I wrote to my gp last week about my private thyroid results and how ill I've been feeling. I attached a symptoms list and my results.
Straight away he made fun of my letter saying 'yes I received your letter all 7 pages'. So rude. I said 'well I've been struggling with fatigue for 8 months and no one's listened to me so I took this opportunity to explain exactly how I feel'. He gave a sarcastic laugh.
He then jumped into the letter and said based on my private results I'm not hypothyroid. He said you've no indication you're hypothyroid based on your past nhs results or your blue horizon results. He said as my antibodies are normal I don't have it. End of discussion. I felt like crying and just gave up. I felt a fool for writing to him.
My nhs results in the summer were
Tsh 5.35 (0.35-5.5) 9am after breakfast.
Ft4 11 (7.0-17)
December 2015. 1pm after 2 meals.
Tsh 2.96
Ft4 10.2
Blue horizon results 7.40 am fasted.
Tsh 6.54 (0.2-4.2)
Ft4 14 (12-22)
My ft3 and antibodies fine.
I asked why I was exhausted, no energy at all, fatigue daily and dizziness. He said well maybe ent for the ground moving feeling when I walk. He went through all my blood results they did December and he said there's no reason for why you're so tired. It's chronic fatigue and we never know what to do with patients in your shoes. I said so why am I so dizzy when I walk and so exhausted? He said no idea. Then he said aren't you going out at all? I said yes intake my children to school but that's about it I maybe go out with my husband at weekends but this dizziness and fatigue has flared up my anxiety so had I'm afraid going anywhere incase I fall over. He said well you can see ent if you need reassurance about your ears mayve causing the ground kovinf but the fatigue I can't help as all your vitamins have risen and at good numbers. I've exhausted all avenues. So it's just chronic fatigue.
He ignored my high cholesterol result and said probably just as it's in your family.
I have 3 children. I'm 36. I feel exhausted every day. I feel like crying as he spoke down to me like I knew nothing. So I guess it's not hypothyroidism and i have to just say I have chronic fatigue syndrome. A diagnosis of exclusion.
Thank you all for your help these last few months.
Disclaimer: I am not a medical professional and this information is not intended to be a substitute for medical guidance from your own doctor. Please check with your personal physician before applying any of these suggestions.
Go private!!! Don't let that stupid GP depress you anymore. His attitude is disgusting
I call these doctors jerks or failed abortions. I know it sounds harsh and awful, but helps me to deal with the disappointment to let out some steam. Usually I am the last person saying much bad about anyone.
But there are good and caring doctors out there who make you feel good and comfortable. They might not all fully understand how you feel but they won't laugh at you.
But he said tsh alone and all other results normal means u do not have hypothyroidism 😢
I've been crying all morning I feel defeated and left to fester with a life of fatigue and dizziness. I'm trying to juggle a busy family of 3 children and a zoo of pets. I have no support as my own mother doesn't care. I haven't seen her since Christmas day and before then very little. My husband works long hours. I'm exhausted. I've been counselling my son because the NHS are useless and wouldn't give him therapy for his chronic panic attacks and bullying making him suicidal. My gp knows all this put still poked fun at my 7 page letter which it was not. If they listened to me during appointments and not just do a test then cast me aside I'd not have to write explaining how ill I feel and how much stress I'm under
My TSH never got as high as yours. I'd been struggling for many years, and in the end I decided to treat myself. I have never regretted it.
It is difficult to take information in when we are so tired and our brains don't work well, but persevere and try to learn as much as you can. Then buy meds on the internet, after asking for recommendations on here. I do this, and I have never regretted it. I've got my brain back (mostly). If you want a good book on the subject, this is a good one :
Have you had vitamin B12, vitamin D, folate, ferritin and iron measured? Just getting those optimal helps enormously.
On the subject of anxiety, I suffered from this, but I've found it has reduced massively now that my brain is getting sufficient thyroid hormone. Seriously, the longer you leave it, the more damage you will have to repair. It's scary treating oneself, but so worth it.
I know how it is. Been there crying my eyes out after been told I am just hypochondriac.
Don't let him make you feel this way. You feel lonely but people here on this forum know how it is and we are always here for each other.
Don't give up. Don't let this doctor make you think you are just fine. You are not. You have been through a lot and that can trigger hypo. It also runs in your family?
I feel scared and confused. I'm agoraphobic because of how fatigued and dizzy I feel. When I walk the ground feels like it's a trampoline. I feel exhausted and heavy. I'm frightened every day Ive something serious in my brain. I can't do appointments and I feel upset 😢
Could call any private practice and talk with them first? You would prepare yourself. Is there any privates that would be non hospital like and calm place
I found practice that we like a little cottage. So cute and nice. That helped me. I was very nervous and worried I would pass out but there I felt safe to do so if it had happened.
I worry that the GP makes you feel so discouraged that it will make it harder for you to get help. But if you feel brave enough you could try self medicating like others are suggesting and then go and book an appointment to get back up for your treatment?
I am just so anxious it's why I don't go out Because I am too scared to incase I feel dizzy and off balance. IT's why I can't face appointments. In September I had a huge panic attack in the nurses room and since then I am just too scared to do appointments. I feel an idiot. My anxiety is not good because of how tired I am and this dizziness scares me a lot.
I feel like giving up now with doctors. He said TSH alone is not hypothyroidism so I have lost all confidence in challenging anyone else.
I was anxious too and had panicky feelings. But that is why you have to go.
You are not an idiot. Your doctor is. End of story. Your thyroid gland is suffering and it runs in your family.
You just simply have to go. It gets harder if you don't. You won't die. World does not end. You have to learn not to let your anxiety controlling you.
Baby steps. It is hormonal imbalance. Learn to think about it differently. You sound beaten. You choose to believe that idiot GP. Choose not to.
