Blood Test ft3 ft4 TSH - Round 2

[niclassutter]

Hi everybody.

i got many responses for my last post, that's why i wanted to thank this community once again.

Now i have again a question:

Because of my last blood test i decided to medicate myself with T3 as suggested from many users. But then i thought about it again, it didn't feel right because i am still young and i can't believe, that my thyroid is shutting down and i have to fix it with medication.

How ever i stopped my medication with hoping that my thyroid will work well again.

i tried to fix my lifestyle that could decrease my own t3 production like less sleep etc.

Last week i tested my blood again:

ft3 has the same value as the last blood test.

ft4 is a bit less then last time

TSH has increased a lot.

I don't know how interpret my TSH value. My thoughts :

- I stopped t3 medication, that means my body has to build t3 by itself again.

For this reason my TSH has increased. - increased TSH means , my body wants to build more t3

- On the other side it doesn't make any sense, because my ft3 level has reached the same value as before the medication. So my body shouldn't have the need to build much more ft3. Because it is used to 4.3 pmol/l.

Why has TSH increased this much ?

Can that be, that the external medication and changing my lifestyle could have set a new ideal t3-level?

What do you think, are there any explanation for increased TSH even tough ft3 and ft4 hasn't changed?

I would be very glad, if you guys could help me.

And this are my results from last time :

fT4: 12.8 pmol/l. Reference : 10-28.0 pmol/l

fT3 : 4.3 pmol/l. Reference : 3.0 -9.5 pmol/l

TSH: 2.096 mU/l Reference : 0.1 - 4.0 mU/l

Recent test results:

fT4: 12.4 pmol/l. Reference : 10-28.0 pmol/l

fT3 : 4.3 pmol/l. Reference : 3.0 -9.5 pmol/l

TSH: 4.759 mU/l Reference : 0.1 - 4.0 mU/l -> has increased !! last time 2.096 mU/l !!!!

Additional info :

- I tested antibodies with the first blood test and they were normal, thats why i didn't test it again.

- As i medicated myself i started with 25 mcg and went to 75 mcg .As i stopped i reduced 25mcg every 4 day.

[greygoose]

I'm not sure I can give a satisfactory answer to your question, but I do feel you should have learnt a lot more about thyroid before starting to self-treat.

Age has absolutely nothing to do with thyroid disfunction. I've been hypo since I was a child. Some people are born with it. And, by taking T3, you are not 'fixing' your thyroid with 'medication'. What you are doing it replacing the hormone your gland can no-longer make, with synthetic hormone (not a 'medication' because it doesn't 'fix' anything).

You don't say how much T3 you were taking - nor why you chose T3 over levo, to start with - but it was sheer folly to just stop it like that. And, you obviously weren't taking enough, because at 4.3 pmol/l. Reference : 3.0 -9.5 pmol/l, you were very under-medicated. Your FT3 was a long way off mid-range even (are you sure about that range? it's rather broad). And, your TSH was too high at 2.096. So, I cannot imagine why you decided to stop the T3. Were both tests done at the same time of day? And your body does need more T3, even if it is 'used to' that level. That's not how it works.

So, I would suggest you go back onto the T3, but at the same time, do some reading about the workings of the thyroid, thyroid hormone and thyroid hormone replacement. You're going to make yourself very ill if you mess around with it like that.

[niclassutter in reply to greygoose]

Hi greygoose, thank you for your reply.

- The range was given by the lab.

- The first blood test was at 10 am and the second at 12 am

- The second blood tests was done after having stopped the medication for 2 weeks.

- As i medicated myself i started with 25 mcg and went to 75 mcg .As i stopped i reduced 25mcg every 4 day.

I send my result of my first blood test to a doctor, who should be a specialist regarding thyroid. But he didn't want to treat me, because in his eyes those values are in the range. He said, TSH changes very slowly. And ft3 and ft4 changes as well during a day.

