B12 /folate supplementation confusion

[Saggyuk]

Hey guys, I know you advised me here:

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

but I'm still a little confused lol!

Okay so I found the Solgar, Sublingual Methylcobalamin, 5000 mcg nuggets but I did notice a few mention problems with teeth enamel which I can't afford to mess with. can you get the spray in same strength as would prefer it quicker than sucking for ages??

You also mentioned needing a good b complex to balance b12 with methylfolate being better than folic acid, but what is a good one?? Do you mean on top of the single B12 or is there one altogether?? Can't seem to find one with methylfolate?

I'm also going to get a Vit D3 - I've had 3200 capsules prescribed before but would a spray or sublingual one also be better? I can prob feel comfortable enough with this one to just order anything lol!

Anything else I need to think of?

Basically I'm getting confused as to all the hundreds available and all the different types and my heads too fuzzy to think and need to finally order them as head getting so fuzzy, I need to see if these will help lol - if that makes any sense

I know you may feel uncomfortable instructing a specific one but I've never looked at supplements before in any great detail and all these words and names are making the job impossible.

Would be greatful for any more direct intervention lol

[whispers60]

Can only answer one of your questions there lol, you don't have to suck for ages, I use subli gual, its a tiny tablet and I pop it under my tongue and its gone in seconds

[Learner1]

I trust Thorne, Designs for Health, and Seeking Health brands. They use the most bioavailable versions of vitamins, minerals, etc.

I have unfortunately found contamination and allergens in most other brands. Not everything, but it's worthwhile to do some research.

For B12, there's also a B12 oil you can put on your skin, which comes from New Zealand.

Methylcobalamin is the best B12 for most people to start with Adenosylcobalamin is great, too. Don't buy cyanocobalamin.

5-MTHF or methyltetrahydrafolate is the best folate. Do not buy folic acid, which can build up to toxic levels in some people.

You can't really overdose on B12, so start with that and if you start to feel depressed or edgy, that's when you'd add the folate. Try around 400mcg and see if it helps, then try 800; 1g, 1.5g and see if you feel normal. You CAN take too much folate so best to get it right.

You may also need cofactors that work with them. Take a B Complex , magnesium and make sure you're eating about 1-1.5g/kg of protein.

If you want to learn more, Google Ben Lynch or Amy Yasko and methylation. Both have good info on the subject.

[Saggyuk in reply to Learner1]

Thank you, will try and have a better look. okay, I might leave the folate for a little while first then as this is the only one that's ever so slowly creeping up on it's own accord so maybe don't need so much of that.

[Learner1 in reply to Saggyuk]

Sounds like a good plan to start. However, as your methionine cycle starts moving faster with more B12, you may use up any extra folate and start to need more of it.

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Saggyuk Why would sublingual methylcobalamin lozenges affect tooth enamel? Acid based foods and supplements can affect tooth enamel. Sublingual means under the tongue. The tiny Solgar lozenges dissolve under the tongue in about 40 seconds and they are nowhere near your teeth.

A good B Complex is Thorne Basic B and it contains methylfolate and yes, it is in addition to the sublingual methylcobalamin lozenges. The amount of B12 in a B Complex isn't enough to raise a low B12 level and any B12 swallowed is destroyed by stomach acid as I said in reply to your previous thread.

What is your current Vit D level? You need to take a dose appropriate to your level as excess will get stored rather than excreted. Important co-factors are required when taking D3. If you post your Vit D level I can recommend a combo supplement if you don't need a large dose, or separate supplements if you do.

[Saggyuk in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thank you, okay so methycobalamin and a good b complex, will check the thorne basic b. I did remember what you had previously said about not taking the ones you swallow, just got confused after that as there's so many different ones. I am really sorry if I sound crazy or ignorant but I am really struggling to keep new words I've never used before in my head for more than a second as still having memory issues so all these methyl/cobaly/tetraish thingys are just flying straight back out again and I end up no where once on amazon lol! THank you again lol!

[Saggyuk]

Hi guys, yeah sorry, I thought they were supposed to dissappear very quickly too but there were so many reviews on amazon of the jarrow and solgar sublingual ones stating that they took nearly an hour to dissolve or didn't dissolve and a few mentioning ruined there tooth enamel because of it possibly which made me worry and there were so many brands and each brand had so many slightly different ones, I got my brain in a tiz and just gave up lol!!

My last vit d test was 51 but that was a couple of months ago but haven't had any sun since lol!

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Saggyuk]

I can recommend the Solgar methylcobalamin lozenges for dissolving without problems. I've not tried the Jarrow ones.

With your Vit D level at 51, if that is nmol/L then you should take 5000iu daily throughout the winter then test on the Spring. If you've reached the recommended level of 100-150nmol/L you can reduce to 5000iu alternate days as a maintenance dose.