Challenge yourself. Go out for few minutes, somewhere where it doesn't matter if you feel anxious and let it come and go. It does not cure you but you learn to control it. You learn nothing bad happens. If something bad were to happen during anxiety attack. It feels nasty, bad and awful but you have to get some of your confidence back.
Time to take matters into your own hands, I'd say. The NHS guidelines for treating hypothyroidism are scandalous (imho - and I was sent a copy just a few days ago). The TSH "range" is deliberately set so that only 5% of people fall outside it. It has nothing at all to do with where in that range an individual patient becomes symptomatic, as you are.
Blood tests should be used simply as an aid to diagnosis, not the be all and end all. Doctors are not taught to interpret tests. They simply rely rigidly on the lab to print whether or not they should take "action".
A doctor's job ought to be to help, diagnose and treat their patients. At least, that's what most patients believe a doctor's job is. It is becoming increasingly clear to me that is not how doctor's see their job. Helping patients is anathema to most. It is about the money. Are they paid extra to diagnose hypothyroidism and spend time working with you to find optimal treatment? No. So why bother? CFS is so much easier. No treatment, no tests - shove off and don't bother me.
I regret to say that most doctors have lost their way and few have even a basic understanding of what it means to work with, help, and correctly diagnose a patient.
The overwhelming majority of "diagnoses" given by the overwhelming majority of doctors are simply guesses - or the first thing that comes into their head. To me a "diagnosis" means doing whatever tests are necessary to properly identify a condition. This is rarely, if ever, done even when cancer is suspected. What hope do the rest of us have?
He said tsh alone is not an indication of hypothyroidism and to forget it and not bother testing again privately.
He said all my tests are fine therefore this is just chronic fatigue ano the dizziness probably linked or he will refer me to ENT if I'm that worried. Then said but you'd have to come and see me to arrange a referral to ENT I had explained in my letter at the moment I'm 70% housebound due to this fatigue and dizziness making me so anxious.
As I said, he "should" use the tests to aid in his diagnosis. Your TSH is too high. The average TSH of healthy population (ie people with no hypo symptoms) is 1.5
Your FT4 is very low in range and there is room for improvement and treatment without you going outside his precious reference range.
CFS isn't an illness, it's a set of symptoms. His job ought to be to find the underlying causes.
Have you been properly tested for Lyme Disease? I believe that is the underlying cause of many cases of thyroid issues.
Also, have you had your iron, ferritin, folate, Vit D, Vit B12 levels measured? Make sure you get the results. All should be well in range, not just bottom.
You can buy thyroid meds online and there are knowledgeable people who can help guide you to ensure you take the right dose for you.
I've never had lymes disease. Not been tested but never had a tic bite.
My ferritin was 15 in August and 31 in December. I self supplemented. It's been low 10 years. My b12 was 212 it's now 501 after I supplemented. My calcium and bone profile all normal. HB 15.
It's why my gp said he has no idea why I'm fatigued and now dizzy.
Ferritin of 15 - awful, ferritin of 31 - very bad, B12 of 501 - poor (levels below 500 cause neurological problems that may be permanent, so you may have damage from before you started supplementing). Another of Dr Richard Head's patients, it seems. Tests for ear problems that cause dizziness like Meniere's disease? Short synacthen test for cortisol?
Yes I know 31 is still bad but it has gone up with me medicating.
212 was my B12 in August but I had no symptoms then. Now i am worried what damage it could have caused MY GP told me a B12 of 212 was within range as range was 179-700.
Dr Richard Heads?
I haven't had any tests for my ears just told if my balance is worrying me that much it's making me scared they could refer me to ENT, but only if i wanted to.
If there is no medical reason for the balance problems try Pilate's, needs to be done with a proper Pilate's teacher who can teach you specific balance exercises and techniques to help. It works.
Also, I just read one of your posts above about your son's chronic pain attacks. Get him tested for Lyme (and-or co-infections) too. There is evidence that it can be passed on in-utero.
In deed it is. But you can be bitten by a tick and never know it.
You Don't actaully feel tick bites - I've had a few, living in the country - and if it's somehwere on your back, you wouldn't see it, or the mark.
It's a myth that you always see the tick and there's a tell-tale red bullseye rash. There isn't always a rash.
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Jingyd,
There are many reasons why you feel the way you do. The whole endocrine system is extremely complicated and takes a good dedicated and understanding doctor to get near the psychology of hormones.
Just because you have normal results (in your doctors eyes) doesn't mean you don't have hypothyroidism or some other endocrine problem.
There may be issues with the thyroid, pituitary, hypothalamus or adrenals glands which all work together in feedback loops.
There may be a conversion problem, receptor resistant, thyroid hormone resistance, adrenal fatigue. Even insulin resistance will effect how your hormones are working and usually the longer a hormonal imbalance is left, the worse symptoms become.
Lots of these problems may not show up if only thyroid hormones are considered.
If you feel so bad you need a doctor who understands thyroid psychology. We know how you feel as many of us have been there. It is a big struggle but help is there if you look for it.
Members will be extremely supportive and help with any further questions.
Flower
• in reply to
Thank you for your help.
My gp has just really confused me. I feel I've wastedone time and money testing myself.
There is a school of thought that says there is no such disease a chronic fatigue - it's just undiagnosed thyroid or adrenal problems - often called a dustbin diagnosis because they can diagnose and not treat.
I'd try a different GP who will prescribe a trial of levo, or self medicate, but ...
There are clinics that are supposed to help you get over it - on the NHS - and I think it's classed a disability, so if your doc isn't prepared to diagnose hypo even with your BH results being over range, ask for referrals to everything they provide for chronic fatigue - it'll costt a lot more than a bit of levo.
If you have a lot of stress in your life then this can be a factor in being ill. The T3 level can be good, but stress (or higher cortisol) will block its absorption. So you feel hypo.
Lower thyroid does lead to higher cortisol as a combat mechanism. Over time if the low thyroid is not treated cortisol will drop too and then you are left struggling to do anything.
