Hi, I wonder if anyone can advise and apologies in advance for the long story!
I consulted a private Endocrinologist and started taking Liothyronine in early October 1 x 5mg tablet 3 times a day. I was also on 25mg levothyroxine, 4pumps of estrogel, 2 tablets of progesterone and 1/8 pack of testogel. After a week on Liothyronine my heart was racing and my anxiety had increased. I assumed this was my body adjusting.
5/6 weeks in I was due to have a water deprivation test at the hospital requested by the NHS Endocrinologist due to my excessive thirst (4/5 liters daily) I was concerned that this would increase my anxiety and stress my body further so I consulted my private Endocrinologist and we agreed to reduce my Liothyronine to 3 x 1/2 5mg daily. The day after the test my body went into repeated bouts of shock ( trembling, hot cold clammy) I nearly went to A and E but decided with my husband that this would further increase my symptoms.
To cut a long story short I continued with high anxiety, difficulty sleeping etc and so decided along with my private Endocrinologist to have a few days off Liothyronine then try Armour. A few days into the Armour 1/4 tablet 2 x a day my anxiety had peaked again. I am going to now try 1/4 tablet once a day.
My question is should I persevere with the Armour and could the HRT particularly the Testogel be complicating matters?
Also how long does it take for Liothyronine to get into as well as out of the system? ie is the Liothyronine still in my system a week after stopping it ? Does the HRT complicate maters?
I have been chronically ill fo nearly 20 years and after trying every alternative health option as well as NHS options I so desperately want the Armour to work. Has anyone else had a similar experience? Can anyone help?
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Blu-cat11
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Your endo started you on too high a dose. That could have something to do with your anxiety. Normally, one starts on 5 mcg a day for two weeks, and then increases by 5 mcg if all goes well. So, it should take you six weeks to get to 15 mcg.
How much levo were you taking before adding in the T3? 25 mcg is only a tiny dose, so perhaps he reduced it by too much?
Why did he start you on T3, anyway? Did blood tests show you were a poor converter?
Have you had your nutrients tested: vit D, vit B12, folate, ferritin? They all need to be optimal before starting T3 or NDT.
NDT doesn't suit everyone. Personally, I would have gone back to a lower dose of T3 + levo first, and given that time to settle in before going onto NDT. Too much chopping and changing is not going to help anything.
I don’t think the doses you are taking of HRT will be counterproductive (unless your blood levels are over-range) and if anything should will be helping thyroid hormones work correctly.
But I agree with gg regarding starting T3 too much, too quickly as your symptoms sound classic of over-medication. Even with the correct doses all thyroid hormones should be introduced low and slow to allow the body adjustments and when we have been ill for years there may be even more adjusting to do.
Many members like Armour for its slow-giving properties but medicating Levo + T3 offers you more scope for minor adjustments as opposed to the ridge NDT T4: T3 ratio. I overcame this by adding more Levo to my Armour which I found too T3 potent.
Remember all thyroid meds will need optimal iron and nutrients to work well, and if you have Hashi, thyroid meds also need a well controlled autoimmune response. Thirst is a classic symptom of adrenals issues. Have you had electrolytes measured? Also you might benefit from some adrenal supports.
Thank you for your replies, my thyroid results were taken in 2021 and my private Endo wants to retest me after 8 weeks. The cortisol levels are from Sept 2023.
T4 15.5
T3 3.6
TSH 1.9
Vit D 70
Conversion rate is 4.3 we ideally want this to be less than 4
Please note change of midday ref range inline with Pilger et al 2018. Saliva Cortisol - 16:00 - 20:00 * 2.96 <6.94 nmol/L
Saliva Cortisol - Midnight * <1.5 <7.56 nmol
I spoke to the NHS Endo and he gave me the water deprivation tests results. I haven’t got diabetes insipid is, my ADH mobility is 294 (normal/stable) and sodium levels are normal.
I have been taking Ashwaganda once a day ( the previous one I used was by living nutrition 2 x a day) which I assume believe support my adrenal function. Plus a solgar multivitamin and mineral tablet. I have been on Levothyroxine 25 mg for about 8 years but came off it when I stated Armour . My NHS THS level has always been borderline under active. I’m using a vitamin D spray too.
Have you got the ranges for the results? They look on the low side but it depends on the lab ranges... 25mcg of levo is a child's dose are you very petit?
Didn't your Endo do new bloods before starting the new regime?
Add another squirt or 2 of Vit D as it really wants to be 100-150
Cortisol wise it is low apart from midday, has your Endo mentioned anything about supporting your adrenals? Perhaps look into Adrenal cortex
Heads up about Ashwaganda it can lower cortisol as well as raise it so tricky to know how an individual will react
Which Solgar multivit are you taking? Chances are it won't be ideal as it will likely contain iron or iodine
What progesterone are you taking? Hopefully micronised body identical?
4 x pumps of Estradiol gel seems quite excessive. Especially if you have recently started supporting Thyroid function? Thyroid also supports sex hormone production and regulation. So maybe you don’t need such a high dose of Estradiol any more? It’s worth considering, as Estrogen Dominance can also play havoc with the Thyroid and causes many symptoms, one of which is anxiety.
Progesterone is also supportive of the Thyroid function, so I’m sure it will be more about finding a balance between both thyroid and HRT
3.My bloods in Sept’23 hoemogenised so couldn’t be used
4. What is Adrenal cortex. Do you have a recommendation and is this instead of Ashwaganda?
5. Should I reduce Ashwaganda? Stop? I was hoping it was a support to my adrenals.
6. Iron in multi vit is bisglycinate and iodine as potassium iodine. Any alternative Vit/min recommendations
In reply to Franky banx
1. I’m on utrogestrone which I believe is body inentical
2. Menopause specialist put me in 4 pumps Estradiol before I started the liothyronine. I could go down to 2 pumps
In reply to Rad - any thoughts on my cortisol results?
I’m conscious of changing too much too soon and want to keep things as simple as I can so as not to cause any further issues. Sorry for the long feed. Thank you
Additional thought should I try alternating 25 mg levothyroxin one day 1/4 armour the next?
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