A good combo supplement is amazon.co.uk/Thorne-Researc... - 10 drops will give 5000iu D3 and 1mg K2 in MK4 form or this one which has K2 in MK7 form and you need 15 drops for 5000iu D3 amazon.co.uk/d/4f2/Nutri-Ad...

Single supplements I would suggest this D3 amazon.co.uk/Doctors-Best-V... and this K2 amazon.co.uk/Vitamin-MK-7-N... . Both of these have minimal ingredients so no unwanted excipients.

D3 and K2 are fat soluble so should be taken with the fattiest meal of the day. Take D3 4 hours away from thyroid meds.

You will also need magnesium as it is another important co-factor of Vit D. Check here to see which will suit you and take in the evening as it's calming naturalnews.com/046401_magn...

[Saggyuk in reply to SeasideSusie]

bless you thank you so much, I don't normally have such difficulties lol!

Okay, the only solgar ones I can find on amazon are called nuggets not lozenges, can I assume these are the same?

Most will be taken in evening anyway along with iron as I take my thyroid meds three times a day so tricky during the day. I will try and take everything else first and leave as long as possible before taking the iron just before bed.

So will bring my last thyroid med forwards a bit to 5pm, the D3 and magnesium at 9pm with something extra fatty to eat and iron and vit c at 11-12 prob sounds best as stomach can't handle iron without vit c soluble drink anyway for some strange reason lol!

I can check myself if they're all gluten free, I can at least can do this lol.

So many thanks :o)

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Saggyuk]

You're welcome. Don't worry, we all have foggy brains at times

Yes, Solgar nuggets, they're the ones.

Most will be taken in evening anyway along with iron as I take my thyroid meds three times a day so tricky during the day. I will try and take everything else first and leave as long as possible before taking the iron just before bed.

D3 and magnesium at 9pm with something extra fatty to eat and iron and vit c at 11-12

You need to leave as long as possible between your other supplements and iron (except for Vit C). Ideally four hours but I can see that's not possible. One hour isn't enough, I would aim for minimum 2 hours and longer if you can.

As for the fat with Vit D, I would have a full fat yogurt. If you get the soft gels then they already contain oil so some fat there. And the Thorne drops contain oil.

B vits tend to be stimulating, so if you can take your B12 and B Complex before lunch that would be best, you don't want them keeping you awake. You can try in the evening, if it doesn't affect you then fine.

Don't start them all at once. Start with one, give it a week or two, if no reaction add the next one, give it a week or two, if no reaction then add the next, etc. That way if you do have an adverse reaction you'll know what caused it.

[Saggyuk in reply to SeasideSusie]

Okay, thank you so much so I will take b12 and bs with lunch an hour after thyroid meds. Then Vit D and magnesium at 9pm with a yoghurt (always have full fat anyway lol) and then iron and vit c at 12pm as often go to bed at midnight anyway so that's 3 hours. It's so complicated with T3 hey lol!

I might start with vit D and b12 as feel I really need both at the mo and I've had various vit ds before, If I react first night, I will go back to just one and figure which is making me react - this will be easy for me anyway as break out in blisters an hour after cc gluten. Then I will start the b complex a week or so later and then magnesium last

I will leave the folate for some time and maybe retest and see how that's acually going before supplementing. If it continues to rise, I will leave be x

[Saggyuk in reply to SeasideSusie]

Okay, thanks so much for your help. I ordered the Thorne Vit D and K2 drops and basic b complex and the solgar B12. I'm a little stuck still on the magnesium. I had a read through the article you posted about the different types. I don't really want to try the magnesium citrate especially while on iron supplements for obvious reasons but wanted to try the malate but tried to find one at okay price but most stated had magnesium stearate in which was mentioned above to avoid. Does anyone know a good one or next best option after citrate?

Thanks again - just cleared my bank account lol

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Saggyuk]

I know the feeling, but honestly it is money well spent on decent brands.

A very quick search ('cos I need my bed )

Magnesium malate with no other ingredients amazon.co.uk/Magnesium-Mala...

Citrate/malate combo, no stearate amazon.co.uk/Thorne-Researc...

Also, look at magnesium oil, maybe ionic magnesium - I haven't looked at what's in them so not a recommendation, more a suggestion to look into it.

[Saggyuk in reply to SeasideSusie]

Okay thanks again, you're a star

[Saggyuk in reply to Saggyuk]

Ooops, I had the seen the thorne one but thought it was just citrate and hadn't realised was a combo lol!

[whispers60 in reply to Saggyuk]

if thats the case then they aren't using sublingual tablets, its not likely something that is supposed to dissolve under the tongue would take that long surely?

[Saggyuk]

Okay, gothcha, so oil based capsule with no magnesium stearate. THank you :o)