You are tired, but you are still doing life. I mean you are still looking after the house and children i think. So this is good news.
I wouldn't waste any more time and buy some T4 on the net. It is cheap and you can control what you take. I would start on 25mcg and take it at bedtime as it works best at this time as you are replicating the natural hormone cycle we all have (T4 is made when we go to sleep for the next day).
After 2 weeks i would increase to 50mcgs and then hold that level for 4 weeks. You start low and see if you get any odd signs, hence you start on 25 initially. After 2 weeks you should know if it is not agreeing with yourself.
After the 6 weeks you would get another blood test to see where the FT4 and FT3 are and the TSH. Hopefully they have moved in the right directions.
Getting back to a balanced state is not a question of weeks, but more likely a year. You want to see improvement. T4 may well not help you fully and so after a while you would introduce some T3, but for now just try and see how T4 goes.
Vits and minerals want to be checked. If low in iron you want to supplement. The B vits are important as is Vit c. It may be worth doing the 24h saliva adrenal test as well.
Don't listen to the GP, take control and understand you are going to make a better GP regarding this issue. It sounds like your sone may want to be tested as well.
I have had low ferritin for 10 years. It's benefits as low as 8. Tested in August it was 15 it's now at 31. B12 was 212 it's now 501. Thanks to me supplementing myself. Hb is 15. So very good.
My gp said tsh alone is not hypothyroidism so I am confused. I've battled with my GPS at our surgery for 5 months and I give up now.
Patients have a right to change their GP if they wish. Could you look into switching to another local surgery? Your doctor's attitude of deriding you is unacceptable when you are feeling so ill. I would look into seeing someone else.
You DO have hypothyroidism & in any other country you would be treated. My TSH never got above 4 & I was half dead. I had all those symptoms & more. I now self medicate with NDT & am totally back to full health
I'm afraid you can be left like that. As Rosetrees said, they just Don't care.
Your doctor is totally wrong, right across the board. He doesn't know what he's talking about, so he covers that up by belittling you, and making you feel in the wrong. That's a nasty, cowardly tactic, but one a lot of them use. He's just totally ignorant and he doesn't care!
If it were me, I wouldn't bother with them anymore - been there, done that, self-treat now and feel better than I have done since I started the rotten old Levo. Why waste your precious energy arguing with them? They're not Worth it, and it's having a detrimental effect on your self-esteem - which is what they're counting on!
So, dry your eyes, and blow your nose, and start researching the workings of the thyroid - what it does, how to diagnose and how to treat. Dr John Lowe, or someone like that. Ask lots and lots of questions on here - including where to buy NDT or T3 on line - answers by PM only, please - and then start making yourself better. OK? Big hugs.
It is quite obvious to many on here that the GP is lying to you. Most GP's tell all patients on the NHS the TSH test is the way thyroid function is accessed. The range in the UK is 0.4 - 4 generally. In America it goes up to 3 and in germany i think it is 2.5.
When endos treat patients they always seem to say we want the TSH down to 1 ish.
So your GP is lying to you. Why do so many people place so much trust in them ? It is amazing how many people are kept ill because of poor thyroid health care. These forums all over the world shine a light on this very fact. It is happening all over the world, not just the UK, but it seems the NHS has much less flexibility than elsewhere.
If you are not able to go ahead and treat yourself, try find a different doctor who will be happy to help you. If you are someone who has fallen into the hole of chronic fatigue and are not able to stand up for yourself then you may find it hard to take on the health system.
I have been where you are, but i was so pissed off that they didn't help me (once i saw my own results) i went away and self treated and got much better. I then stopped taking the thyroid meds thinking i was better and became ill again over a 3 month period. This accidental experiment provided proof i did need the thyroid meds and so i battled back and got to see the endo and he agreed i needed thyroid treatment. All this will a TSH of only 3.7 !!! Just shows you what a stupid measurement it is to go by alone.
Life is too short. Grab the bugger by the horns and take action to get better. Do not defer to a GP or endo. Learn about this condition and take control.
My GP said with my TSH at 6.54 and my antibodies being negative I did not have any signs of hypothyroidism. I attached the list of symptoms with my letter and he totally ignored every single one I ticked saying he had no reason to treat me for hypothyroidism.
Yes antibodies normal so straight away he said no antibodies and only tsh that's high therefore it's not hypothyroidism. End of and wouldn't speak about it again.
You have hypothyroidism. Your TSH has been at or above the range on two occasions and your T4 is near the bottom of the range. You need to find a new GP or think about sourcing some thyroid hormones for yourself.
My TSH was around the same level as yours, my T4 wasn't below range and I've recently been prescribed levothyroxine by my GP. It took a while, I saw three different GPs in my practice before I found one who listened and looked at me as well as the test results. I'm starting to feel a little bit better after 3 weeks of treatment, I'm hopeful that with a small dose increase I'll be able to be a proper mum to my two kids.
You deserve the same.
I found it sometimes helped to have someone to come with me to the GP because I often forgot to mention things (even when I wrote them down) and I found that the GP was less dismissive if I was accompanied by someone else.
• in reply to
Thank you.
I'm so anxious right now due to the dizziness i panic at appointments 😯 I feel so stupid but it's all made me highly anxious.
I'm scared all the time why I'm dizzy why the ground moves as I walk. I'm so upset 😢 All my gp did was mock me and said what you never go out? And said he would refer me to ENT if it helped me as I seemed anxious about it. Totally dismissing hypothyroidism.
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One of the GPs I saw just prescribed me anti depressants, even though I was quite clearly not depressed. It's almost as if they just want to label us hypochondriacs. It's so hard to keep having to fight when you feel so unwell xx
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Yes he just mocked me for staying at home and said 'if you want a referral to ENT you will have to come to see me'. Yes I am a mess in my head due to all this anxiety and yes I am avoiding appointments due to the fear I will panic and make a fool of myself but right now I am so tired I can't tackle my anxiety but my anxiety only flared up like this due to all this fatigue and dizziness and no answers.
