for me. Trouble is I’m not sure which way to go about it. If I lower porcine, FT3 level will decline but so will FT4. Should I add a little more bovine to counter the FT4 decline??? Oh! I don’t know! Head’s in a muddle. I’m off to have a glass of wine and hopefully forget about it till after the weekend 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫

T4 is basically a storage hormone that doesn't do very much until it is converted into the active hormone, T3

I don’t subscribe to the idea that T4 sits around waiting to be converted. Yes it’s a storage hormone but I don’t believe we know the whole T4 story yet

Could be that your body needs more T3 than T4, if you are a poor converter, for example, or if you have some degree of thyroid hormone resistance

You’re right, it definitely does need more T3 but perhaps at the moment the disparity is too high and I won’t know until I experiment with different levels

Have never taken levo so have no idea whether I’m a poor converter. I recall a time when I was on bovine only (higher ratio T4) and had significant weight loss. Unfortunately it was in the early days when I knew nothing and didn’t attribute it to being on more T4 because I had no idea of the difference between porcine and bovine. I wish I’d kept a journal to refer back to because I have no memory of the timings, frequency or dosage

It’s entirely possible I have a degree of hormone resistance. It’s something I’ve never explored but perhaps need to; that’s for another day

I very much doubt if losing weight has anything to do with balancing the two hormones

I do. A body in equilibrium functions better. However, equilibrium isn’t the same for everyone

You shouldn't be increasing in less time than that, anyway. That's not a snail's pace, that's normal

It most definitely is a snail’s pace. Each Metavive Pro capsule contains 100mg. I weigh out 5mg for each increase. This works out as an increase of one capsule every 20 weeks. Excruciatingly slow but I find Met Pro extraordinarily powerful and anything quicker sends my body into a spin

Now, that glass of red is calling …

[greygoose in reply to Noelnoel]

OK

[Sunflower64]

If you do not feel overmedicated, why worry? After all, lab results show what is in your blood, not in your cells where they exert their metabolic action. Before Levothyroxine and the TSH test, doctors went by symptoms and body temp.

On any kind of T3, my FT4 has been in the lower part of range. I figured I did not need more since I have always been a poor converter. I think T3 lowers T4 and there is no reason to try to raise it if you do not need it.

I think your results are pretty impressive for a glandular😊. Which one do you prefer, porcine or bovine?

[TiggerMe in reply to Sunflower64]

Just catching up on this thread, you won't have been notified that Noelnoel replied to you but didn't press the reply button 🙃

p.s. I'm a poor converter but feel awful if my fT4 drops below 50% even with good fT3 levels... I'm with Noelnoel in believing fT4 is important but don't understand why yet

[Sunflower64 in reply to TiggerMe]

Thanks😉

[Noelnoel]

Hello Sumflower and sorry for the delay

I’m not so much worried as curious about how I’ll be with higher FT4. I know metabolically, things they are a-changing for the better. Temp and pulse are rising, sleep is less disturbed and my “sunny” personality is re-emerging

As I write it occurs to me that I could just continue as is, watch, wait and see. It’s possible that as I stabilise, more change could occur. This is why I love this forum, not only does it provide lots of opinions, suggestions and solutions from members but it enables me to come to my own conclusions and solutions!

You’re right about T3, I’ve had trouble getting FT4 higher whilst on combination replacement and firmly believe that I need it above 50% and I base that on my history

I think your results are pretty impressive for a glandular😊. Which one do you prefer, porcine or bovine?

Yes, lots of members would love those numbers but doesn’t it illustrate beautifully how we all need our levels where we need them and those levels are not the same for everyone

As for my preference, porcine alone raises my FT3 to perfection but leaves FT4 trailing hence I have to combine them. At the moment I’m porcine heavy but have been gradually increasing bovine and lowering porcine

Currently on

Met Pro x 1

Met IV x 2

Split am breakfast and bedtime

[Sunflower64 in reply to Noelnoel]

Ok, that is interesting! It`s always either or, but never about taking both bovine and porcine…I think it is the first time I hear about this approach.

Since pigs produce more T3 and less T4 than humans, it makes sense that adding T4 to NDT can be beneficial for people who don`t feel good with low T4 levels. I read somewhere that cows produce more T4 than humans, so could be an interesting alternative for people who needs mostly T4 and only a little T3. Some people definitely feel better on bovine glandular than porcine.

Would you mind PM`ing me where you order Met Pro? I contacted the seller about this recently but was told it is only available through licensed practitioners.