I eat about one cup of raw kale in a plant based organic protein shake. I've been doing it for quite a while. Would that effect THS levels / thyroid?
Raw Kale. How much is too much?: I eat about one... - Thyroid UK
Raw Kale. How much is too much?
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bessygo
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🤢 sounds grim !
I very much doubt it. 
Hiya.
I've been trying to find scientific papers on this as I'd be interested to know myself. Personally, I don't use any raw greens in my smoothies any more after doing so for many years (mainly spinach and kale). I'm convinced that they had an adverse effect on my health because of the oxalic acid they contain.
From one paper:
"Oxalic acid is found in leafy green veggies like kale, spinach, collards, chard and parsley. It acts as a defense mechanism for plants – thwarting attacks by hungry bugs. This compound also has some unhealthy effects on humans.
During digestion, oxalic acid binds to calcium – making it unusable by the body. It can also form crystals that get lodged in muscles or extremities (as is the case with gout). And if oxalic acid crystals form in the kidneys, painful kidney stones can develop.
But a little heat can fix all of this. In fact, according to a recent study published in Agricultural Food Chemistry, lightly steaming (and draining) veggies that are high in oxalic acid can significantly reduce this problematic substance."
One paper that I've found recommends raw cruciferous veg for hyperthyroidism and Graves disease, saying: "all have constituents causing a mild thyrostatic effect by reducing iodine uptake". So, probably not great for hypo.
and another "Compounds called goitrogens found in cruciferous veggies (like broccoli, kale, Brussels sprouts, kohlrabi, cauliflower) have been found to have detrimental effects on the thyroid.
Goitrogens block the body’s manufacture of thyroid hormones. They also hamper iodine metabolism, reducing thyroid function. And because the thyroid is the “master of your metabolism”, this means a raw diet may actually increase the risk of weight gain and other hormonal problems for some people."
Hope those help
One paper that I've found recommends raw cruciferous veg for hyperthyroidism and Graves disease, saying: "all have constituents causing a mild thyrostatic effect by reducing iodine uptake". So, probably not great for hypo.
But, if you're taking thyroid hormone replacement, this really wouldn't matter. The thyroid doesn't need as much iodine, and you're getting extra iodine in your thyroid hormone replacement, anyway. Also, you would have to consume a hell of a lot of goitrogens, anyway, for it to have any effect. You probably eat goitrogens on a daily basis without even knowing they are goitrogens: onions and garlic, strawberries and pears, almonds and walnuts, etc.
But it's wrong to say that they 'block' the manufacture of thyroid hormone. They do impede the uptake of iodine by the thyroid, but that's not the same as blocking the manufacturing process.
The only goitrogen you should avoid is soy, and then not so much because it's a goitrogen but because it's has a secondary impact at a cellular level. It impedes the uptake of thyroid hormone by the cells.
I've kind-of replied below to MaisieGray. The difference for me between the foods you list and raw kale are the oxalic acid it contains and the simple fact that cooking it makes it so much easier for the body to digest. There are many studies linking certain goitrogens, usually cruciferous vegetables, and impaired thyroid function. In my opinion, it's just not worth the risk when it takes a few minutes to chuck it in a steamer.
Yes, I know about the oxalic acid, but I was addressing the goitrogen aspect. And, there are many studies showing that they're not linked. Or, that you would have to ingest an unimaginable amount before the effect had any impact on the thyroid.
If you think it's not worth the risk, fine. But steamed kale would be pretty awful in a smoothie, I think. So, for those that want raw cruciferous veg, I don't think there's any harm in having a little in their breakfast. If they're already hypo and on thyroid hormone replacement, what sort of risk could there be?
It's no different than having raw kale, I just let it cool down first.
What I'm getting at is.... how do you know that there's no harm?
Or that peoples levels etc. wouldn't be different without it? You can't possibly say either way, as there are studies supported both opinions. Yes, most people will be on meds but don't you think that eating well should be our first port of call? In the article posted below Izabella Wentz says "Even in the case that a person does have hypothyroidism due to iodine deficiency, he/she can still enjoy crucifers as long as they are cooked or fermented, as they are only truly goitrogenic and affect the thyroid’s absorption of iodine in a raw state. Cooking or lightly steaming them will deactivate and break down the iodine-blocking glucosinolates, as will fermenting the vegetables (as in sauerkraut)." Yes, that's only for certain people, and she doesn't actually address cooking elsewhere in the article, so maybe you're right and they're fine.
Well, all I can say is that I've read both sides of the argument, and I come down in favour of the argument that once you are on thyroid hormone replacement, they can't do you any harm, and even if they were capable of doing so, you'd have to eat a hell of a lot of them, much more than the average human being would find desirable - or even possible. That side, to me, is the most convincing.