Now I just feel a fool for writing to him, he made me feel so stupid like I was wasting his time xx
More like he was wasting your time! Don't let him get into your head. He sounds like a right sadist. You did what you could, he ignored you - and worse! - not it's time to cut your loses and go your own way - the road to good health!
God, I'd like to have five minutes alone with that monster and give him what for! How dare he treat vulnerable people like that! It's criminal! I think I might also write a letter of complaint to the practice manager, if it were me. He has not right to speak to you like that!
I'm just so confused. He said tsh alone is not enough to diagnose hypothyroidism especially with no antibodies and people on here on previous posts have said that especially on my recent blue horizon results post last week.
My gp said my t4 is fine at 14 as blue horizon lab range is 12-22. My t4 in my last nhs bloods has been 11 and 10.2. The lab range here is 7-17. So of course he says both fine.
My gp made me feel so stupid for writing to him skitting at me saying 'yes I read your letter, all 7 pages'. My lenter was 2.5.pages plus symptoms sheet I printed off and ticked and my private results. He made me feel stupid.
I feel very confused.
Can hypothyroidism really cause an off balance feeling? I've lost all confidence and am so anxious I can't go out alone or even walk around my house without feeling high anxiety about walking and feel so off balance. I feel weak just stood on the spot. Today I was stood in Mountain pose during a very gentle 10 minutes yoga practice. It's a pose just stood with hands either side of my hips and feet slightly apart. I felt I was sinking into the floor. It scared me.
I told my gp about those feelings and he said i can refer you to ent if you're worried about that.
Low thyroid can cause all sorts of problems, because thyroid hormone is needed by every single one of the millions of cells in your body. And if there isn't enough - or even too much - anything can go wrong. You cannot rule out that it is caused by thyroid unless something else cures it - if you see what I mean.
Of course you're confused at the moment, that's what he was aiming for, he was trying to throw you of the scent of his incompetence by attacking you. Ignore him! Get a good nights sleep, tell yourself that none of this is your fault, and then set about getting yourself well!
Everybody on here is saying the same thing : you are hypo and he is wrong. So, Don't waste anymore time on him. Life's too short!
He was making me feel very silly for worrying about my symptoms. He was like why are you so anxious again? Aren't you going it at all? I felt really stupid.
My anxiety is bad and I am.battling agoraphobia again. I do have an anxiety disorder but all of this is asking me feel much worse.
He said you seem more worried why you ferocious so off balance when you walk. I said of course I am. That's when he said well ent could be an option. I just feltt I was wasting his time. He said with people like you Julie with clear bloods we don't know what to do with you. I felt like I was being put in the reject bin 😢
I am 36. I have 3 children. My86 year old grandmother is living life more than me. I feel so sad 😯
But Don't you see he was just showing his ignorance, there, because your bloods weren't clear!!! Your bloods said you are hypo. And, intelligent people like us, here (see all the replies) can tell that. An ignorant moron like him, can't. He isn't Worth all this time you're giving him.
I know it's hard, he upset you badly - and who wouldn't be upset by that! - but you've got to rise above it if you want to start getting well. Men like that - not just doctors, all bullies - want a kick in the proverbial. But that's illegal, I'm afraid. So, we just have to sit there, and look them straight in the eye, and imagine we're doing it! Then go away and prove him wrong.
Just tell yourself he must be a very unhappy man to have to abuse his patients like that. Perhaps he's got a small proverbial! lol But, you're not going to progress on your path to wellness, until you've got him out of your head. He's a pathetic little man, wrong about everything, so just forget him. OK?
Head up, chest out, stiff upper lip and away we go! And stop thinking you were wasting his time! That's what he's there for, that's his job, he gets paid to give his time to his patients. It's just a pity that he doesn't know that!
He has been rude to me in the past. I stopped seeing him after 8 years because during my anxiety when it began 3 years ago he made me feel quite uncomfortable. He's a good doctor but the mood swings made me feel I was bothering him so I stopped going to him and saw a newer younger gp. He's lovely and been my gp for 2 years. He's done house calls no problem since my dizziness started.
I've decided I will re test in March. The blue horizon doctor commented on my results and said I could possibly be starting with subclinical hypothyroidism but he also said tsh can rise for other reasons so he suggested a test in 3 months time to check the levels again. I'm now above the NHS lab range here of 5.5 for tsh. It was 6.54 on my blue horizon test. So I'm thinking re test and send them to my nice gp and have a chat. He did say to me once tsh reaches nearer 10 he will treat so maybe I can get him to listen to me.
That's my plan i think. Just what's confused me is what the blue horizon doctor said and when I posted my bh results here last week a few people said tsh alone doesn't indicate hypothyroidism. I'm quite confused about it all.
Do you think 3 months is enough to wait for the results to have changed?
If you knew he was rude and dismissive, and you hadn't seen him for 8 years, why did you write to him? I Don't understand that. Why not write to the nice doctor?
As for the BH doctor, I often think they're a bit weird. They do say some strange things, and I get the impression that they're not very well up on thyroid - odd as that may seem. Or else, they're just covering their backsides.
I've just reread the post you're referring too, and I think you misunderstood what people were saying. No-one said you weren't hypo. I think, when you've calmed down a little, you should go back to that post and reread it carefully.
And, Don't forget, you do have a lot of symptoms. There was a time when there were no blood tests, and doctors diagnosed by symptoms. In France, some doctors are still capable of doing that, and just use tests for back-up. In the UK, they Don't seem to know what symptoms are, anymore, I'm afraid.
I know I feel an idiot. The reason I wrote to him was my nice gp was away in the summer so I spoke to my old gp and he was nice suggested tests for thyroid. So I sent myou bh resukts to him as he was the gp who suspected I had it. The newerror gp isn't the one who tested me for it but I did mention it to him when he saw me in December and I was dizzy.
