One study shows rheumatic patients on hcq had less chance of severe covid than patients on other disease modifying drugs.
thelancet.com/journals/lanr...
Another study showed that patient mortality on hcq was 13 percent compared to 20 percent on hcq with a zpack, 22 percent on zpack alone and 26 percent with neither . I commented early that cardiologist issues may have been due to the zpack for it carries black label for arythmia side effects.
Interesting, It has been so politicized and needs to be scientific,
The first link is only observational but the second link out of michigan, where my favorite aps raising star, Jason Knight, practices is triple sided with control. I think it still needs peer review.
I can see why Jason Knight is your hero. My current star neurosurgeon was Ann Arbor and Johns Hopkins trained. I am hoping to find a neurologist to whom he can refer me. First time I have had a really brainy doctor. I have undergrad and graduate degrees from U of M and am partial. APS isn't my problem, crippling neuropathy and a crumbling spine are. We are looking for enlightened research drs with clinical chops...
The first is observational the second is triple sided with control but because of the need of expedited research it was not double blinded I believe but well run and shows significant survival improvement in hcq arm.
The recent study in Lancet seems to be a farce. Many patients on HCQ received steroids and had lower qSOFA scores indicating less disease severity. They also received more tocilizumab, an IL6 inhibitor to reduce inflammation.
This study came out of Henry Ford hospital which Trump just praised not but a month ago. Said Henry Ford comes from a strong bloodline or something like that. I think the study was pushed out to divide doctors in the US and to make Trump look better since he pushed HCQ so hard. He’s quite divisive and manipulative. We can’t believe our scientists or journalists at the moment.
This whole back and forth debacle just detracts from the real fact that the drug should have never been studied to begin with. France won’t allow HCQ to be used for COVID at all and the guy who started this whole idea, Raoult, is being charged with fraud.
IMO steroids are what work based on data. It’s not surprising. Solumedrol is the aspirin of the ICU. Inflammation, sepsis, autoimmune... it crushes most things.
I think hcq might actually be protective against severe disease in a similar way as statins might be helpful by protecting endothelial health.
Gotta be honest. I don’t think it works at all. I think it increases chances of fatal arrhythmia in the sickest patients because they are already tachycardic and at high risk of CV dysfunction with metabolic disarray.
It takes weeks to months for HCQ to build up in the bloodstream to any detectable level and it doesn’t work to quell the immune system in any meaningful way for months.
French scientist who started all of this hoopla, Raoult, is being charged with fraud. France won’t even allow HCQ use for COVID anymore.
I just don’t think it works at all and causes more harm than good.
I meant why it was protective in rheumie patients already on it. From the first link I posted not as a treatment. But I do think it helps control many of the risk factors leading to severe complications in covid patients. It improves antibodies, lowers inflamation, thins blood and improves endothelial health upon chronic use thereby lowering a person's risk of severe covid complications . But no it is a cumulative result.
Oh yes. I agree 100%. A controlled patient is at much lower risk and we often forget it also inhibits platelets. Very good points!
Great news Rorah, it was a peer reviewed study published this week done out of Henry Ford. It was done retrospectively by ID Drs and the conclusions were great news. Many of us with SLE knew what the results would be because it was being given by many ID Drs here with fantastic results. Too bad they had to politicize the drug or many many more lives could have been saved. Dr Wallace the Guru of SLE here kept telling them there were no cardiac side effects as he has prescribed to thousands of SLE pts and has never done an EKG on them because of the drug. They were conflating HCQ with Azythromycin side effects and there is a cardiac black box warning on that drug. Stay tuned for more good news soon, the study on prophylaxis will be out and we already know the outcome. Many physicians are using it themselves as well as their staff to prevent the disease with success. My husband and myself have been in the medical field for 40 years each. I knew of the antiviral properties because he worked ICU and would come home with some terrible viruses and after starting HCQ 8 years ago I have not caught anything. Take care. Thanks for keeping everyone informed.
We are the SCIENTIFIC Research - many Lupus patients having been using it for years to keep our bodies from attacking itself just like Covid19 does to its patients.
Also, People are put on it before their trips to Africa as a preventative to Malaria.
We don’t have major problems (possibility of eye toxicity after years of usage, so yearly eye exams required) .
I don’t know any Lupus patients that were warned of “heart problems” before they were put on the drug at the “proper” dosage for their Ideal Body Weight.
Of course, it will not help if someone has gotten to the point of being hospitalized- it would not help us either at that point if we had not been using it as a PREVENTATIVE to further organ damage as lupus turns our body’s immune systems ‘on’ to attack our various organs.
So, if used early with Covid19 - it should help patients. If someone has heart problems, not a good idea.
Otherwise, it looks like it could help, and ‘we all use it daily’.
It is such a Low Cost with low side effects -
We are the proof that it ‘may be a safe 1st step’ when initially diagnosed.
20 years in a catatonic state cause SLE
Our Wendy39 participates in this broadcast on COVID, long term patients etc in Wales
New research showing effect of immune-suppressants on vaccine response