What about Izabellas comment in her article? Would you say the same for gluten? Surely there are different strengths of medication and you can affect your hormone/iodine levels? I'm not on thyroid hormone replacement any more, so I'd be interested to hear if there is any evidence that it is like an 'on/off switch' rather than a sliding scale.
Sorry, I have no idea what you're talking about there, nor the relevance to goitrogens and kale. Probably best we end this discussion, now.
Senorita_Squiffy I have been a non-meat eater for 50 yrs and hypothyroid for 40, so have eaten one or two 'goitrogens' over the years - yet during the first 30 years was perfectly well and probably healthier than many of my friends who didn't have thyroid disease. When diagnosed, my startpoint was that I had "one foot in the grave" according to my Endo yet recovered healthy hormone levels with treatment despite never limiting any food excepting animal flesh of course. So whilst we are each individual in such matters, I think that's a pretty substantial countermanding of the absolute and often outdated scaremongering that perpetuates around goitrogens.
For instance, cruciferous mustard meal and rapeseed meal in animal feed both have the possibility to interfere with thyroid function, but studies on pigs for example showed that the unwanted thyroid effects did not arise so long as the pigs did not consume more than 4 ounces of rapeseed or mustard seed meal per kilogram of body weight per day. It was extrapolated from that, that a person weighing 70 kilograms would have to eat about 17 pounds of it per day, before it interfered with thyroid function, which presumably no one would ever do. It is the glucosinolates in those cruciferous plants that have the antithyroid effect of preventing the absorption of iodine into the thyroid gland when consumed in large quantities, and there are many studies looking at the effect of glucosinolates in fresh vegetables, that show that on average, a half-cup serving of cruciferous vegetables will have around 100milligrams of total glucosinolates, which amount is several hundred times smaller than the amount of total glucosinolates in animal feed that have been shown to interfere with thyroid function. Much of the repeated lore about goitrogens originates from 60 yr old poor science, and as Izabella Wentz describes, different goitrogens are in any case different in their antithyroid effects - scroll down to see her chart here thyroidpharmacist.com/artic...
Ok, so. I get all of my data through Google Scholar, they are from scientific papers and they are all recent. I'm a student of biology, chemistry and soon to start a degree in nutrition at KCL. Studies on animals and in vitro are basically the lowest forms of studies. I know pigs are very similar to humans in many ways, but we are not the same. Personally, I hardly eat pork because of the diet that the pigs are fed and buy all my other meat grass-fed. This is a much healthier option and much better for the environment too.
I'm not advocating cutting out these vegetables, just making sure that they (at least lightly) cooked before ingesting.
I really don't understand the logic of "oh well, I'm taking medication, so I'm not going to bother using diet or herbs to give my body the best possible chance to heal" Where's the sense in putting it under unnecessary stress? Would you eat raw broccoli? or raw brussel sprouts? or even raw kale if it wasn't blended into a smoothie?! no, probably not. Read Michael Pollans book 'Cooked'. It explains the reasons why cooking our food has helped human evolution because we can more easily digest, absorb certain nutrients and now don't have to spend 12 hours a day chewing like a gorila does.
At I mentioned in my post, the reason that I stopped eating raw spinach and kale was because of the oxalic acid, not because of any gointrogenic properties. You say you "recovered healthy hormone levels with treatment", by which I'm assuming you mean medication? So how can you measure what your health would have been like without it? How can you tell that eating raw kale (or not) didn't make any difference?
If you scroll down in the article you have posted Isabella says "as they are only truly goitrogenic and affect the thyroid’s absorption of iodine in a raw state". I'm just not willing to risk it!
Would you eat raw broccoli? or raw brussel sprouts?
Yes. I have done, and wouldn't hesitate to do so again in certain recipes. Do you steam your strawberries?
And, I really don't think that eating goitrogens is going to stop your thyroid 'healing'. It isn't going to 'heal' whatever you do. If you are hypo and taking thyroid hormone replacement, that takes the thyroid gland out of the equation. So, it doesn't matter that the thyroid can't uptake iodine - it probably couldn't use that iodine, anyway. So, what difference does it make?
As I've mentioned above, the studies are only looking at cruciferous vegetables and there are several other factors involved in why I choose not to eat them raw. Strawberries are evolutionarily designed to be eaten, that's why they're sweet, so that animals will eat them and spread the seeds in their faeces. It doesn't work to compare the two things. So, if you can't help support thyroid function with diet, why bother cutting out gluten or junk food or anything else? Have you heard of epigenetics? It sounds as though you're saying that medication is the 'be all and end all', which I don't believe to be true.
Oh, believe me, I'm not saying that at all! Have you actually read any of my posts? What I'm saying is that by the time you get to the point where you need thyroid hormone replacement, your thyroid is beyond support or help from food. I don't consider thyroid hormone replacement to be 'medication', anyway.
Nope, sorry, I haven't read any of your posts. I don't spend much of my time on forums. Too busy studying!