But yes I regret it now and worry will the nice gp be annoyed I didn't write to him. Argh feel a fool.
Yes some posters on my post last week did suggested hypothyroid but I had 2 inboxes from member disagreeing and one even suggested cfs. It confused me a lot.
But, you won't know unless you get the chance to treat your thyroid and see if the symptoms go away.
CFS is not a disease.
Did you ask the other person why they disagree? It would have been more correct to have disagreed on the thread, so that an open discussion could take place.
However, do the maths : how many people think you're hypo, and how many Don't.
I understand your confusion, but the only way to deal with that is to do your own research and make up your own mind.
Thank you for all your help. It is a little. I'm just still thinking if the t4 range is 7-17 here my gp will argue 10 is fine and now it's at 14 with private tests I've no hope haha.
How long would you suggest I wait until I next test? I did my blue horizon last Monday.
ps. Iron still needs to come up BUT people or certainly women with low iron and low thyroid cannot get the iron up if the thyroid is not being increased. The two work together.
Keep working on the vits and minerals. Vit D is worth addressing as well.
Take Vitamin C with the iron to help absorption and do not take thyroid meds at the same time as iron.
You also need to start monitoring your health through some basic measurements. This will help you understand what is helping as you move forward on your way to better health.
This means you need to buy a blood pressure monitor and a thermometer.
Take your temperature when you wake up. This is your baseline temp and it should ideally be 36.6C on waking. This temp reflects your metabolic health. I imagine your temp will be much lower. So start monitoring 3 times per week (you don't need to do it every day). Then if it raises you can see what ever you are doing is having an effect on your health. Also take the temp twice more in the day. Lunchtime and late afternoon. You want to see a gentle increase to max temp during the day. Healthy people will be up to 37C by lunchtime. You may not reach this temp even at late afternoon. again this is all useful data to collect.
Then take your BP overnight when reading a book in bed. This is the easiest time to take the BP and it will guide you to better health. Understanding BP can be a bit more complex because low and high can mean the same thing in thyroid terms. You want to see an average reading of 120/80 ideally.
Write a letter of complaint to the Practice Manager stating that the GP has been downright rude, sneering, dismissive and has done absolutely nothing to help you regain your health.
GPs are revalidated every 5 years and any complaint will be bought up at this so they would have to explain it. It's our only weapon against these numpties I'm afraid. They really don't like patients questioning or disagreeing with them, fragile egos and all that.
• in reply to
Thank you.
This gpage has always had a chip on his shoulder with me tsh why I stopped seeing him and went to the younger nicer gp. I've learnt from my mistakes of doctor shopping but I was getting nowhere with anyone there so thought I'd try.
I was upset he turned around to me and said yes I read your letter all 7 pages. So rude. It was only 2.5 pages long. If they don't listen during appointments on felt I had no choice but to explain how I felt and how it affected me daily 😢 he made me feel a fool.
• in reply to
jingy - you really shouldn't have had to go through that, your GP has failed you. They really don't like the fact that we can learn so much online and do our own research, it's making them feel uncomfortable and inadequate.
Please be kind to yourself, continue to learn and just buy your own meds if you're able. I'm sure your anxiety will disappear once you're on thyroid meds.
Take care.
c_g
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I am too scared to self medicate if my GP says I don't have a thyroid issue though. I feel very confused. On googling I see if TSH is raised by T4 normal and no antibodies there is no reason to treat or diagnose a thyroid issue.
But your FT4 wasn't 'normal', it was low. There's no such thing as 'normal' when it comes to thyroid.
There is the range, and there is high in the range, and there is low in the range. But FT4 should at least be over mid-range - which is 17 here - but yours wasn't, so it's hardly 'normal'. It's low.
High TSH + low FT4 = hypothyroidism. Doctors are never any good at maths!
Don't be afraid to self-treat. A lot of us do it and we're still here.
I'm sorry to say this again, but if you want to feel better, you may well have to. You cannot continue to have no life because of an idiot system & an awful doctor.
He has been rude to me in the past. I stopped seeing him after 8 years because during my anxiety when it began 3 years ago he made me feel quite uncomfortable. He's a good doctor but the mood swings made me feel I was bothering him so I stopped going to him and saw a newer younger gp. He's lovely and been my gp for 2 years. He's done house calls no problem since my dizziness started.
I've decided I will re test in March. The blue horizon doctor commented on my results and said I could possibly be starting with subclinical hypothyroidism but he also said tsh can rise for other reasons so he suggested a test in 3 months time to check the levels again. I'm now above the NHS lab range here of 5.5 for tsh. It was 6.54 on my blue horizon test. So I'm thinking re test and send them to my nice gp and have a chat. He did say to me once tsh reaches nearer 10 he will treat so maybe I can get him to listen to me.
That's my plan i think. Just what's confused me is what the blue horizon doctor said and when I posted my bh results here last week a few people said tsh alone doesn't indicate hypothyroidism. I'm quite confused about it all.
Do you think 3 months is enough to wait for the results to have changed?
None of my results ever got out of range, except thyroglobulin antibodies which the NHS ignore anyway. I was more unwell than I have ever been in my life.
It's up to you whether you wait, I can't decide that for you. Do you want to wait just to be told the same wrong thing again?
I've read with raised tsh and normal t4 you're subclinical hypothyroid and a gp won't treat until tsh reaches 10. So I'm guessing if my tsh hits 10 and t4 still stays in normal range he might treat? Or do they wait until t4 drops too?
I'm sorry, it's a decision you will have to make yourself. I was scared too, but I had no choice, I couldn't stay as I was.
The rules are wrong, the doctors are wrong & we shouldn't be forced into this position. All I can suggest is you learn as much as you can, and then decide. When you have more knowledge, you will have more confidence.
I've bought a book and I'm going to start reading it. I've just lost my confidence since my gp slammed me down and told me i was wrong dismissing my letter and symptoms list.