And i am a bit afraid to order T3 from the internet. When the customs catches me i will be in trouble. One more reason to stop the medication was, that my t3 depot was going out of stock. And i wanted to cut it back slowly.

[greygoose in reply to niclassutter]

Well, I can understand why the doctor didn't want to treat you, based on the first test. Although a TSH of over 2 does suggest your gland was struggling.

But, had you done the test at 8 am, and fasting, the TSH would have been higher. TSH may react slowly to changes in hormone serum levels, but it does vary throughout the day, being highest early in the morning. So, his argument isn't 100% sound. Actually, I'm not even sure that T4 does change during the day, although T3 does.

Did/do you have symptoms of hypo? Which ones?

Did you ever have your antibodies tested? Because now, your TSH does say that you're hypo - although a doctor probably wouldn't accept that. But, if you have antibodies, they should agree to treat you.

I think part of your problem is that you started the T3 too high. A quarter tablet would have been more appropriate. And, you increased too fast. It should have been a quarter tablet every 2 weeks. You also decreased too fast. You could have confused your pituitary.

I think the best thing you can do is just keep an eye on things. Get another test in three months time, see how things have evolved. Might also be an idea to get your B12 tested, because if that is low, it will cause hypo-like symptoms.

[Learner1]

A simple explanation...

TSH is made by your pituitary gland when it senses you need more active thyroid hormone, or T3. Basically, it shouts at your thyroid gland "Make more!"

Given what you've described, are you making more? Is all that shouting helping?

So, you can choose to not analyze why and just take some T3 to compensate. But as you've astutely pointed out, this may not be the best plan.

A few questions are in order.

You seem to be making some T4, the inactive thyroid hormone, an in between step, before making T3. And you have some T3. However, you don't have enough of either. What's going wrong?

Do you have enough selenium and zinc for the conversion?

Instead of making T3, is most of your T4 going to make reverse T3 instead, which can happen when your body is stressed? rT3 is useless to you, do this is not good.

Do you have thyroid antibodies, which attack your thyroid gland?

I don't know the answers to these. But may bet your doctor can help you figure out what's going on.

Or you can try taking a little T3 and see if you feel better.

You might also try a gluten free diet, which would help if you had the antibody situation, called Hashimotos.

Good luck!

[niclassutter in reply to Learner1]

Hi Learner1 , thank you for your reply.

- In the first blood test my antibodies were ok, thats why i didn't test it again.

[marsaday]

Where are you in the world. I would like to be a thyroid patient in your country with such high reference ranges.

28 for ft4 and 9.5 for ft3 PLUS a minimum tsh of 0.1.

This means you get to take more thyroid meds basically because the upper limits are higher, so much more likely thyroid patients in your country get treated properly.

I think the tsh has suddenly jumped a lot more because the t3 medication has sort of revealed to the body you need more t3. You gave it some t3, it liked the result, you took it away and it now wants to make more t3. So the body realises it is low in t3 and is trying to convert more t4.

You would be better off trying some t4 first BUT if you take the t3 again this is how you take it. Do micro doses first. This means taking the smallest amount you can cut a tablet up. It is usually 1/8th with a Stanley blade. This will give you approx 3mg to use. See how this micro dose works as opposed to the big doses. You will have less chance of shutting your own production down and it can compliment your own production.

[helvella Administrator in reply to marsaday]

Reference ranges are lab specific and vary from one lab to another across the country and the world.

The theory is that if you are, say, at top of range with a test from one lab, you would also be at top of range for another lab.

[silverfox7]

Yes think you need to do more reading to understand how itcall works and listen to what your body is telling you. Look at the Thyroid UK site as lots of info and there is a list of symptoms as well you may wa tvto ptont off and annotate to show your GP. Have you had Vit D, folate and B12 tested as they are good for thyroid health. When you do post your results. Doctors are good at telling you that you are normal but that usually means you are in range and often it's where in the range that is important