Is it dangerous to take NDT whilst cortisol levels are high (as shown by 24 hour saliva test)? If not dangerous would it interfere with NDT working? or is that just with low cortisol? Very confused. Thanks!
There is some info here about it:
Might be worth following any links.
I think mine were shot, but I just took NDT and got better on it.
You should get good comments from more knowledgeable folk on here than me!
Thankyou TSH110, the link has some great info xx
That is great! Good luck with it ☘️☘️☘️
Inflammatory cytokines are released during any stress response. These have been shown to down-regulate the HPA axis, reducing TRH (hypothalamus) and TSH (pituitary), impairing the sensitivity of thyroid to TSH.
Even if we are medicating thyroid hormone replacement meds, elevated cortisol is known to decrease the conversion of T4 to T3 and reduce thyroid hormone uptake.
Elevated cortisol can also create excess oestrogen by decreasing the livers ability to clear. Excess oestrogen will raise TBG (thyroid binding globulin) which may attach to free thyroid hormone rendering it unusable by our cells.
I would say any thyroid hormone (not specially NDT) needs careful monitoring with high cortisol levels. This is why it is so important to support our poor compromised adrenal glands and receive comprehensive thyroid testing that includes T3 levels..
Adrenal Glands & Thyroid
My cortisol went sky high at least in part due to undertreatment of thyroid disease. When I had the saliva test results there was no way I was going to reduce my NDT.
If you are hypothyroid, your adrenals will pump out more cortisol in an effort to keep the system going. Its a vain effort though, because cortisol only works short term as a boost in the fight or flight mechanism. But prolonged hypothyroidism is likely to put the adrenals into permanent overdrive.
NOT taking adequate thyroid replacement is only going to worsen your adrenal state.
That's my opinion. I know there are those who say you should sort the adrenals first. And that may be true if they are underproducing. But I cannot see how that would improve matters if you have high cortisol.
When you have high cortisol it can make it difficult to raise ndt dose enough to eliminate symptoms. I found that I couldn't raise above 2 grains without incurring anxiety, palps etc.. I took holy basil for a couple of months until the symptoms of high cortisol went and then tried again to increase with success. I'm now on 3 1/4 grains with no anxiety issues and hypo symptoms almost gone 😀
Thank you for that NatChap. That's great news. It's good to know that you found something that worked. I'm currently taking ashwagandha-do you think holy basil is more effective for high cortisol?? I haven't started taking NDT yet. I was diagnosed with M.E 2 years ago and not getting any better. Both thyroid bloods and urine point to a problem converting T4 to T3-my doctor says this is not a problem (!!). I have ordered NDT from abroad and intend to self medicate-I just didn't want to start with it if it was going to make the high cortisol problem worse!It's a minefield trying to weigh up what to do for the best. I am slowly trying to navigate it as best I can!!
I don't know about ashwaghanda I'm afraid but holy basil worked for me. I would start ndt but address the cortisol at the same time x
holy basil is the best, 1 an hour before each high,
my cortisol is very high at all 4 points and at the moment im taking 5 holy basil, 3 relora and 3 jujube an hour before each high
theres a great adrenals page on facebook
and as for NDT ive been told you cant go above 1 grain so have to increase using T3
im stuck there as i think the synthetic meds have been the cause of all my problems
last year when my cortisol went high i couldnt even manage 1/4 grain of NDT without my heart racing ect
Just realised that your cortisol patterns are similar to mine. Are you taking Swansons Holy Basil?
Also is your adaptogen routine helping you feel better? I've used Relora to help me sleep in the past.
Do you have the link for the Facebook adrenals page? Thanks
i take swansons holy basil and jujube and now foods relora, i did help me feell'normal' stress levels were reduced but it didnt help with sleep issues, i was taking melatonin then was put on mirtazapine for depression (big mistake but i now sleep)
but was costing a fortune im now off all of them and hoping to retest next week
Hi Natchap, so Holy Bazil seems to have worked for you. Can I ask how much mg per dose you took please ? Did you
experience any side effects ? Have heard it can raise Testosteone levels, which put me off. But taking short term
would be fine.
