Intra muscular or sub-cut?

[Grifter]

I'm confused about how different forms of b12 can be injected can anyone clarify please? I've always self injected methyl sub-cut but in order to more easily access b12 online I will be buying hydroxo or cyano. Can they both be injected sub cut? Don't think I could do IM myself.

[wedgewood]

I use Hydroxocobalamin and I use IM . I assume that is the best way as that is how it is done at the surgery . I promise you it is easy and painless ! Just always use 2 needles A long one to extract the liquid from the ampoule, which obviously touches the bottom of the ampoule, which makes it blunt . The. I use a shorter,thinner needle 1inch long and 25 gauge. I inject into the thigh , the outer middle third .

Having said all that I hear that some people use sub cut . with success . On the ampoule carton is written that it can be used s.c, i.m, and i.v.

[Chocolate41 in reply to wedgewood]

Not I.V

[wedgewood in reply to Chocolate41]

That is what is written on the the Hevert vitaminB12 depot carton .

[Cynosure in reply to wedgewood]

Yeah I think you could do it intravenously. I've even read a study where it was injected intrathecally (into the spine basically) of people with diabetic neuropathies, and it showed great results.

[Leilanilea in reply to Cynosure]

Never advise someone to give themselves medication intravenously! It might be okay but you obviously don't know if that is true, and this is not a choice such as whether a person wants chocolate or vanilla.

[Chocolate41 in reply to Leilanilea]

I agree with you leilanilea never never advise any body here to injection intravenously.It could be sooo dangerous.

[Cynosure in reply to Chocolate41]

I wasn't advising anyone to inject IV. :/ I was responding to @wedgewood and @Chocolate41 on the fact that it's possible to inject IV.

If I was responding to the OP I would have responded to her/him and not this thread.

I also mention intrathecal injections but I'm not saying you should do it. You'd be mad to try without a medical professional. I was simply stating what's theoretically possible.

[deniseinmilden in reply to Cynosure]

Wedgewood and Cynosure are factually and ethically correct. I have read this after all your replies and neither suggests that these other routes are used for SI, they are just using them as examples of the safety margin for B12 to reassure the original poster.

Both of them have kindly replied with lots of care and knowledge, without posting purely personal opinion, which I have a great deal of respect for.

[Cynosure in reply to deniseinmilden]

Thanks deniseinmilden, I couldn't have said it better myself (:

[Hidden in reply to deniseinmilden]

Well said. Common sense, prevailed

[Hidden in reply to Cynosure]

Well said.

[Galixie]

Methyl, Hydroxo, and Cyano are all safe to use subcutaneously. The difference between IM and subQ is going to be in how quickly you'll feel a benefit from the injection and how long the benefit will last.

I have used both IM and subQ injections. I was using Cyano for both types of those injections. I found that, with subQ, I didn't need a very large dose, but I needed more frequent injections than I did with IM. This is just my personal experience, so you would need to listen to your own body to find out if switching from methyl to cyano or hydroxo changes anything about the effectiveness or duration. You can take any of them subQ, you just need to be prepared to play around with how often you need the injections. Hydroxo tends to last a bit longer in the body than cyano for most people.

SubQ injections are, frankly, easier to master than IM injections. It is perfectly reasonable to continue with subQ if you are more comfortable doing those. I inject IM once a week and I have to give myself a pep talk to do it every. single. time.

There are some good instructional videos online of how to administer IM if you do decide to go that route. Look for the videos/instructions intended for nursing students. Practicing on an orange is also helpful. If you know a medical professional who is willing to teach you, that is the best possible learning method. Good luck.

[ndodge in reply to Galixie]

Hi Galixie,

When you do sub cut is it in the stomach like insulin? & you said you need less, may I ask what dose you were using for sub cut?

Thanks!

[Galixie in reply to ndodge]

Yes it was in the stomach. I have a lot of fat on my belly so that seemed like the most logical place to do them, lol.

