Cryotherapy - Lymphedema

[BiomedEng]

I am the Head of Medical Engineering at a Northern NHS Trust - Lymphedema for personal and professional reasons is a subject close to my heart. I am evaluating new devices, very surprised at the controlled application of cold vapour in conjunction with compression, I am now involved with the development and research of Cryotherapy Technology. As a geek type, always concerned with the quality of machinery, rarely have I been so impressed with the quality and dedication of those delivering Lymphedema. If you would like to know more about the equipment I am conducting a series of lectures or can send info, I have found a great paper indicating this therapy and its use in given circumstances. [e-mail]

[ofcourse]

Hi

Thank you - please send a link to the

material you mention

Best wishes

'Ofcourse'

[BiomedEng in reply to ofcourse]

physiomed.ro/betatest2/file...

[Lynora]

Which Northern NHS Trust are you based at? Do you want patients or therapists to be involved with this research? Any indication of costs involved with both sessional use or purchase of equipment? Where will lectures be held? Are the BLS or MLDUK aware of this work?

[BiomedEng in reply to Lynora]

Hello I work at North Cumbria University Hospitals but am part of the Northern Training Consortium (Heal Science Network)and involved in initiatives via Health Education England enhancing the career development for Clinical Engineering. Part of our work is research and evaluation of new devices and this to be perfectly honest would not be so on my radar if it not for a family member suffering so from post node removal after 2 cancer events. I doubt the BLS or MLDUK aware of this work, I think we are just beginning but from what I can gather we are starting well behind the game, one of my consultant oncologist colleagues sees huge value in this cold vapour technology. Details of lectures and demonstration ate to be announced but I will keep you posted

Darren

[carol_pattinson in reply to BiomedEng]

I live in north Cumbria and very interested in more info please

[skybluepink in reply to BiomedEng]

Just checked out the portable therapy chamber BOC uk as preventative and or treatment .It can be delivered on site mainly at the moment to Rugby Clubs??!! Have suggested to MS therapyBristol [ don't have only similar conditions] may be worth looking into as also have an oxygen chamber??!!But suspect inflammation & infection maybe connected too.

PS.NB my findings re PAH & Reveal Device [ implanted holter monitor] & diuretics?!

[Jbrooks18]

Please send me information

Thank you

[Rosie1953]

I would also like the information.

[emmabeynon503]

Hi - I have lymphoedema in my legs as a result of cancer treatment - I would be so grateful for any information, research or recommendations you might have with regards to this new technology. Really exciting!

Many thanks

Emma

[AnneBury]

Have you contacted the Lymphoedema Support Network? lymphoedema.org.

[Dc33]

Please send me information, sounds very interesting.

[Hidden]

Thank you for posting this information! Always interested in any and all approaches to cure or improve our lymphedema.

[linda5151]

hi i live in northwest and would like more information about his treatment plz had lymph nodes removed along with major surgery for cancer please keep us all informed ty

[BiomedEng in reply to linda5151]

Think I might have done something wrong as a couple of my posts have disappeared .

We as clinical engineers figure like most things in medicine, there's no one thing, rarely a silver bullet cures all so combinational therapies and the equipment that may deliver or monitor them could mean a lot to those affected - this our work and as a freelance medical device designer I must have overstepped the moderator mark.

The intention is to investigate Cryotherapy after compression events synchronised to the heartbeat, by all accounts it can significantly reduce Lymphedema. We are using this therapy to perfuse the heart/brain, It might be better to talk about the science/technology rather than the equipment.

I'm not sure I should really be doing this anyway you know, I feel somewhat discouraged, If my wife finds out I'm for the high jump anyway, I don't know what she sees when she looks in the mirror but I still see the most beautiful girl I fell in love with so many years ago as a 17 year old Airman

So I will keep you updated in the technology we are developing rather than the equipment we are making available

I hope this helps

Darren

[Lynne-byn in reply to BiomedEng]

Thanks Darren I'm from Northern Ireland but definitely interested in anything that may help, Lynne

[belle1958 in reply to BiomedEng]

Have there been further developments in the years since this thread was started?

[AnneBury]

I think you should contact the Lymphoedema Support Network lymphoedema.org. They are interested in bona fida new developments for lymphoedema patients, have thousands of members, and also administer this particular health unlocked site. Contact them through their website lymphoedema.org.

[LymphSuppNetwork Partner LSN]

Hi biomed England

The rules of all of the forums on Healthunlocked specifically ban all forms of advertising so that is why a couple of your posts have dissappeared as they were viewed as a push to sell equipment direct to patients. We also have to be very clear that we do not expose individuals to products that are not yet clinically researched or evidenced and has not been through new technology appraisal and NICE. If you would like to contact us to discuss further please feel free.