I'm sorry I can't remember what dose the tablets were but I think they were swanson ones and I took 2 am and 2 bedtime. I found the tea works better for me although not particularly nice to drink imo and not as convenient as popping a couple of pills. I didn't find I had any side effects with either but I only took them until my anxiety went..no more than a month or so at a time.
NatChap how long did it take to feel the effects of Holy Basil? I've been taking 2 capsules with breakfast and another 2 at 4pm for a week now but I don't feel any different. Plus two capsules of phosphatidylserine with dinner to get to sleep.
My cortisol was high all day.
I can't recall exactly but I do keep a diary (intermittently!) and it was probably around 3 weeks when I took the capsules..can't remember what dosage they were though. I know I took 2 in the morning and 2 at bedtime. I also tried the phosphatidylserine but didn't find they helped.
I haven't done a saliva test for a long time, but when I have done the tests my levels have been high (over the range).
I've been taking Holy Basil - the Swanson ones :
I had to take 2 capsules 4 times a day to get a noticeable reduction in anxiety and jitters to begin with. I realised that dose was a bit high for me, and so I dropped to 2 capsules, 3 times a day quite quickly. I stayed on that dose (6 capsules) for about 3 months. About 4 - 6 weeks ago I reduced again down to 2 capsules 2 times a day, but took an extra 2 capsules if I thought I needed them.
The "official" dose given on the bottle is 2 capsules, twice a day, which is what I'm taking at the moment (finally!). When I feel the time is right I intend to reduce dose one capsule at a time from now on. I'm in no hurry.
Holy Basil is the only thing I've ever taken which reduced my jitters and anxiety without causing any unpleasant side effects.
I've taken prescribed beta blockers (and I still do once in a blue moon), but they affect my heart in a way I find very uncomfortable, and also reduce my blood pressure too much for comfort even with a tiny dose. I also thought my body adapted to them and made me "addicted" to them in a way. I really don't want to take something that I have to take forever, if I can possibly avoid it. Holy Basil seems to be doing the trick for me.
Hi Humanbean, that's for that - interesting. Do the Swansons have any other ingredients added to the
Holy Basil ?
Active ingredient : Holy Basil Leaf (Ocimum sanctum)
Other ingredients : Gelatin, microcrystalline cellulose (plant fiber), may contain one or both of the following: magnesium stearate, silica.
humanbean I've been taking the Swansons variety which you suggested at 2 capsules twice a day for over a week now. I've not experienced any change and that probably explains why I don't feel any different. I didnt think of trying a higher dose because I was afraid and I didn't think you could either.
I will definitely increase the dose. I don't get jitters but I get overwhelmed by stress very easily. Plus I find it very difficult to get to sleep which again is cortisol related.
It could be a coincidence but since I've started the Metavive iii I'm getting to sleep later than usual and waking up earlier than usual. Perhaps the small amount to T3 in the product is affecting me already and I need to nip it in the bud. Also I feel incredibly tired around 4pm which could be the small amount of T3 wearing off but that's another thing.
I'm even taking Phosphatidylserine. I've also ordered Seriphos. I understand they've changed it to the original formula again.
Thanks for sharing your experience otherwise I would have just given up on Holy Basil and probably given up on taking Metavive iii which I cannot afford to do for the sake of my health.
I don't actually know if what I did is safe! I haven't come to any obvious harm, but then I'm very gung-ho when it comes to my own safety. I had read somewhere, can't remember where, about people taking large amounts of Holy Basil so I just crossed my fingers and hoped for the best.
Thankfully I seem to have come through it okay. But anyone following my example does so at their own risk!
humanbean just wondered, should Holy Basil be taken with or without food? Does it matter? Thanks.
Sorry, I've never given this a thought. I've taken it with food and on an empty stomach. I haven't been conscious of a difference in affect.
Thanks Humabean. Had read somewhere can raise Testerone which
didn't fancy, but short term think I'll give it a go. If you are taking an
element of T3, have you tried taking 1st dose later to reduce Cortisol
output ? Seems may be working for me, Cortisol has lowered quite a bit, although still needs lowering.
been on NDT 1 grain a year now- can't raise as I now know I have adrenal fatigue 4 ridiculous highs throughout...
anyone who has had high cortisol has experienced hard heartbeat when cortisol is high. Also hot flushes...
Hi there, I had a saliva test done by Genova and it indicates high cortisol on all four occassions :(...
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