Using estrogen and progesterone cyclically or continuously...interested in other people's experiences!

So, I wanted to know if anyone here has gone from using E and P cyclically to using them continuously, and what difference that has made (if any).

I'm asking because I emailed my hormone doctor a few months ago to tell her my periods seemed to have stopped (right after I turned 50 in December), and ask her if that made a difference when it came to the way I took hormones (Estrogel day 5-25 of cycle and Utrogestan 200 mg day 15-25). She told me to use Estrogel (two pumps daily) and Utrogestan 100 mg continuously.

Since making that change, I have the feeling things have been going in the wrong direction - weight gain, bloating, increased sugar cravings, feeling more depressed and moody. TBH, I cannot think of a single benefit so far. I know natural progesterone is often touted as a miracle drug, but I imagine too much at the wrong time can still have side effects...! Too much of a good thing is still too much, right...?! And, just because it's bio-identical and not synthetic does not make it harmless, does it...?

I am seeing my doctor in five weeks, and having labs in three weeks or so so I'll know then where I stand hormone-wise, but the only thing that has changed in recent months that could have such an impact (IMHO) on my health and wellbeing is the way I use E and P...which makes me interested in other people's experiences. I have come to believe that patients' experiences can tell us much more than lab results. And, even if my labs should come back in range, that could still mean I'd feel better using hormones cyclically rather than continuously...another reason I'd be interested in finding out about other people's experiences.

Thanks in advance!

[lamornabuck]

I use natural progesterone cream which has less side effects , I don't think you need to take estrogen bc our bodies still make a bit even after menopause and we usually have enough unless you are really slim , you could get your levels checked

[Hidden in reply to lamornabuck]

Thanks a lot for this input! Is this P cream prescribed by your doctor or available OTC..?

The more I read and experience, the more I realise this is not simply about replacing estrogen and progesterone...I have read a lot about women remaining estrogen dominant throughout their lives, due to the ability of the body to produce estrogen from fat tissue etc...but, then again, there are anti-aging docs saying anyone over 50 needs both hormones...but I appreciate your input as I have considered going off E and trying topical P just to see if it makes a difference, one way or the other...since I am far from slim (in fact, the very opposite), I do not need to take any hormone that makes me gain even more weight...!

[lamornabuck in reply to Hidden]

I buy my progesterone cream from ebay I use the brand Biovea , it has instructions on it how to use it, I have been having insomnia and it has helped me sleep

[Naomi8 in reply to lamornabuck]

Do you test periodically?I have been using natural progesterone with breaks since peri-menopause(now 69)just done my first hormone balance test after stopping the progesterone for 3 months.my oestrogen is normal for post-menopause.As I expected,my progesterone is as high as the test calibrates.

[Hidden in reply to Naomi8]

I'm only tested once a year.

[lamornabuck in reply to Naomi8]

I read recently that progesterone can build up in fat tissue so best not to have too much

I also use the Peruvian dried fruit aguaje it apparently contains a precursor to progesterone

[Hidden in reply to lamornabuck]

OK, thanks! I think it's not optimal to be tested once a year but I only see my hormone doctor once a year so that's when I have labs. I think about E and P can build up in fat tissue over time so I really need to see what my levels look like.

[Naomi8 in reply to Hidden]

I bought a saliva test via Amazon by the German lab Versiana.I wanted to check for oestrogen dominance.

[Hidden in reply to Naomi8]

I just ordered a cortisol test from them. I should probably follow-up with sex hormones as well. What did your results show?

[Naomi8 in reply to Hidden]

see my reply to lamornabuck earlier in this thread

[Hidden in reply to Naomi8]

So does this mean you have/had too much progesterone?

[Naomi8 in reply to Hidden]

I have been taking progesterone to balance oestrogen dominance.(10 years after the menopause,a gynae still wanted to perform removal surgery)Reading "Tired Thyroid's"personal experience of natural hormone use is interesting.

I'm not thinking of starting to use it again at the moment.But its difficult to find unbiased advice,as opinion falls into either the pro or anti camp.

[Hidden in reply to Naomi8]

That's true! It that sense, it's a lot like NDT - either pro or con. I just bought the book "Tired thyroid" and look forward to reading it.

[Naomi8 in reply to Hidden]

Sorry I should have written fibroid surgery removal!

[jgelliss]

You might want to be cautious with progesterone it may cause Levothyroxine levels to go up .

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/232...

bioadaptivemedicine.com/new...

[Hidden in reply to jgelliss]

Interesting! I have had hyper symptoms for quite some time and have had to literally halve my NDT dose. Never suspected progesterone could have something to do with it so thanks for the links!