Well, don't forget to read the modern papers on Thyroid in Frontiers in Endocrinology instead of a lot of the out of date stuff. And read Dr Tania Smith's critique of Poli.
I'll check them out. Thank you
How can the thyroid or any other chronic illness ever be "beyond support or help from food"? What we put in our mouths on a daily basis makes up who we are.
A dead horse is still a dead horse, no matter what you put in its mouth.
Woooooow! What a way to view things. I feel sad for you
If your thyroid has been destroyed that's that. And most people don't get diagnosed - in this country at least - until that has happened. And it is doubtful that the thyroid regenerates in except in a few exceptional cases after ablation and then the new tissue doesn't seem to work correctly. In the days of all herbal medicine and dietary interventions, people with underactive thyroids just went mad and died. Without replacement hormone, that would still happen today. Yes, it would take years for most people and you'd have dementia so you wouldn't really notice, but you'd die before your time. So young; so optimistic!
I'm not against thyroid medication, just to make that clear! I'm not advocating people try to treat hypothyroidism with just food and herbs. There is clearly something wrong if people are getting to that stage without adequate treatment and that is an issue that the government and NHS will, at some point, have to tackle. The subject of thyroid disease is not one that I am massively knowledgeable about, I'll leave that to the others on here. I caught mine quite early and was actually taken off medication (being told I didn't need it) and have fairly successfully managed it so far by eating well and taking supplements. Mine is linked to a hereditary connective tissue condition called hEDS and I have a whole load of symptoms, so it takes a lot of work to stay prescription drug free, but I feel that it is very much worth it. It's interesting that the original poster has only asked about whether raw kale has an effect on tsh and thyroid function. They haven't said how serious their condition is, so why should we assume that their thyroid is "destroyed"? There may be a lot of people that read these posts that aren't yet at that stage.
Well, autoimmune thyroid disease gradually destroys the thyroid. In the UK, TSH has to be over 10 for diagnosis (and they want to make it 20), so you'd probably have little thyroid tissue left by then, and be well past the stage when supplements and diet were enough. Also, if you have autoimmune thyroid disease, you have periods when you feel hypo, some where you feel hyper and some where you feel OK. I wonder how many people who have "cured" their hypo are still cured in 10 years. Could be possible in a country where you can be diagnosed when TSH is 3.
I agree entirely with you grey goose. I have been taking thyroid replacement for over 55 years. I eat goitrogens as part of a balanced diet, I always have done. This includes raw brussels sprouts! My mother used them in salads. I am still waiting for the problems they cause I am now 68.
I get so fed up with being told people suddenly can’t eat foods because of thyroid issues.
Thank you for the link to that article MaisieGray.
I thought I was being healthy eating 2 cups of raw kale in my smoothie and a tablespoon of dulse. After reading that article I now realize I could be doing damage and making my hypothyroidism worse. Who would of thought eating healthy could be bad for you.
dbrowning02 Oh no no no, please don't infer that from reading the link! 
The chart tells you how each of the types of goitrogen may affect you, but that should not be taken as they are to be avoided. The cruciferous vegetables for instance are a very beneficial and nutritious part of a balanced diet, not least for instance, for their protective properties against cancer. As it says immediately above the chart "Another reassuring fact to note is that you’d have to eat a lot of them for the goitrogenic effect to be a concern. Thus, eating cruciferous vegetables (unless a person is otherwise sensitive to them) is perfectly healthy for people with Hashimoto’s and should not impact thyroid function."
My functional dr. told me to not eat raw kale at least every day. I was only throwing in one cup of it into a shake. I have been doing it a while, my TSH levels were better about a year ago but have been eating the raw kale for at least that long. Now I am steaming and blanching it and freezing it and using raw spinach instead. She said it definitely affected thyroid function if too much is taken.
I think 2 cups a day 5 days a week probably is way too much, going to start steaming and freezing is a good idea.
I was going to start steaming the kale for 8mins and Dulse maybe do more research.
I don't like kale, but I eat a lots of other brassicas and they don't seem to make me any worse. I also like dulse and other sea veg.
Hi Bessygo. Are you in California? Just curious since my brother (English) will not eat a meal if I put as much as half a lettuce leaf on it. I think he would never come and visit me again if I even uttered the word Kale. Kale is the latest craze here in California but as an ex-pat I have graduated to eating a salad (and love many of them) but Kale is pushing it a bit.
Nope....NYer now live in the sad state of Florida. I throw raw organic washed kale (packaged at Whole Foods and other groceries) into a berry flavored plant based organic protein shake but am cutting down on that. You can't even taste the kale. I also throw in some organic blueberries or cantalope, a few carrots, and ginger. Fresh baby kale leaves are delicious in Kale Caesar Salads I have had in restaurants. Kale has been a craze throughout the US for a long time, but it may have started in California. Peace out.
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