Mercy Killing in Europe

Hello

Yesterday there was a very disturbing report on Belgium, regards mercy killing that is, it seems going to be passed into law, that will deal with children.

Now their Government is wanting to pass a Law that will allow above to parents who cannot cope in their lives with a disabled child, for example Alzhiemers, autism and other associated problems, this will it seems be an extension to mercy killings in adults.

This also seems that a young person can request the same for themselves. Many reports seem to be taking this a little further allowing disabled citizens with chronic disability to be given the jab of no return, Thus those with chronic disability will be put too sleep.

My reason for bringing this up is in the UK, this is now undertaken under the Liverpool initiative, think that is right. Here water and food are withdrawn. when death is near.at hand

this can cause great distress when it is applied, or they see patients over with overdoses of opiates with the patient is in pain. This happens now and is mercy killing in all but name.

This I seem to understand the father of the queen was helped over, I think

Many it seems are associating it with the final solution in WW2.regards Hitler etc

Personally I am not saying that this is the case, although it makes you think.

Now I wonder, what will happen here, will they say, well you have had x number of years on pensions, sickness or whatever. the government thinks fit and your time is up .

Well you are now becoming infirm, we cannot keep paying for the medications BY BY. or that child is a drain on society it has problems with Autism, get the kit out.. All of this seems to go against all that the NHS stands for, also an uncaring society.showing no understanding and pity, all is seems to point to society, that looks on mercy killing as an easy way out

Sorry I feel a little perturbed regarding this. Could we be those who receive these injections, because society only wants those who are fit

I am sorry to bring this up, we could in the future be looking at the bottom line, death is easy society wills it

Sorry to bring this up as I am interested, in what society will be in the future

BOB

[stampede187]

Yes it is cause for alarm, however, I can never see this being allowed in the UK. How could the government justify this when being so rigid in their laws on euthanasia for example?

On the other hand, you mentioned the NHS's current 'pathway to death' as it is called..... indeed also controvertial. It does get you thinking I agree, and having a son with autism it is extremely concerning.

[missrat]

It is sad that the "Liverpool Care Pathway", which was devised to bring relief to people in extreme suffering, has become something to be abused. Something very similar was implemented for Mum and was a real blessing - but she was in a wonderful unit. The decision to implement it was made between the Chief Physician, Head of Nursing, my mother and myself, with the options explained. When she wasn't drinking, she had 'old-style' regular mouth care, and in the hospital she had spiritual care. Pain relief and sedation was reviewed daily. THAT is the LCP as intended!

It can and should never be imposed on a non-consenting patient - unless they are unconscious and genuinely terminally ill. I have seen it applied to a newborn who would never regain consciousness but this, again, was by the sad decision of the medical staff and family, not to save costs, but to prevent suffering.

There is so much scope for abuse, and I feel that any actions must be taken by agreement with the full involvement of the patient, the family and medical staff - and reviewed daily.

[Hidden in reply to missrat]

Hello

We had the above pathway introduced to my aunt who was suffering Alzhiemers and I was responsible for Liverpool Pathway instigation, via doctor, etc. Sadly she had no family and relations did not want to know,She died twenty four hours on the nail, and it was a relief when she departed this life, there was no chance of recovery and there was nothing to live for it was a privilege to look after her in a restricted way.

One thing that worries me is if this sort of thing is brought in for the wrong reasons that I mentioned earlier It can be instigated far to easy and for the wrong reasons

All the best

BOB

[Calceolaria]

It's called Care of the Dying Pathway and I think it is very compassionate in the circumstances which are properly assessed and where procedures are followed correctly.

I do think though that the other matter Bob touched on is very concerning- where older people are being demonised for having pensions or their own homes or whatever and are suddenly being held responsible for successive government messes. Young people are being encouraged to resent older people and its dangerous.

[Bananas5 in reply to Calceolaria]

sadly it isn't just older people being accused. Disabled people are labelled as cheats and scroungers. The poor are responsible for the mess of the bankers.

All those harde working tax payers are paying for us. Pure propaganda by this coalition to delete the word #disabled' from the English language and those who are in most need.

Pat x

[allowishis21]

I strongly disagree that the liverpool care pathway is "mercy killing by any other name. The liverpool care pathway in the most basic terms is a set of basic rules which should be followed when a person is at end of life. The LCP was developed to ensure that the dying patient wherever they are recieiving care are all accessing good care. The pathway neither lengthens nor hastens the end of a persons life. I find it really concerning that the uk media has bombarded us with sensationalised and wrong information. I see the LCP used every day successfully..My patients are regularly assessed for uncontrolled symptoms and never just given medication to quicken the process, the persons loved ones are involved and communicated with throughout and yes food and drink may not be given but this is likely as a result of the patient no longer being able to tolerate.

As for Belgium, the senate is debating amendment to a bill. Yes, children may be involved but this will only occur with medical opinion (possibly 2 opinions) and the parents. Social stress is also not a recognised reason for euthanasia. Bob you also talk of those with disabilities possibly accessing this service but it must be noted that most countries offering euthanasia have a delay period between request and completion, stipulate psychiatric assessment and at the end of the day it is a person choice what they can and are able to live with. I would like to see honest reporting of facts and examples e.g. parts of usa provides prescriptions last year 75% of those prescrptions were never filled nor used to complete euthasaia. An open and honest discussion is whats necessary.

[Kat3]

Yes, I think an open and honest discussion would be really helpful, in this case. I can't imagine it would ever happen that governments could decide that a person isn't useful in society because of their disability/age/etc and give the go-ahead to end a person's life. That is the stuff of science fiction – and we don't live in a totalitarian state (at least not yet These decision are made by the patient themselves (if possible), their family and the medical profession. Even if family members wanted their relative to die (for example, to get inheritence) the medical team would not allow for this – from their perspective, it is only about ending intolerable suffering and if there is no chance of future quality of life. There are many checks in place and I think if euthanasia were properly introduced in this country, that would be even more so. As someone who suffers pain daily and don't know when or if this will end, I would be much happier if I knew we had this option over here – in case it ever comes to that. The Dignitas clinic (in Switzerland?) makes potential clients wait at least a year before agreeing to end someone's life – so no one can make a rash decision – they also have to be examined by a doctor, to determine if their situation is as bad as they say it is, and if their life has a margin for improvement. It's a difficult subject, but one I feel needs to be discussed more in this country.