NDT Dose Hello insomnia

Can't get my NDT right. My latest bloods as I was told to go back to 2 grains from 2.5, I actually went for 2.25 were 9.4 for my T 4. I feel pretty crap at the moment as I'm not sleeping. My prescription was lost so for 3 days I had to reduce to 2 grains but I've gone back to 2.5 for last 2 days. Brain fog, constipation and I can't sleep. Not feeling cold no palps. Supposed to go to a wedding tomorrow as my partner is best man. I don't want to go as I e only had 2 hours sleep

18 Replies

  • Have you had an adrenal test to check cortisol levels? I couldn't get my dose right until I altered the times I took a split dose. The transformation was immediate and I've felt fantastic since.

  • Corsitol is definitely an issue I can tell. I'm moving house (or not) at the moment. You probably know the rest. I'm also toying with the idea it's a faulty batch. The delivery I've had are in one grains and I can break in half easily with my fingers. Whereas I normally have to use a cutter.

  • I have not been on such a high dose as you for ages. I am no doctor but maybe you are not metabolising the medication properly and would benefit from a mixture of the T4 tabs with the thyroxine. I do this now. All the best. Yes, insomnia is an issue.

  • HI On NDT it is vital to know what your FT3 is so it is not over range. I find I need mine high in range which is a better indication than T4.


  • I know which is why I asked for it to be checked and guess what? It was 6.2 last time which is a smudge over but no great shakes and I certainly don't feel over medicated.

  • HI When I was over medicated I felt the same but in fact I became very ill. Might be worth trying a little less.MY Endo says on NDT the T4 being low does not matter. I find this the case too.

    Best wishes,


  • Of cortisol is an issue than the timing of doses may be the factor that will allow full recovery. I would experiment for a couple of days with taking half or a third of your daily dose 2 hours before your usual time of getting up. If you have low am cortisol which you really need to confirm via a saliva test, taking an early am dose dramatically improves the effect of your first dose of the day. It becomes a super dose. You then only need to take enough during the rest of the day to maintain the benefit. I can give more details if you want to give it a try.

  • It's at night I feel the surging. I haven't been able to train much this week either. I normally train 6 days so that won't help. I've got to face a wedding today. I've already taken my 2.5 grains at 6,45. Wondering whether to take another half this afternoon to catch up and help me cope

  • Taking extra later doesn't actually work I'm afraid. It's the first dose that sets you up and then can be maintained.

    You might find you feel reasonably ok at the wedding. I have had similar experiences and even though I imagine I just can't get through a social situation I have been energised by being amongst others and out and about. I really feel for you because it's a miserable place to be isn't it. You might find if you get the early am dose right you can lower your daily dose and cure the insomnia.

    Good luck and feel free to message me if you want more info about the circadian method x

  • Hello Hellsy

    I would like more info. on the 'circadian method' please, if poss.

    You may send me a personal message.


  • Hi, I've had a few messages so I've answered here on the post (below) Hope this helps and feel free to ask any more questions.

  • I slept 🍷🍷🍷🍷for 10 hours last night. Passed out. Needed it though. Wedding was OK after a few glasses. Whatever it takes I say x

  • Did you feel better on the higher dose? I know some NDT users say if they take their last dose of the day too late in the day then they can't sleep at night. Personally I take one at 7, one at 12, and 1/4 at 3. Magnesium citrate is great for constipation (taken at night) and magnesium spray on the body eases muscles to relax and aids sleep. I would anticipate your Dr will increase you dose, T4.is very low, although I don't know your ranges.

  • I take it all in the morning

  • I've had a few messages in my in box asking about the circadian protocol but I'll answer here as it will likely be relevant to others too. A good source of information about the method is at:


    My own experience is that I was on one and a half grains of NDT (Armour). Having felt well for about 8 days each time I increased my dose (beginning at half a grain and following the protocol suggested on stop the thyroid madness website) instead of continuing to feel well with another increase I couldn't tolerate going higher than one and a half grains. Around this time my adrenal saliva test came back with low cortisol in the morning and evening (morning was 24.56 - the range is 7.45 - 32.56). I was told by Paul Robinson that I am a candidate for the circadian method as my am cortisol should be higher than it 24.56. At the time I was taking a split dose of three quarters of a grain at 7am (on waking) and another three quarters of a grain at 1pm.

    Following the circadian protocol, I began taking my first dose at 5.15am as my usual time to fully wake and get up is at 7am. I found that this early dose suddenly became highly effective and my energy was great. I just had to work out when the benefits of the dose began to wear off and then I would know when to take my 2nd dose. For me that meant taking my second dose at 10.30am as I would feel fatigued from around 11am if I waited any longer to take this second dose. These 2 doses are all I need to have great energy through the day. Paul says that it's important to get the first dose correct and then continue dosing during the day just enough and spaced out to maintain your energy. If you don't feel good after your first dose you can't play catch up and take more later in the day as it doesn't work that way.

    I have since experimented and tried to move my dose a little later to 5.45am but I don't get the same benefits. I chose 5.15 am initially as I often wake briefly at that time and then go back to sleep. I find I don't really get back to sleep properly after taking it but as my energy is so good I don't mind!!

    I have a gentle sound to stir me at 5.15am, take my dose and then doze for a little while.

  • Just a word on insomnia. I think I could potentially have the same issue but when I get in bed if I feel alert I practice deep abdominal breathing and it works a treat. Just lie on your back, take a deep breath in through the nose so that the belly raises, hold for a couple of seconds and then VERY SLOWLY RELEASE THE BREATH through your nose, pause, REPEAT. Continue until you nod off!

  • This may sound stupid but are you taking your NDT at least an hour away from food and calcium? You can put it in your body but those things keep you from absorbing the medicine and using it. May throw your bloodwork off as well. Have they checked your antibodies?

  • If you are going to split your dose, make sure your second dose is about 8 hours before you go to bed - otherwise it will keep you awake. The T3 makes you lively and will keep you that way for about 8 hours (it's half life). So don't let that period intersect with bed time.

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