[BiomedEng in reply to LymphSuppNetwork]

We have no interest at all in selling medical devices direct to patients and I couldn't agree more with you more regarding researched and evidenced technology, and what's more both the FDA and EU Medical Device Directive would not allow devices to be legally marked unless they had determined the device is substantially equivalent (for the indications for use stated in the submission enclosures) The Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) of the United Kingdom (UK) and the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) of the United States of America (US) are the regulatory authorities (collectively, the regulatory authorities) with responsibility in their respective countries for the authorisation, granting, renewal, variation, suspension, and revocation of licences, certificates, or other regulatory mechanisms relating to those medicinal products and medical devices for human use which are clinically investigated, marketed, supplied, manufactured, or assembled in the UK and US respectively. For instance the ****Therm Indications (a particular medical device technology) areTreatment of disorders associated with vascular or lymphatic insufficiency such as Chronic Venous Insufficiency (CVI), venous stasis ulcers, post-mastectomy edema and chronic lymphedema. * Reduction of edema associated with soft tissue injuries such as burns, postoperative edema, and ligament sprains. • Localized thermal therapy (hot or cold) for post traumatic and post surgical medical and/or surgical conditions.

[LymphSuppNetwork Partner LSN in reply to BiomedEng]

The challenge is, as you will appreciate from your personal experience, those living with any chronic condition are often desperate for any glimmer of hope and many individuals are not able to access the appropriate assessment of thier condition or the established treatment protocols, many are unaware of the cause of thier conditions or other co-morbidities meaning going along to corporate run information days whether as a direct sales pitch or not makes them a very vulnerable group who often, and perfectly understandably wish to ditch the compression! Safety liscensing does not prove efficacy or effectiveness - we at the LSN are constantly being telephoned by individuals wishing to know if various available machines advertised as helping with swelling/circulation etc can help with lymphoedema. We are also made aware of and participate in most research around innovations in lymphedema treatment and keep our members updated via our website, newsletter and conferences. As Chocolate-e-clare says below we would advise folk to discuss with their lymphoedema advisor/GP and keep to their planned treatment regimes including compression and excercise.

[BiomedEng in reply to LymphSuppNetwork]

I think you have hit the nail on the head there - and I must echo your advice to you members, keep up your practitioner recommended regimes - in my experience, they know best practice.

And to support you all I can say is that as Clinical Engineers we are involved in equipment evaluations and also research with regards to treatment - these of course are two entirely different things.

I will try to keep you up to date with both and differentiate between a medical device technical and function aspect and the evidenced effects on clinical therapy.

Also innovations, one of our NHS students has an idea that limb measurements can vary a fair amount, depending on user, measurement tape pressure and technique etc. Lets see if its possible to make a measuring device that gives accurate and repeatable readings, every time.

We are encouraged with what we see with EECP therapy, boots and Cryo after compression, there are real possibilities

The evaluation of devices and research into their benefits will continue

[LymphSuppNetwork Partner LSN in reply to BiomedEng]

Hi Biomed - there are sevearl different measuring technologies already in use or in development so would advise your student to research carefully before they progress thier ideas - shame to waste such enthusiasm and skill on reinventing the wheel as it were.

[Chocolate-e-clare]

I am skeptical. Cold vapour - if you apply excess cold to an area, there will be a resultant vasodilation after - there will be an impact on blood vessels, just as there could be with heating. Thank you for sharing your information, but as LSN has stated, this 'technology' and health benefits have not yet been researched thoroughly. There are lots of ideas out there on how to help people with lymphoedema. Guys, keep wearing your compression and exercising - these are still the best tools you have to fight this condition. Stay abreast of the new information, and find what works best for you. All the best!

[BiomedEng]

Have taken this on board and learnt much on vasoconstriction and consequent dilation - the benefits of Cryotherapy seem to manifest after compression and exercise - I think more research is needed and agree that compression and exercise are the best options universally

What about those who are unable to exercise? I will be taking advice and reporting back

[Lynne-byn]

I'm unable to do much exercise, I'm not over-weight but do walk with crutches. Have Reynolds syndrome & osteoporosis as well as ostepenia

[linda5151]

Please send me information

[BedfordBoy]

Hi, That sounds like fantastic news for all sufferers! I would be obliged if you'd send me details of the new research etc. Thanks.

Bedfordboy.

[e-mail]

[Jclinton]

Sounds wonderful ,but in the US there isn't really any help . You can travel if you're rich but I've never made enough money to leave the US .Basically a prisoner of our economic system

[Rokk53]

Hello. It’s been a while since your post. I’m curious about your progress and output of your findings. I would like to have an update and possible reports or conversations. I’m also up to having a conversation. Thank you-