I'm so worried its why in feel so ill and I worry I am letting by family down 😢 I daily feel exhausted, like I've not slept but I have. The ground moving and body heaviness. I'm also struggling with severe anxiety. It is no fun when you've 3 kids to look after and zero support. I feel lazy for resting so much.
I am so sorry that people can be so rude they don't understand how bad we feel and they try to make a joke out of it but really it not funny it scarry to feel like that
My oh my just when you need some help from a doctor you get ridicule and mockery.😬 I had this balance problem and my doctor didn't give me any indication of why? So with the wonderful help I got from this forum, I started to self medicate to NDT and also take the vits and minerals that they advised. I now don't have balance probs.
So don't give up or be afraid to take advice from these lovely caring people on here. Wish they were my doctor I would have got better from day one!
God bless and hope you soon feel better. Remember you are not alone in this.
Julie, my results were only taken by my TSH no ft3 or fT4. I felt awful and my balance was like I couldn't focus properly and was staggering all over the path and I was afraid I would either stagger into the road in front of a car or pass out. So I became housebound and walked into my walls in the house instead! But at least I felt safe!
I don't know but I think it was taking NDT and also high doses of vit b12 sublingual tablets got me better. My doctor was quite cross that I self medicated but still agreed to monitor me. I gave him some papers on testing results that needed to be done I:e ft3 and ft4.. I am feeling quite well now but I was scared too to self medicate. But with the help and advice I got from here gave me the confidence. So glad because I would still have been feeling like you because my doctor told me quite seriously that they don't treat by feelings!
My advice is the same as others on here treat yourself for your children's sake as well as your own!
How high was your tsh if you don't mind me asking? And what did your gp say about your tsh?
I want to get better. I have 3 children aged 13, 12 and 10. They're my world. Something awful happened to me 3 years ago with my violent brother and I became agoraphobic with an anxiety disorder. It led me to a couple of years of tough anxiety but I got through it then last summer all this started and sinxe November the balance issues it's been horrible and very scary. I do add fuel to the dizziness by worrying it's something serious.
Do you eat gluten? Nobody has mentioned it yet, so I thought I would.
I suffered from dizziness, poor balance and clumsiness. Treating my thyroid and improving my nutrient levels helped a bit, but I still staggered a lot. I appeared to be drunk sometimes, particularly when I was tired, or when I was walking in the dark, even though I don't drink alcohol at all.
As a separate issue, I had been tested for coeliac disease, and it came back negative. I have been tested for thyroid antibodies several times and they always came back negative. So I was reluctant to try going gluten-free. It seemed like it would be a hassle and a complete waste of time. But going g-f is mentioned as a good thing on thyroid forums a lot, so I eventually decided I had to try it. That was about a year ago.
The first benefit I noticed was a big improvement in my temper. The second improvement was my balance improved very noticeably, and my staggering reduced. There is a condition called "gluten ataxia" in which gluten causes damage to the brain, including the parts that control balance.
If you check the first link you will see that ataxia can also be a symptom of B12 deficiency.
My B12 levels were always high. I've only had one test which was within the top of the range, all the others have been over the range. Despite this I have had lots of symptoms that were suggestive of B12 deficiency. Eventually I decided to supplement with methylcobalamin for a while and see what happened. (I'd only ever supplemented intermittently with cyanocobalamin before then. I found my B12 deficiency symptoms disappearing, and I got yet another reduction in my balance and staggering problems. I haven't managed to fix myself completely. I suspect the damage had been going on too long. But it has improved a huge amount.
So, my suggestion would be that you try going gluten-free for a while and see how you feel. It has to be done absolutely ruthlessly. You can't be "almost gluten-free", you either are or you aren't. It has to be done 100%. You never know, it might help your balance.
I got another benefit from going gluten-free. For the first time in my life I am not anaemic or low in iron. So going gluten-free has had an effect on my absorption of nutrients, even though I hadn't really noticed an improvement in gut symptoms. But now I know about my iron, I have thought more about it and realised that I do get less indigestion these days. It had improved so slowly I hadn't even noticed.
I haven't seen any results from you for vitamins and minerals. Have you posted them anywhere?
I actually went gluten free 6 weeks ago and have stuck to it.
I did it because I have bad ibs and sinxe stopping it that's improved a great deal.
I've had 2 coeliac tests and been negative.
I've had low ferritin for 10 years. Lowest is 8 but in August it was 15. It's now up to 31 as I've been supplementing. I can't take tablets so I take feroglobin liquid and it's helped a lot in just 3 months. Hopefully it'll keep rising.
My b12 was tested in August and was 212 (179-700) and in December after supplementing myself with 1200ug of methylcobalamim a day. It rose to 501 in 13 weeks.
I've never had vitamin d tested as my gp said they couldn't test it at my surgery until a bone profile was done and that came back good aswell as my calcium. I supplement d3 myself now 2000iu a day.
My haemoglobin is 15 so that's amazing my gp said.
The dizziness is connected to adrenal function which is connected to thyroid.
I had the dizziness when i was first ill. I couldn't walk straight and it was scary.
I don't know the reason for it, but it is connected to adrenals and thyroid. So look into helping to support the adrenals if you are not going to bother with thyroid meds. Nutri adrenal extra tablets are supposed to be good.
I really wouldn't waste any more money on blood tests. You have lower FT4 and raised TSH. More importantly you have many symptoms of low thyroid. Anxiety is a big one.
So try and be brave and get some thyroxine on the net. IT is cheap. Just try a small amount to start and see how you go for two days. If you don't like it just stop. It really is that simple. You will not die, you will not have any adverse reactions. You probably won't notice any change. So i would keep going and see how you feel after 2 weeks. By then something may have changed. Remember when we take thyroid hormones it is not a quick fix. Positive signs can take months to come through. We actually get ill from low thyroid very slowly. It is generally not an illness which hits you in the face. Slowly we feel tired and get used to it, then we can ache, feel nervous, put on some weight and then one day we wake up and realise we are not very well.
