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Brain Fog

Arnold_Layne profile image
8 Replies

Hi

I'm new here, though I've posted on the Thyroid Forum before.

I'm a 51 year old male. In 2014 I went on a low carb high fat diet and it affected my thyroid function, causing low energy and brain fog. I self-medicated with dessicated thyroid for four or five years without any relief of symptoms - I must have either never got the dosage right or else needed T3 as well (not getting enough testing done was the real problem). In 2019 I stopped lchf and dessicated thyroid - my thyroid started working again and my energy has increased to a reasonable level.

However constant brain fog remains (poor short term memory) and although I accept it could be permanent brain damage by now, I'm considering trying B12 injections. I would self-inject to avoid a lot of trips to my GP's. (I'm in the UK.)

All thoughts welcome.

(My reason for going lchf was some symptoms, and a family history, of cardiovascular disease - I need to get back to lchf, but would like to address the brain fog first.)

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Arnold_Layne
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8 Replies
fbirder profile image
fbirder

You should really see a GP first. There is always the risk of an anaphylactic reaction to one's first B12 injection, so we would always recommend it is done by a medical professional.

Nackapan profile image
Nackapan

Have you had your serum b12 tested with folate vit d snd iron?

You need to know your level

Or an active 22 one csn be bought.

Have you tried b12 tablets?.

Injections are only nedrd if you have an absorption problem.

I woukd suggest blood test first and go from there

If yiu get to the stage of needing b12 injections after trying b12 tablets. First injection shoukd be in a medical setting..

Most over 5os require b12 in a modest multivit I now know!!

As stomach acid reduces with age and you may not be able yo eat enough fir what you need.

Arnold_Layne profile image
Arnold_Layne in reply to Nackapan

Haven't had any of those tests - I'm sure it's been discussed before here many times but I'm surprised B12 isn't included in the standard NHS blood test panel (maybe it is now, I haven't had one recently). The serum B12 test would be pointless as I've been taking Life Extension Two Per Day multivit which contains 300mcg methylcobalamin.

It also contains 680mcg folate as L-5-methyltetrahydrofolate calcium salt.

I take a total of 8000iu of vitamin D daily which gives me a very good level.

I eat a lot of broccoli and salad leaves, and also some red meat so should get enough iron from diet (I think men's iron levels tend to be on the high side, hence the multivit without iron).

Maybe I should try tablets (someone said on the Thyroid Forum that for men, the only way to overcome brain fog can be a really high B12 level achievable only with injections).

It's likely that my B12 level would not be low enough to get injections from the NHS but a brief search online has revealed a former nurse who does beauty treatments and gives B12 injections for £40, who is reasonably near me.

Nackapan profile image
Nackapan in reply to Arnold_Layne

I think it woukd still be good to get b12 levels checked as if good then you would know yiu are able to absorb tablets if Low or borderline then push for injections .

The local private one sn option but I woukd get bloods first to see where you are.

B12 is often done with folate.

My husband was 'borderline' then 3 m later was well onto the range so we know he csn absorb but not at the rate he needed fro a very good mixed diet.

Arnold_Layne profile image
Arnold_Layne in reply to Nackapan

Thriva Test Results

"Normal ranges" are in brackets.

For 6 weeks before the test the only supplements I took were fish oil, CoQ10, vitamin D and 100mg vitamin B6 twice / week.

I eat beef 2 or 3 times week, fish once and 3 eggs on the other days, also eat some dairy.

Gender : Male

Sample Dated : 07/07/2021

Sample Received : 08/07/2021 10:33 AM

Result Reported : 08/07/2021 4:11 PM

Specimens : SERUM

Pathology Report

BIOCHEMISTRY

25 OH Vitamin D H 196 (75 - 175) nmol/L

HAEMATINICS

Iron 15.0 (10 - 30) umol/L

UIBC 47.3 (22.3 - 61.7) umol/L

TIBC 62 (41 - 77) umol/L

Ferritin 84 (30 - 400) ug/L

Transferrin Saturation 24 (20 - 55) %

Total Vit B12 373 (300 - 569) pmol/L

Active B12 81.0 (37.5 - 188) pmol/L

Folate (serum) 36.0 (8.83 - 60.8) nmol/L

THYROID FUNCTION TESTS

Thyroid Stim. Hormone 2.77 (0.270 - 4.2) mIU/L

Free Thyroxine (FT4) 14.9 (12 - 22) pmol/L

-------------------- End of report --------------------

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Authorised by: Pathology | PURA Diagnostics Unit D5,Churcham Business Park, Glouc, GL2 8AX

FINAL REPORT

Nackapan profile image
Nackapan in reply to Arnold_Layne

Good you've had your bloods done.

