A discussion on Soy products - Friend or Foe?

[Tibblington]

Knowing that some of our members are either vegetarian or vegan I thought that this article I have found and read, would be interesting to share. It may be especially pertinent following the recent headlines suggesting that we reduce our meat intake. Have a look and make your own judgement: healthscams.org.uk/soy-food...

[Hidden]

Hi Tibblington I think that this is interesting and soy does concern me as I can digest some soy products when dairy products are not so agreeable even though I'm not lactose intolerant.

My opinion is that with soy milk type products the hulled soy bean is under 10% of the total so not enough to cause me concern.

This about phytic acid is all plants have anti nutrients and have to be prepared to remove/minimise these anti nutrients, quinoa has saponins oats considered as super healthy contain phytic acid, lectins and avenin's.

So to me it's all about a balanced diet that works for us.

Jerry 😊

[Tibblington in reply to Hidden]

I take your point of view but we don't eat anything that has been processed to this degree or manufactured. We don't like the thought of chemicals being used on food. There is so much fresh food available that you really don't have to look at packets. In the market this morning I bought our week's supply of raw milk direct from the farmer. Raw milk keeps for eight days easily at 3°C and it contains so much more than when it has been pasteurised. I used to have a problem with milk but as soon as I changed to raw milk the problem no longer existed. That has to say something.

By the way phytic acid in natural food is no problem; in 100% wholemeal bread and wholemeal flour products for example. In fact we do actually need some so long as it is properly balanced in unprocessed food.

The late Surgeon Captain T.L. Cleave FRCP, ship's doctor on the King George V battleship famously said, "Don't tamper with food". He was nicknamed "the bran man" because he maintained the good health of the ship's company by having wheat bran added to the all of the food served on the ship.

[Matt2584 in reply to Tibblington]

I do not like the thought of our foods doused in chemicals either. It shouldn’t be this way and people shouldn’t have to look at the ingredients on foods and so on.

If things were left alone right from the very start then there wouldn’t be all these health problems going around today.

[alchemilla12 in reply to Tibblington]

Id have to disagree with your Captains use of wheat bran as this blocks the absorption of calcium, magnesium, iron, zinc, copper and vitamin B6.

[Tibblington in reply to alchemilla12]

I am sorry to say that it seems that your understanding of the function of the bran layers in wheat is erroneous. You seem to suggest that whole wheat, far from being a natural food, should be refined before consumption.

Examining the results of the milling process to make white flour it is seen that the following nutrients that were in the bran have been removed:

Approximately 78 % of the zinc, 72% of B6 and 90% of the magnesium.

Furthermore, the bran layers contain at least 70% of the B group vitamins, essential minerals and rare elements.

Please tell me where you found your information.

Hippocrates said “ And this I know, moreover, that to the human body it makes a great difference whether the bread be fine or coarse, of wheat with or without the hull (bran)….Whoever pays no attention to these things, or paying attention does not comprehend them, how can he understand the diseases which befall a man?”

[alchemilla12 in reply to Tibblington]

my understanding is not erroneous and my information is based on 30 years of studying nutrition and my job as a medical herbalist.

If you read my comment it is regarding bran NOt whole grain - no idea why you assumed I was advocating milling and removing the bran -can you tell me where I said thatplease?

when you isolate any substance from the whole you create problems.The whole is greater than the sum of its parts and so wheat bran will never be as good as the whole grain

[Matt2584]

Hi Tibby,

I’ve always felt very dodgy about soy when I first heard that nearly all soy bean in USA is GMO.

So whenever I saw soy in certain foods and drinks I would usually stay away from it.

Later, I then heard about fermented soy, which was healthier, and I’ve also heard about soy (GMO or not) can be bad for the thyroid.

But after reading your post on soy it seems to have cleared things up a lot more now :).

I think I shall still be avoiding soy (when I can) mainly cos it could be GMO or the fact that it could bugger up my thyroid in time or other areas of the body.

I have actually tried soy or soya milk once before and it tasted ok in a coffee but tasted rank on it’s own.