[magsyh in reply to Hidden]

I have been using progesterone cream daily on low dose of 15-20mg per day for almost 2 years. I used it on and off for quite a few years before that. I've just gone through menopause at 61. Never had a hot flush or any other symptoms. I still produce too much estrogen so use the progesterone to keep it in check. The reason progesterone boosts T4 only slightly is the fact that it boosts cortisol. Another reason I have to use it because I have low cortisol especially in the morning and the progesterone boosts it and keeps me floating. Be careful of saliva progesterone tests I had one done earlier this year and it scared the hell out of me my p to E2 ratio was 1000:1 a blood test was only 8:1 I tried utrogestan but it was too strong for me made me feel too much progesterone but if you are not yet menopausal you may still need the higher dose. Thyroid hormone can't be made without progesterone and progesterone can't be made without thyroid hormone so it all catch 22 and down to getting the balance right.

[Hidden in reply to magsyh]

Yes, I see what you mean! It's never easy, is it...? Anyway, I guess weight gain is more a symptom of high estrogen than progesterone...I will forget about the sex hormone saliva test for the time being and see what my blood levels say.

I think there is a tendency among many doctors to prescribe estrogen unnecessarily...alternative practitioners say that estrogen will continue to be produced even post-menopause and that estrogen dominance is very common and often misdiagnosed as estrogen deficiency...however, very few mainstream doctors seem to consider that.

I guess the best way to know if I should be on estrogen or not is to look at the E/P ratio.

If progesterone alone would prevent hot flushes (my most bothersome symptom at present) I'd gladly give up estrogen, especially since I have a tendency to put on weight easily (and always have, even before I developed hypo).

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

PS. I'm seeing a so called Hertoghe doctor in Belgium (trained by Thierry Hertoghe). When I first saw her, eight years ago, she told me "Since you are over 40, you'll need estrogen" (I was 42 at the time and having regular periods). Back then, I considered myself pretty knowledgeable about thyroid-related matters, but knew very little about sex hormones and how they can wreak havoc on the whole endocrine system if unbalanced (and that includes too much as well as too little). Knowing what I know now, I am not sure I would have been so quick to start estrogen replacement therapy in the first place...it seems estrogen levels won't drop noticeably until after a woman's last period, and even then the body can still produce estrogen from fat tissue. So, looking back, it's more likely that I was progesterone deficient or estrogen dominant back then (really two sides of the same coin, right?), and did not need estrogen at all.

I used to tell myself that bio-identical hormones were better than synthetic ones and although that might be true (if you really need them), I no longer think you should take even bio-identical hormones if you don't need them...and, the more I read about estrogen and progesterone, the more I get the impression that the former is often present in abundance even after menopause, and that estrogen therapy may be the reason so many women continue to have strange symptoms doctors cannot really explain...so they just keep prescribing more and more estrogen. When I was put on estrogen eight years ago, I did not have a single symptom of menopause - no hot flushes, no trouble sleeping, nothing. So, looking back, and knowing how these anti-aging doctors work, I suspect the aim was to restore my hormone levels to those of a healthy 25-year-old, and not to treat my symptoms...because I did not have any at the time. And now, in retrospect, I am not sure that was such a good idea. At the very least, I wish I had read more about sex hormones and their possible side effects but, then again, isn't that why you pay a fortune to see a hormone doctor...because that person is supposed to know more about hormone replace therapy than you do?!

I can only hope I can sort this out...when my labs are available, I'll post them here and ask for comments.

[magsyh in reply to Hidden]

Yes that's what I had to do. I got blood tests myself and calculated the ratio. I always refused estrogen as the tests proved I already had too much but docs insisted it was what they were taught and the only way forward so I said no. Glad I did. It's a very fine balance. Post your results and hopefully will get a better picture.

[Hidden in reply to magsyh]

Will do, thanks!

[Hidden in reply to magsyh]

This just landed in my mailbox...pretty interesting info, and I've been having most of the symptoms indicative of estrogen dominance, including ovarian cysts that won't go away:

thyroidpharmacist.com/artic...

I now realise that just because I use bio-identical, rather than synthetic, estrogen it does not mean it won't have side effects...no doctor I've ever seen has used an estrogen/progesterone ratio. The anti-aging doctors seem more interested in restoring your levels to youthful ones, which I am not at all interested in. It will be very interesting to see what my E/P ratio is. My doctor has also ordered a testosterone test, along with DHEA, SHBG, prolactin, and androstanediol gluc (I don't even know what the last two are!)