Hi, I had similar problems four years ago.... Change GP.... I went to my old GP numerous times with under active symptoms. They even told me at a pre- op assessment at the hospital my thyroid was about to give in. Until certain GP's get the evidence in your blood work they won't prescribe med's even though you can have symptoms a long time before it gives in completely. I wish they would understand we know our own bodies, but you know something isn't right so don't be fobbed off. Keep going. By the time I had changed GP's my thyroid had completely given up and at last showed in the bloods. Good Luck, hang in there you are not going mad or a hypochondriac it will show in your bloods eventually.
Thank you. Did you have issues with your T4 result though not just TSH? that is why my GP won't treat me. He says high tsh alone is not anything to worry about and T4 is within range. I have negative antibodies too.
Sorry for late reply. I was searching old copies of blood test results to see what I was at the time but can't see what my T4 was at that time. I know I fluctuated a bit at first though and even though I got better results after the initial bad reading I still had no improvement in health. I kept going back to the GP until I got fed up of going to be knocked back. I then changed GP and maybe just a coincidence but when she did bloods it showed it had given in. I think it is possible you could fluctuate for a while before it gives up.
At what level did you GP give in and treat? How ill did you feel? were you ill even when it was borderline? I am feeling dreadful and getting no help at all. Just left to fester being told nothing is wrong with my results.
Hi, sorry for late reply. I was TSH 23 when it crashed and the first reading which showed up and my GP wouldn't treat was TSH 5.0. Yes I felt dreadful at the time. At the time (which I didn't know about), my GP had been approached by the department of health to see if I wanted to go on a trial to take soy to see if it makes a difference to my thyroid levels. I wish I had known about it at the time. If I were you I would try as much self help as you can to stay off the levo first. It is not a miracle cure as the med's themselves have complications I have just had three weeks from hell after over medicating. Are you under tons of stress at the moment apart from not feeling well? I had a few years of major stress which I believe contributed to my health and I also drank alcohol to help me sleep for far too long. Hang in there but look at soy? and other things whilst you can. Wish I had done. Of course there may be no stopping a thyroid giving up but you owe it to yourself to give it a try first.
Yes I'm under a hell of alot of stress and anxiety the last 3 months. My son was bullied and suffered extreme panic attacks and crippling anxiety. He felt suicidal and he only 11. It destroyed my world. The gp referred him to the childrens mental health team and they refused to help him saying id be best to help having had anxiety. It was a hellish 3 monhs but I gave him therapy myself and he's now well and so happy. Settled in school and the nightmare is over. I though am burnt out and have very bad anxiety at the moment after all I've been coping with single handedly. Plus I have 2 other children. 1 who keeps catching virus after virus. It's been a demanding few months.
My tsh was 5.35 in the summer but I had no stress at the time.
What can I do to help my thyroid myself? I'm considering a diet that's based around healing adrenal fatigue.
I am no expert but I sounds like a great place to start. (sorry I don't have any diet tips) It is true as a mum you have to be there for everyone else and then its you that suffers. It sounds like you have done a fantastic job with your son, well done for that. I think you deserve some me time now and take some time out to get yourself well. I had major stress, flooding, operation, caring for my terminally ill mum for three years, redundancy and house move. Like you I carried on battling but it does eventually catch up with you and you have to sort yourself before you can carry on. It is like stress just builds up gradually and eventually you are unable to proceed without sorting yourself out. I think whilst all my stuff was going on we all ate rubbish as I was either too tired to cook decent meals or not enough time. Its true what they say you are what you eat so give it a try you have nothing to loose. Good luck ..
For stress take Gaba. but again, if you had been stressed, your adrenals might be out of whack. As I said in my last reply below, have a CBT to see if you have iron or B deficiency anemia. Also have your cortisol and insulin as well as your estrogen levels tested. I take welbutrin because it does not (for most ppl) make yougain weight and because it promotes DOPA levels in your brain (neurotransmiter) it will give you more energy and calm you down. Gaba is a natural way of doing that but without clear test results, taking hormones yourself could do more damage than good. My prescribed dosage was 150mg / day but i found out it was making me feel foggy and like walking on air and fainting (weird, eh) so im taking half a pill and that is helping tremendously with coping with stress. Stress is a killer. It imbalances the production of hormones and screws with the neurotransmiters in the brain and you dont get 'happy' because of lack of dopamine, serotonine and oxytocin. (those three aftect your pituitary gland, hence tiredness, memory issues, ) and other physical - increasing cortisol which makes you insulin resistant (not digesting properly hence no vitamins and or iron hence anemia hence exhaustion and even worst, heart problems) Overstimulating your thyroid when is already under stress - would help for a second but then if you dont manage your stress you will become chronic hypothyroidian and from there another bunch of issues and ailments.
Wow. 2.9! Where are you from?
My t3 is 5.3 so within the range of 3.1-6.8.
I'm having a retest in a few weeks then demanding a trial as I feel so ill every day then randomly I get awful days like yesterday where I wake up feeling worse than ever and unable to function. I felt weak and fatigued beyond belief yesterday. My husband had to take over yesterday with the house and kids. I felt useless.
Next time any fool in the medical industry upsets you, mention 3 letters GMC.
I'm just about to do it myself, these uncaring idiots are beyond a joke.
I'm hypothyroid and i keep telling them how I feel, they tell me to stop talking about thyroid FFS, cuz its a new disorder >> i'm depressed LOL, they want to drug me up with anti depression and satins. NO WAY!!!!
Yes I have been told have depression and am anxious and that is why I am currently in a 5 day crash where i am beyond exhausted and struggling to walk around my house yet I have to cook and pick my kids up from school. Normal??? no! I am told it's just chronic fatigue from anxiety and depression. My cholesterol is high and i am told i will need statins in the future. I am 36 fgs!