I was talking to a vegan friend of mine once about soy and I was saying how I a oid cos a lot of soy is GMO and she was telling me that cattle is fed with soybeans.

I think she was under the impression that cattle is fed with GMO soybeans and the meat people eat is likely lined with GMOs?

[Tibblington in reply to Matt2584]

If you buy organic raw milk you know that the cattle have only had grass or hay as a feed.

[Matt2584 in reply to Tibblington]

Yep, that’s right.

I normally buy organic oat milk.

I’m not quite a vegan but understand or am more interested in veganism and I don’t drink a lot of cow’s milk no more.

I was running low on oat milk once and had to resort to a bowl of cereal topped with cow’s milk. It tasted so bland and boring.

[Hidden in reply to Matt2584]

I buy organic GMO free soy custard and ice cream sometimes because my body doesn't like the diary equivalents so to me it's OK as it nutritious and it's all part of a balanced diet.

[Tibblington in reply to Matt2584]

Do you mean oat or goat. Oat milk is surely made by an industrial process.

[Matt2584 in reply to Tibblington]

Oat milk.

Don’t think an industrial process is really needed to make oat milk.

Grab a portion of oats. Soak them in water. Job done :).

[Tibblington in reply to Matt2584]

O.K. if that is the way it's done I'll willingly accept your suggestion. But, what I would now say is why not eat the oats soaked in water and made into porridge? In fact we often mill whole oats, soak the resulting oat meal in water over night and then cook it in the same water next morning. That's oat meal porridge as opposed to using rolled oats; I can recommend it. A coffee grinder will mill the whole oats very successfully.

Happy Christmas.

[Matt2584 in reply to Tibblington]

Thanks for the tip and I probably would do that or something similar with the oats if I were the one who makes the oat milk.

I mail order my milks online, now from a place called Planet Organic.

I just get the cartons of milk. What the manufacturers do with the oats I wouldn’t know.

I do believe though that the organic oat milks are originally made in Sweden too :).

My friend is now selling her own plant-based oat milk.

It is 100% ethical, organic, fair trade (where possible) and contains no additives such as rapeseed oil or vegetable oil.... why put oil in milk and think that is a good idea is beyond me.

And served in glass bottles too :).

I know some have said before the added oil is to help froth the milk to give a frothy coffee like at coffee shops but maybe this is false information or mislaying information?

Don’t know, just guessing.

[Cooper27 Administrator]

There are a lot of arguments and counter arguments out there about soya, and I'm afraid it's just another one if these areas where people don't know which argument to believe.

For me, I go with what my body tells me. Large quantities of soya make me quite ill (I have thyroid issues, and this might play a part in it). I can tolerate a dribble of soya sauce though, and I don't see a problem with eating it infrequently.

[Matt2584 in reply to Cooper27]

Information always seems to be thwarted with counter-info, like this soy argument, and it’s usually because of lobbyists or marketing.

Like what Arnold Schwarzenegger says in the Game Changers documentary; the meat industry tell you that meat is man’s food and that you need to eat meat to build muscle but you have got to understand that all that is marketing. Something along those lines anyhow.

They basically tell you blatant lies in order to sell their goods.

So some of the information we read regarding health is true while other info is another blatant lie.

Like if I said saturated fat is what the brain needs because that is what I have read and I believe that to be true cos I eat saturated fat and I am in good health, Li

[Matt2584 in reply to Matt2584]

... I am in good health, I like to think.

But somebody else could come at me and say the info I read is wrong and say saturated fat is bad.

That is when I would think that they have read up misinformation.

[Fran182716 Prediabetic]

It is a difficult choice, I’ve read about these concerns about soy products before, but I don’t eat meat by personal choice (not a health choice) and though I get the majority of my protein from eggs and dairy, soy products and quorn products (which are really the only processed foods I eat) have really helped with satiety and sustained energy for not too many calories, which has been very helpful in losing two stone and getting my blood sugars back into the healthy range. For me it’s about finding a balance that works without relying too much on any one source of protein.