To the untrained eye and what I know they look good.

I don't understand thyroid results at all .

As you've not been on oral b12 supplements levels have a maintenence dose again.

So on your next lot of bloods see of you've absorbed them and Levels increase?

It's very frustrating if you are feeling ill and nothing found on bloods to treat.

Work with your doctor they are good at a process of elimnation . All look at your bloods with a trained eye and all together as a picture.

Should refer on you to specialists if unexplained symptoms. I know it's a slow process.

If you start a new post with your results

You will get lot more people looking .

Did Thriva put comments

If you haven't an absorbtion problem b12 tablets should bring up your levels.

I personally wouldn't have b12 injections unless everything else explored first .

I csnt remember details but I. Sure once on I jections your body needs higher levels to use it.

You can of course have a functional disorder when levels are normal but not accessible.

Carry on getting optinal nutrition.

Watch your b6 input as like iron too much causes problems.

And perhaps as very sunny less vit d supplement ??

I thought up to 4000iu advised??

When I was on loading doses od vit d it made ne feel a bit ill.

I'm on a maintenence of 1000iu sometimes es 2000iu

Perhais rethink abd read up on that.

Only ideas

Sometimes less is more .

Perhaps try a different form of oral b12 as methylcobalamin doesn't suit everyone. Thars of courses if yiu are absorbing it.

Hope you get some answers to work on soon.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

Do you have symptoms that are consistent with B12 deficiency?

Link about "What to do next" if B12 deficiency suspected

b12deficiency.info/what-to-...

Symptoms of B12 Deficiency

pernicious-anaemia-society....

b12deficiency.info/signs-an...

b12d.org/admin/healthcheck/...

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

Symptoms of Peripheral Neuropathy (damage to peripheral nerves)

nhs.uk/conditions/periphera...

Peripheral neuropathy can be associated with B12 deficiency and sometimes with folate deficiency.

Vital to get adequate treatment if B12 deficient.

Neurological Consequences of B12 Deficiency

PAS news item

pernicious-anaemia-society....

PAS article about SACD, sub acute combined degeneration of the spinal cord

pernicious-anaemia-society....

PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society)

Based in Wales, UK.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

There is a helpline number that PAS members can ring.

UK guidelines indicate that patients who are symptomatic for B12 deficiency should be treated even if serum B12 level is within normal range.

UK B12 documents

BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines

b-s-h.org.uk/guidelines/gui...

Summary of above document

pernicious-anaemia-society....

BMJ B12 article

bmj.com/content/349/bmj.g5226

Emphasises need to treat patients who are symptomatic even if their B12 level is within range.

BNF Hydroxycobalamin

bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/hydrox...

NICE CKS B12 deficiency and Folate deficiency

cks.nice.org.uk/anaemia-b12...

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

Two useful B12 books

"What You Need to Know About Pernicious Anaemia and B12 Deficiency" by Martyn Hooper

Martyn Hooper is the chair of PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society).

BNF treatment info in book is out of date. See BNF Hydroxycobalamin link in this reply.

"Could it Be B12?: An Epidemic of Misdiagnoses" by Sally Pacholok and JJ. Stuart (US authors)

Very comprehensive with lots of case studies.

Letters to GPs about B12 deficiency

b12deficiency.info/b12-writ...

B12 article from Mayo Clinic in US

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Table 1 in above article is about frequent misconceptions about B12 deficiency.

I am not medically trained.

I have written other more detailed replies on the forum which may be worth searching for.

Arnold_Layne profile image
Arnold_Layne

I have been taking 3 x 50 mcg of cyanocobalamin a day and after 2.5 months I noticed a partial (and very welcome) recovery of mental sharpness.

My memory has not improved so to address that and hopefully recover more mental sharpness I now intend to get back on thyroid medication and try to optimise the dosage.

While I understand that taking cyanocobalamin three times a day maximises absorption, has anyone any thoughts on what dosage I might try as a maintenance dose? Any opinions on sustained release cyanocobalamin?

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