I was dealing with similar symptoms and with idiot doctors as well, believing it was thyroid related. I dont want to rant here about my own personal saga but it sounds to me you might have anemia. Low iron or other causes. B6/B12 anemia also possible.
I would have a simple blood test CBT - and have your hemogoblin tested as well as your ferritin levels. If you can have your B's tested as well as vitamin D and K.
And, very important, your CORTISOL and INSULIN (saliva test) which might indicate adrenal malfunctioning.
I would also test your hormones. Too much estrogen (estrogen high, low progesterone and or testosterone) also might add to your fatigue problems. Im not sure how is your period if you bleed a lot, but if you have any problems in that department and added stress, then it might be an estrogen issue. To cut this short
I dont advocate self medication but try for the next seven to ten days to eat a diet rich in Omegas (flaxseeds avocados, olive oil, coconut oil, fish) and protein (red meat, lean white meat like pork, and chicken liver. Drink water, one green tea a day no caffeine otherwise, get some sleep and some sun / light exposure. Mild walks if you can.
Also take iron supplements! IMPORTANT (drops wont upset your stomach although constipation and or dhiareea might occur). You could tell if taking iron helps almost immediately. Start with two-three pils or 40-60 drops (depends on the potency of the ferrate)
If you feel better, less tired, then is that. Otherwise, try also to add B6/B12 but beware too much B12 in your body can cause the exact same symptoms. High cholesterol is indicative of high cortisol and high insulin and or insulin resistance - hence if you change your diet, you are helping your body ameliorate the inbalance. Have 4-5 small meals a day to keep your blood sugar leveled. Vitamin C also helps with energy levels. I am not going to go into advising Dopa and Gaba and or Oxytocyn because Im not sure how you are with your hormones but I found that takeing a Dopa stimulant like Welbutrin, (antidepresant) also helps
For the rest, see your blood tests results and check with your doctor. If you are post menoposal (no bleeding menses) then you have to check your iron levels prior to taking iron supplements. Too much iron in your body and is bad for you, same type of symptoms (fatigue, etc)
My ferritin and B12 were tested recently. Ferritin had gone up from 15 to 31 and B12 from 212 to 501.
My HB was 15.5 so not anaemic at all.
Full blood count all normal.
The only test results I have that are showing some concern to me are my cholesterol is 6.9. My HDL is 1.6 which is good. LDL is 3.9 and Triglycerides were 3.
My HBA1C (diabetes test) was 40 (20-41 is normal) but I am worried sick why it's 40! GP tells me I have no reason to worry about that at all and they will just check it annually or sooner if I develop symptoms.
I eat very well. The only vice of mine is dark chocolate. I usually have a square or 2 a day of the 70-90% dark. Other than that I don't eat cakes, biscuits, white bread... I don't eat any rubbish at all. I don't eat red meat, no burgers or fatty foods. My typical day is Oats at breakfast with almond milk, snack is a banana or oats cakes with humous. Lunch is avocado on toast, beans on toast, mackerel on toast.... Dinner is veggie chilli with wholegrain rice, brown rice pasta with veggies, chicken low fat curry with wholegrain rice, chicken with potato salad using half fat soured cream and salad.... Snacks are fruit or oat cakes usually. Supper in the evening I usually have 0% fat greek yoghurt (Total yoghurt). My diet is very clean. I am even too scared to eat eggs or dairy these days.
This is why I am worried, why on earth would I be 2 marks away from the pre diabetic range of 42-48. Why is my cholesterol high? (it is in my mums family, along with hypothyroidism).
I take a liquid iron supplement daily. I also take B12 daily (liquid spray 1400ug a day), D3 2000ug a day, Biocare multivitamin which is of excellent quality. I also rub magnesium oil into my skin twice a day as I can't take the oral supplements.
I weigh 116lbs, I am 5ft tall. The only other medications I take are Mirtazapine 15mg for sleep and anxiety (been on it 3 years). I also take Loestrin 20 combined pill for very heavy periods that started 5 years ago and caused me intense pain and low iron. I saw gynae and had scans, all fine and was told to try the pill to help my iron levels and now I have a very light bleed which is a godsend.
Thank you for taking the time to reply to me. I have been so confused. Can I eat fats with high cholesterol, do I need to lower my carbs to help my hba1c come down.... so confusing.
For high cholesterol and upping your mood, look at Nicain, Vitamin B3, I do what's known as a Niacin flush 1000mg - 2000mg for a week and back to 250mg a day for cholesterol, B3 has lots and lots of added benefits, it seems to work very well, I add in a red apple a day for cholesterol control. Seems to working my end, also I bought my own NDT from Thailand 1000x 1 grain 60mg pills for £35 and supplement with selenium, nascent iodine, 5HTP, N-Acetyl Tyrosine, Probiotics and Red Korean Gingseng which all seems to be working. seems that since off the synthetic doctors crap, im doing much better, more balanced and brain fog lifted along with shorter depression spells as the weeks pass, no more anxiety, in 4 months i left the the house, fatigue going.......
The above works for me, Its taken many years to get here, but I have more often good days than bad more often, its amazing, felling like a teenager lol, the best thing I did was dump the doctors advise and just use them for blood tests.
Spend some money and get natural treatments.
I been misdiagnosed for 20 years when it was zero thyroid function, been on all sorts of anti depression, nasty stuff, don't go there if you can help it.
My children are 10, 12 and 14. No post natal depression
I am only feeling low due to the health issues I have and lacking in energy and good health. I have also been told feeling low is very common with hypothyroidism.
Hi. 2 years on and I'm wondering whether you got any help with this? Did you try a new doctor?
I am going through the same thing with my doctor. Private tests say I have hypothyroid but doc says NHS tests say i don't and it's just down to Fibro and Narcolepsy.
Just wondering how you got on. i hope you managed to get it sorted and are feeling better?
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Advice before I speak to my gp on Tuesday please
What is going on with my test results? Also surprise response to from my Endo to my recent letter!