When I first tried subQ I started with only a 60mcg dose that I was taking daily. That dose turned out to be too low for me. I eventually had all my symptoms return and I basically had to start over from scratch with getting my B12 level up again.

The level that I eventually found that worked for me as a daily subcutaneous injection was between 200 and 300 mcg. Everybody is different though.

I switched back to IM injections when I was given the option to have once a week injections. Those injections have been 1000mcg, but they work just as well as the daily subQ injections with the benefit that I don't have to inject as often and I'm actually using slightly less*

*Or I was until a few weeks ago when I got a refill of my B12 and found that my naturopath has changed suppliers and the new version is 10,000mcg/ml, which is ten times more per dose than the previous version.

[ndodge in reply to Galixie]

Thanks Galixie!

Useful information indeed.

I'm injecting 3x a week IM and am thinking of different ways to make the B 12 last longer. One thing I can try is hydroxo, but I have to run it by my Naturopathic doctor to get an RX and also see if the compounding pharmacy here in Portland Oregon can make it up.

The other thing is to do SC to see if it lasts longer, or a combination of SC and IM. I have lots of extra padding myself! so it shouldn't be a problem.

So, with this new batch of B12 you have, you would only inject .10mls to equal 1 mg? That really makes it hard to cut down on the dosage amount!

Thanks again for your useful and edifying info! Good luck with your new dosage.

nancy xx

[LtAngua52]

I've been self injecting for two months now, methylcobalamin. I thought I was injecting into the muscle, but discovered on here that I was using needles that were too short, so it was sub cut really. I bought the new longer needles and tried, but the needle hit my muscle which just 'threw' it out as it contracted. I obviously did it wrong but it was such a horrible feeling I've not tried it again. Today I had my first hydroxocobalamin injection from my GP into the muscle, I didn't have that same reaction, but it did hurt a little. I'm with you, don't think I could do IM myself, and I had viewed instructions on you tube. Many people on here do it successfully though, and I hope you can join them. Once I return to self injecting it will be sub cut for me!

[Leilanilea]

Hi,

The multi-injection bottles of cyanocobalamin from Cytek, which I use, are labeled for sub-q or intramuscular injection. I inject IM in mid-anterior thigh, using a 1-inch needle. I "pinch up" the area of muscle I'll be injecting to be sure I don't hit bone (sorry if that caused a bit of teeth grating😁."

Your weight and amount of muscle both need to be considered. If a person is overweight and/or has large musculature a 1-inch long needle may go only into the subcutaneous tissue; whereas, a very thin person may find that they can inject into the muscle with a 1/2-inch needle.

Sometimes the needle gauge is confusing to people starting out. The gauge is inversely proportionate to the number, so a 25-ga needle is bigger around than a 27-ga.

A 25-ga is what I use and injections seldom hurt. Technique does make a difference. Hold the prepared syringe as though holding a dart, then quickly "dart" it in.

Best,

Linda

[Gambit62 Administrator]

As above - sub-q and intramuscular are alternatives. IM is favoured because it gets more into your system faster but I think the jury is actually out on whether IM lasts longer than sub-q.

I do sub-q and generally feel I respond better to it than the IM shots I go back to the GP for to keep it on my records.

If sub-q works for you then stick with it

[Grifter]

Thanks for all the replies they're very helpful. Those of you doing IM you're very brave! I know my husband would be happy to do it for me (!!) but don't think I can do it myself! I'll take all the good advice and try different amounts/frequencies to see what's best.

I've posted a help message on fb to ask friends and family to bring me b12 back from their various holidays so I'll see what I get 😊

[Kapat1]

Hi . I did my first IM injection yesterday into the deltoid muscle and it didn't hurt one bit!!!! For years I've been going to my surgery to have my painful 3 monthly jabs , (the nurses are not very good apart from one Angel so I always try to book an appointment with her) .I found it useful to look in the mirror x marks the spot and just go for it . Not a problem .

[ndodge in reply to Kapat1]

Congratulations! You are so brave! I have my husband give me injections because I haven't worked up to giving them to myself.

So, hats off to you, Kapat1!